November 30, 1979

LIB

Joseph Roger Rémi Bujold

Liberal

Mr. Remi Bujold (Bonaventure-Iles-de-la-Madeleine):

Mr. Speaker, my question is also directed to the Minister of Fisheries and Oceans. Coming back to the statement he made yesterday about compensation for salmon fishermen, 1 would like to point out to the minister that it is extremely important for most of our fishermen because it is, indeed, the only way they can make their living. Can the minister tell us whether he will soon announce his decision on this matter, because of the uncertainty that is being created for fishermen? Further, can he ensure that before he takes his decision he will consult with the fishermen involved? And in case he decides to terminate this compensation program, what will happen to the licences granted to these fishermen?

Topic:   ORAL QUESTION PERIOD
Subtopic:   INQUIRY WHETHER GOVERNMENT WILL SOON ANNOUNCE DECISION ON COMPENSATION FOR SALMON FISHERMEN
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PC

James Aloysius McGrath (Minister of Fisheries and Oceans)

Progressive Conservative

Hon. James A. McGrath (Minister of Fisheries and Oceans):

As the hon. gentleman probably knows, the decision as to compensation was taken last year. The compensation program was put in place in 1972 for a five-year period. It was extended to six years, then to seven years, and later to eight years-we are now in the eighth year. Treasury Board announced last year that this was the final year. So a decision has already been made. It is not my decision; it was made last year by Treasury Board. With respect to the position of those who are currently receiving compensation, I am having discussions with my hon. friend from Saint John and we shall be dealing with cases on their individual merits. However, the hon. member might be interested to know that 6 per cent of those now receiving compensation are over 80 years of age and that almost 20 per cent are over 70 years of age.

Topic:   ORAL QUESTION PERIOD
Subtopic:   INQUIRY WHETHER GOVERNMENT WILL SOON ANNOUNCE DECISION ON COMPENSATION FOR SALMON FISHERMEN
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CATCH LIMITS-INQUIRY WHETHER MINISTER WILL CONSULT PROVINCES AND SPORTS FISHING ASSOCIATIONS

LIB

Joseph Roger Rémi Bujold

Liberal

Mr. Remi Bujold (Bonaventure-Iles-de-la-Madeleine):

Mr. Speaker, my supplementary question is directed to the Minister of Fisheries and Oceans and it deals with sports fishing. Since he said that he might set more restrictive limits to sports fishing catches in rivers, can he tell us if he has had consultations with the provincial governments and fishing associations on this subject and, if not, does he intend to follow the open policy of his government and consult them before taking a decision?

Oral Questions

Topic:   ORAL QUESTION PERIOD
Subtopic:   CATCH LIMITS-INQUIRY WHETHER MINISTER WILL CONSULT PROVINCES AND SPORTS FISHING ASSOCIATIONS
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PC

James Aloysius McGrath (Minister of Fisheries and Oceans)

Progressive Conservative

Hon. James A. McGrath (Minister of Fisheries and Oceans):

Mr. Speaker, the limits on the rivers will be established by zone management committees which will be put in place and which will work under the Salmon Board for the Atlantic provinces. It will probably vary from river to river. Some rivers might be closed next year, and there will be some rivers where there will be a maximum limit. This will vary from river to river and from zone to zone.

Topic:   ORAL QUESTION PERIOD
Subtopic:   CATCH LIMITS-INQUIRY WHETHER MINISTER WILL CONSULT PROVINCES AND SPORTS FISHING ASSOCIATIONS
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COMPENSATION PROGRAM FOR FISHERMEN

LIB

Roméo LeBlanc

Liberal

Hon. Romeo LeBlanc (Westmorland-Kent):

Mr. Speaker, I am sure the minister would not want to mislead the House. The fact is that last year Treasury Board officials indicated that compensation should not go on forever, but I never felt that that was a binding decision on the ministries of the government.

