Mr. GILLIS:

It is not my intention to occupy very much more time, Mr. Chairman. But I did want to tell that story, and I think it is the first time it has been told in that way in this house. We feel that it is the obligation of the government to see that the people who are trying to do something for themselves are protected, and with respect to the creation of monopolies we feel it is the obligation of the government to see that no special groups be given easy and fat franchises out of which to amass untold wealth at the expense of the people, whether these franchises have to do with the monopoly of money, minerals, waterfalls-or other forms of power. There are certain things that we must not pass over to individuals, and we feel that a national resource such as coal is one of those things. We believe it is the function of the government to see that every other business is properly conducted by charter from the government, and that it obeys the rules of the game and is not permitted to assume a monopoly of power as so many have already done. We remember the revelations of the price spreads committee, whose report showed that many things were wrong in Canada, rotten in fact; yet the findings of that committee have travelled to the silence and dust of the upper shelves and nothing has been

Unemployment Relief-Mr. Hlynka

done about them. We believe that it is the business of government in this country to equip the people with the instruments of freedom and then see to it that they have the full power to enjoy that freedom. We believe that it is the business of government in this country to make it possible for all to get enlightenment, without which no people can live in a free democracy, as is well exemplified by Germany at the present time. We want it clearly understood that it is not the possession of wealth and riches that we are objecting to so -much, but rather that wealth should enjoy freedom to control the economic processes of the country and stand in the way of the creation of other wealth by the people. They are the bottle neck through which new wealth must pass before it gets to the people.

As I said at the beginning of my remarks, we are looking to the governments of Canada as at present constituted to see to it that the development of the cooperative as it exists in the maritimes, where it is well away on the road to success, is protected against such monopolies as the coal company which I have attempted to describe here to-night. We believe it is the government's duty to see that the company is not in a position to cripple that movement by virtue of the fact that it holds economic power over the lives of the people in that particular section.

Mr. GILLIS:

I thought I made that clear. I am quoting from a brief drawn up by a

meeting of citizens in the town of Morien, Cape Breton, Nova Scotia. The brief was drawn up for the purpose of having it presented to the local government, and I was instructed to bring it here and, if possible, draw it to the attention of the Minister of Labour, through the medium of the House of Commons.

Mr. GILLIS:

It continues:

Some years ago a delegation of citizens in this town accompanied by members of parliament for this constituency and by the U.M.W. executive interviewed Mr. H. J. Kelly the general manager of the Dominion Steel-Coal Corporation in regard to future mining operations in this district and at that time Mr. Kelly stated that there was no question of the quality or the quantity of the coal in the Morien areas and that their corporation intended to open a colliery in Morien just as soon as the market for coal had increased enough to warrant it.

The time has now arrived when we believe we are justified in asking Mr. Kelly what they are going to do. With the war on the demand for coal has increased considerably and with two large collieries closing down within a short time, conditions should now warrant opening a new colliery in Morien.

The Dominion Steel-Coal Corporation receives large sums of money from the federal government in the form of bonuses for the coke they manufacture from coal and also receive assistance in the form of railway subventions to enable them to market more of their coal in western Ontario. This money is paid direct from the federal treasury and is raised by taxing all the people of Canada to which we contribute our per capita share and we take this opportunity to suggest to our representative in the federal parliament to put forth every effort he can to have these bonuses increased and the subventions extended so that there will be a larger market for coal from Nova Scotia.

In a very short time Dom. No. 11 colliery will be closed down and as there are about one hundred men from this district employed there, some provision will have to be made soon to find them employment or the local government and the municipality will be called on to provide them with relief.

If the Dominion Steel-Coal Corporation could be induced to start mining operations in this district in the near future, there would be no demand for relief and as an inducement to the corporation to make a start we would suggest that the government of Nova Scotia offer them exemption from the payment of royalties on all the coal produced in Morien for the next four years.

As a further inducement we suggest that the municipality set their assessment at about 50 per cent of their valuation for taxation purposes for the next four years on any new colliery they may start in this district.

From time to time we have heard that the corporation has plans to sink a shaft to the Gowrie seam near the shore, so as to mine the submarine areas of the Gowrie seam and also to win the Blockhouse seam by a cross-measures tunnel. There has been a proposal to sink a deep shaft to the Tracy seam in the Beaver dam section and also one to open a Slope mine on the north outcrop of the Gowrie seam. If any one of these proposals were to be carried out, it would meet with our entire approval and the company would receive the wholehearted cooperation of all those who reside in Morien.

The coal areas of this province are the property of all the people and should be worked for their benefit and the dead hand of a monopolistic corporation should not be allowed to cast a blighting shadow over this town of ours.