I should like to ask the minister a question. Since the removal of compensation is not met by a formula that would allow those who are not to continue receiving compensation and who had consistently been led to believe that some day they would return to a commercial fishery, and since the program does not seem to deal with this situation, has the minister done one of two things? Has he approached the provinces that are getting income from the sale of sports licences to see if they would buy out the commercial fishermen, including some of those to whom the minister referred as elderly-wUl they be dealt with fairly by the provinces-or will the minister put together some kind of program that will not leave those who thought they would return to a commercial fishery to find the door closed forever?

Topic:   ORAL QUESTION PERIOD
Subtopic:   COMPENSATION PROGRAM FOR FISHERMEN
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PC

James Aloysius McGrath (Minister of Fisheries and Oceans)

Progressive Conservative

Hon. James A. McGrath (Minister of Fisheries and Oceans):

Mr. Speaker, it is my advice that the Treasury Board indicated quite clearly that this was to be the last year of the compensation program, this current fiscal year. I stand by that. 1 am sure that if the hon. gentleman searched his own memory, he would find that that is, in fact, correct.

With regard to the compensation program and those who will no longer receive compensation after this fiscal year, it is my intention, after consultation with the members of Parliament who are involved, and more particularly with my friend, the hon. member for Saint John, since the Saint John River is one of the principal areas affected, to work out some kind of system whereby these fishermen can be involved in a lucrative fishery. But that would require examining each individual case of the some 400 cases that are currently receiving compensation and have been receiving it for the past eight years.

Topic:   ORAL QUESTION PERIOD
Subtopic:   COMPENSATION PROGRAM FOR FISHERMEN
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LIB

Roméo LeBlanc

Liberal

Mr. LeBlanc:

Mr. Speaker, I find it quite astonishing that the fishermen, especially those who have traditionally fished in Miramichi, would suddenly find that the hon. member for Saint John, as distinguished as he may be personally but whose knowledge of the fisheries is, I think, somewhat limited, should become the agent to defend the interests of the fishermen in

November 30, 1979

Oral Questions

the riding of the hon. member for Northumberland-Mirami-chi, who unhappily is not here to ask the question which I think he would like to ask were he here and not under medical care.

I cannot see how the minister can stand before us and tell us that the future of a large number of fishermen who have always thought that either they would be compensated for good, they would be bought out, or that they would return to a commercial fishery, should now be left to the vagaries and imagination of the hon. member for Saint John.

Topic:   ORAL QUESTION PERIOD
Subtopic:   COMPENSATION PROGRAM FOR FISHERMEN
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?

Some hon. Members:

Shame.

Topic:   ORAL QUESTION PERIOD
Subtopic:   COMPENSATION PROGRAM FOR FISHERMEN
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PC

James Aloysius McGrath (Minister of Fisheries and Oceans)

Progressive Conservative

Mr. McGrath:

If the hon. member for Northumberland-Miramichi had been in the House, I would have extended the same invitation to him that I extended to my colleague, the hon. member for Saint John, and obviously he will get that message. But may I say to my hon. friend that it would be our intention to try to re-establish those bona fide fishermen-and I emphasize, bona fide fishermen-who are still receiving compensation. That will be done after consultation.

I might say that the hon. member knows, perhaps better than anyone in the House, that the situation of the fishery in the Atlantic provinces has changed considerably since 1972 when it was a depressed fishery. It is now a very lucrative fishery, with tremendous potential, and there are certain areas where licensing can be extended. We intend to give these people who are receiving compensation and who are still able to fish every opportunity to get back into the fishery.

Topic:   ORAL QUESTION PERIOD
Subtopic:   COMPENSATION PROGRAM FOR FISHERMEN
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ENVIRONMENTAL AFFAIRS

PC

Geoffrey Douglas Scott

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Geoff Scott (Hamilton-Wentworth):

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of the Environment. It has to do with the expansion of Hamilton civil airport. In view of widespread reports that yet another possible impediment to expansion at Mount Hope exists because of a formal federal environmental study, can the minister inform the House whether he has discussed this possibility with the Minister of Transport or whether still another environmental study is needed at all?

Topic:   ORAL QUESTION PERIOD
Subtopic:   ENVIRONMENTAL AFFAIRS
Sub-subtopic:   HAMILTON CIVIC AIRPORT-ENVIRONMENTAL STUDY
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PC

John Allen Fraser (Minister of the Environment; Postmaster General)

Progressive Conservative

Hon. John A. Fraser (Postmaster General and Minister of the Environment):

The hon. member raises a matter of some importance to the people of Hamilton. A number of studies have been done, as the hon. member knows, with respect to the environmental implications of an expansion of the airport. I am now of the view that there is no need to go into any more formal environmental hearings, and my view is being communicated to the Minister of Transport.

Topic:   ORAL QUESTION PERIOD
Subtopic:   ENVIRONMENTAL AFFAIRS
Sub-subtopic:   HAMILTON CIVIC AIRPORT-ENVIRONMENTAL STUDY
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INVESTIGATION INTO ALLEGED EROSION OF MEDICARE PROGRAM-REMEDIAL ACTION

NDP

Robert Joseph Ogle

New Democratic Party

Mr. Bob Ogle (Saskatoon East):

Mr. Speaker, I have a question for the Minister of National Health and Welfare. Given the mounting public concern over the erosion of medicare, as evidenced by a recent "Save Medicare" petition signed by almost 300,000 Ontarians, and in view of the Alberta doctors' determination to defend extra billing despite a recent 15 per cent fee hike, and considering that Tory governments such as in New Brunswick are slashing their health care budgets while apparently diverting a portion of their federal health grants to other uses, can the minister please inform the House whether his department-not the Hall review-is investigating the serious threats confronting our national medicare system and, if it is, why can immediate remedial action not be taken?

Topic:   ORAL QUESTION PERIOD
Subtopic:   INVESTIGATION INTO ALLEGED EROSION OF MEDICARE PROGRAM-REMEDIAL ACTION
Permalink
PC

David Edward Crombie (Minister of National Health and Welfare)

Progressive Conservative

Hon. David Crombie (Minister of National Health and Welfare):

May I indicate to the hon. member, and indeed to others who are concerned with the question, that the Hall review which I requested in September will deal with the whole of the matter. Indeed, as I indicated in the House at that time, it is very important that all aspects of the principles of medicare, in terms of the guidelines which are required- making sure that those principles are not eroded-are dealt with properly. That is why 1 asked Mr. Justice Hall to take on that responsibility. That is a good way to go now. That report will be available in April, all members will be interested in its recommendations, and I will make my recommendations at that time.

Topic:   ORAL QUESTION PERIOD
Subtopic:   INVESTIGATION INTO ALLEGED EROSION OF MEDICARE PROGRAM-REMEDIAL ACTION
Permalink
NDP

Robert Joseph Ogle

New Democratic Party

Mr. Ogle:

Mr. Speaker, 1 have a supplementary question. I appreciate what the minister has said. Nevertheless, I believe that since, in some instances-such as this particular one- economic studies have proven conclusively that user charges such as the $10 per visit in out-patient fees in New Brunswick restrict-

Topic:   ORAL QUESTION PERIOD
Subtopic:   INVESTIGATION INTO ALLEGED EROSION OF MEDICARE PROGRAM-REMEDIAL ACTION
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LIB

James Alexander Jerome (Speaker of the House of Commons)

Liberal

Mr. Speaker:

Order, please. If the hon. member has a supplementary question, will he get to it.

Topic:   ORAL QUESTION PERIOD
Subtopic:   INVESTIGATION INTO ALLEGED EROSION OF MEDICARE PROGRAM-REMEDIAL ACTION
Permalink
NDP

Robert Joseph Ogle

New Democratic Party

Mr. Ogle:

I should like to ask the minister if he has done anything in particular about the $10 per visit out-patient fee in New Brunswick.

Topic:   ORAL QUESTION PERIOD
Subtopic:   INVESTIGATION INTO ALLEGED EROSION OF MEDICARE PROGRAM-REMEDIAL ACTION
Permalink

November 30, 1979