If we believe the democratic principle that human rights come before property right we then have every justification in appealing to our representatives in parliament and our leader ill the united mine workers to put forth every effort to have a new mine opened in this district.

This is signed by a citizens' committee.

I should like to draw to the attention of the minister another brief presented in the town of Glace Bay, where this No. 11 mine is threatened with closing. At the present time it is being gradually closed.

Mr. GILLIS:

Mr. Chairman, my conception of the resolution before the committee, and particularly the first part of it, was that it dealt with unemployment. It would appear that the Department of Labour is asking for an appropriation of money for the alleviation of unemployment, and in order that the minister may fully understand the requirements af the situation I suggest that one of the first things he should know is the unemployment situation as it exists in the field.

I have read many reports on unemployment as it affects my own constituency, but in those reports I did not recognize the situation as I knew it. I did not recognize the situation from the report which had been drawn up by someone else. What I am endeavouring to do is to tell the Minister of Labour the story of labour when considered from the viewpoint of potential unemployment. Mines are being closed and the situation is growing worse. I should like to tell my story as I see it myself.

I want to draw this brief to the attention of the Department of Labour. For the past seven or eight years different ministers of the provincial government have done everything humanly possible to cure this situation. I do not say this with any political malice, but I believe absolutely that at the present time the Nova Scotia government is the British Empire Steel Corporation, especially as far as coal is concerned. That has been our experience. Not so long ago a mine in Thorbum, Nova Scotia, was to be closed. This meant that many men would be thrown on to the scrap-heap. The general manager of the Dominion Iron and Steel Company, Mr. H. J. Kelly, sat in with a delegation of citizens from that town. The head of the citizens' delegation asked Mr. Kelly if there was anything the provincial government could do to develop a mine in that area. I based my previous statement that as far as coal is concerned this company directs the provincial government upon what Mr. Kelly said to that committee. His answer was that as far as the government was concerned they had done everything they could, but the company had said there would be no new mine opened in that area.

The particular brief which I have before me emanates from a citizens' committee which was formed in Glace Bay. This was not drawn up by members of a union or by

workers alone. This committee was headed by Reverend Father McKinnon, a Roman Catholic priest. The Reverend Mr. Crew, an Anglican clergyman, was also a member. The Reverend W. T. Mercer, another clergyman, was a member. This committee represented a more or less united front as far as religion is concerned. There are approximately 900 men employed in this particular mine, and they have learned from their union that the mine will be totally closed down within eighteen months. There are many schools and churches in this locality, and the working people have a considerable investment in their community. Should this mine be closed down, it will be nothing less than a financial bombshell as far as the town of Glace Bay is concerned, because that town receives considerable revenue by way of taxation. The provincial minister of mines and his deputy came to Glace Bay and met the members of this committee. I was present at the sitting of the committee, and we went over the plans of the coal company and considered what prospects and possibilities there were to continue the operations of this particular colliery. We could receive no assurance that operations would be continued. I was then asked to bring up the matter before this house and draw it to the attention of the Minister of Labour. This brief is headed "Introductory brief " and reads:

This committee which is gathered here was selected at a large and representative citizens' meeting held in the legion hall, Passehendaele, Glace Bay, on the evening of April 8, 1940. The meeting was held as a result of the existing conditions in No. 11 colliery as affecting that community for the purpose of endeavouring to find some method to alleviate those conditions.

In the report of the royal commission respecting the coal mines of Nova Scotia which was made in 1932 (commonly called the Duncan report) certain definite proposals are recommended for the reallocation of coal areas and concentrations of the output of coal mines. As a result of the recommendations contained in the Duncan report and apparently with the approval of the government of Nova Scotia a situation has arisen in the No. 11 colliery which has become very acute. Present indications are that this mine will be totally abandoned in approximately eighteen months. A large percentage of the men employed in this colliery are so affected at the present time that no work is available for them and transfers to other collieries are a common occurrence.

We submit that the practice of transferring these men to other collieries operated by the Dominion Coal Company will not provide a practical solution to this problem. Twenty-two men who were previously employed in No. 11 colliery have been transferred to No. 4 colliery. No. 4 colliery is completely filled up at the present time, and there are no places available for any -more men. There is no development work being carried on in this mine but future operations will consist only of pillar work.

Unemployment Relief-Mr. Gillis

By way of explanation I would say that pillar work is done only when a mine is gradually folding up. This work is done only when it is considered a mine will eventually close. The brief continues:

Several men have also been transferred to No. 24 colliery. On April 10th, 13 pairs of men were without places in No. 24 colliery and another section in this mine is due to close in about two weeks which will displace another 10 pairs of men. In No. 2 colliery there are at the present time approximately 40 pairs of men without places and eighty per cent of the work in No. 2 colliery is pillar work. No. 1-B colliery is overcrowded at the present time ' due to the fact that a large number of men formerly employed in the reserve collieries have become transferred to this mine. There are now 40 pairs of men employed on each shift in No. 20 colliery and the company does not propose to employ any more men in that mine for the present. As No. 20 colliery is developed it will be used to take care of men who are displaced in No. 2 colliery.

Taking into consideration the conditions which exist in all these mines in the Glace Bay district, it can be clearly seen that the problem of providing employment for miners who are displaced in No. 11 colliery will not be solved by transferring these men to other collieries. There are at the present time approximately 800 men employed in No. 11 colliery, the great majority of whom live in the Passchendaele district. These men, together with their families and other residents of the district, make a total of approximately 3,000 persons who depend directly for their livelihood on the continued operation of No. 11 colliery. There are also many houses, halls, churches, schools and business establishments in this district which would in time be rendered useless if this mine were allowed to close without any adjustment being made. In addition to this the town of Glace Bay has in recent years carried on new development work in this district by providing the comunity with new sewer and water facilities.

The additional burden which would be placed upon the town of Glace Bay through unemployment caused by the gradual closing of No. 11 colliery would be one which the town is in no position to bear, and it would be impossible for the town to adequately cope with such a problem. We feel that such a situation should not be allowed to arise without a thorough investigation being made by those with the authority to make such an investigation into the possibilities of a continuation in operation of No. 11 colliery and also the possibility of the opening of a new coal mine in the same district.

We, therefore, respectively ask that an engineer with governmental authority conduct a thorough investigation into the conditions which exist in No. 11 colliery for the purpose of finding out what amount of coal is available for extraction in accordance with the terms of the leases granted to the Dominion Coal Company. If, as a result of this inquiry, it is discovered that the colliery will be worked out in a short time and closed down, we ask that every avenue possible be explored with the view to the opening of a new mine in the Passchendaele district.

The provincial minister of mines and his deputy are cooperating with the miners one

hundred per cent in an effort to find a solution to this problem. The leases held by the coal company are such that by the carrying on of certain operations these leases remain in force even though a mine may not be working. Therefore the company is in a position to hold the leases. The provincial government does not seem to have sufficient authority, or at least has not had up to date, to bring about a solution of this problem. Coal will probably be required in Europe. Press dispatches rep>ort that France is in a bad way as far as coal is concerned. Something should be done to develop those coal areas in Nova Scotia which are not being operated by the coal company at the present time.

Mr. GILLIS:

I rise at this time, not for the purpose of retarding the matter which is before the house, but to get some information on questions which appear to be bothering some of the men who are in uniform. I know that one of the essential things if we are to have a proper prosecution of the war is to satisfy the expeditionary force. The men who are going to do the fighting must be assured that they have something to fight for and that the government are paying strict attention to their dependents.

The first matter in which I am interested is set out in a letter which I received to-day from a boy from my own constituency who is now in England. He says that there is considerable criticism within the ranks in England at the present time because, he says, they are paid on a fixed rate of exchange; that is, the pound at the present time is valued at $4.47, and on every $5 they receive in wages they are losing 53 cents. The government should give some recognition to that complaint.

Another matter of which he complains is the differential that exists in the dependents' allowances, to the prejudice of the mother as against the wife. That matter has been raised here, but as far as I am aware, no satisfactory answer has been given.

There is another matter about which considerable complaint exists, and I should like some information on it. According to press reports it is the intention of the government to grant two weeks' leave with subsistence allowance to all members of the Canadian active service force in Canada after they have completed six months' training. According to my information that has not been done. It is reported that some have had leave, but that no subsistence allowance was granted. Many others have not had the furlough. What is the intention of the department of the Minister of National Defence with respect to this matter?

With regard to another matter I have had some trouble prior to coming here, and I know it has occasioned some correspondence with the Department of Pensions and National Health. It is probably a little unusual; nevertheless it exists. What is the regulation of the minister's department in respect of the following category: a married man with a wife and dependants, who was parted before enlistment, but who, in accordance with the court decision, was compelled to support his wife and child before enlistment, neglects to make provision for them? His wrife has presented her marriage certificate and a copy of the court order granting her support. This support had been taken from her by virtue of her husband's enlistment, he having failed

to register at that time. Have there been any complaints of that kind? If so, what is the ruling in such cases?

These are several matters that are pertinent to the welfare of the men in uniform, and in my opinion, if we are to have a proper prosecution of the war, the men who are to do the fighting must be absolutely satisfied that we at home are taking care of all those matters which, however much we may be inclined to regard them as minor details, are nevertheless of major importance to them.