November 8, 1979

PC

Walter David Baker (Minister of National Revenue; President of the Privy Council; Leader of the Government in the House of Commons; Progressive Conservative Party House Leader)

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Baker (Nepean-Carleton):

Mr. Speaker, I thought 1 indicated clearly that I was taking the first course because I thought we could handle it, and I will discuss how with the hon. member and my hon. friend. I think we can take care of the legal requirement under the statute dealing with the reference to redistribution appropriately on Monday, so I am

1094

November 8, 1979

Business of the House

determined to call it first. As I said, I am anxious to get Bill C-10 through which, I understand, is third reading. We do have an atmosphere in the House which will require some co-operation among all members. I think I indicated that when I was answering the question of the hon. member for Drummond.

I want to express my thanks to the hon. member for Winnipeg North Centre for the offer he has made with regard to one day's debate on those four references-and I am prepared to consult as to how we divide the time-and also not more than two days on the freedom of information legislation. I think that is quite generous. The hon. member for Drummond is here, but his House leader is quite justifiably away today. We can discuss this matter. If that agreement is forthcoming from the official opposition, it would be very helpful and we can schedule these important matters to allow the committee and Parliament to work, which is in the best interests of members of this House.

Topic:   ORAL QUESTION PERIOD
Subtopic:   BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE
Sub-subtopic:   WEEKLY STATEMENT
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LIB

James Sydney Clark Fleming

Liberal

Mr. Fleming:

Mr. Speaker, a moment ago there was an exchange of words across the floor that was probably picked up by Hansard. It seemed to indicate that the Minister of Finance was saying we would have a budget next week. 1 do not know if that is a littly wry humour or if he has something we do not have officially on the record, that Hansard might indicate otherwise. I gather no budget next week. Is that the case?

Topic:   ORAL QUESTION PERIOD
Subtopic:   BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE
Sub-subtopic:   WEEKLY STATEMENT
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PC

John Carnell Crosbie (Minister of Finance)

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Crosbie:

I had better clear that up, Mr. Speaker. Although I am enthusiastic about getting a budget before the House, what I said was I will get into the budget next week.

Topic:   ORAL QUESTION PERIOD
Subtopic:   BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE
Sub-subtopic:   WEEKLY STATEMENT
Permalink
LIB

Eymard G. Corbin

Liberal

Mr. Corbin:

Mr. Speaker, my question is also to the government House leader. It concerns the work of this House but with special interest regarding private members' work. Is it the intention of the government House leader to refer to the Standing Committee on Procedure and Organization the subject matter of the motion I moved earlier today with regard to advancing the hour of the so-called late show, the adjournment debate, from ten o'clock to six o'clock, a time that would be much more convenient to the majority of members in this House? I think there is some predisposition in the minds of most members to do so.

Topic:   ORAL QUESTION PERIOD
Subtopic:   BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE
Sub-subtopic:   WEEKLY STATEMENT
Permalink
PC

Walter David Baker (Minister of National Revenue; President of the Privy Council; Leader of the Government in the House of Commons; Progressive Conservative Party House Leader)

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Baker (Nepean-Carleton):

Mr. Speaker, the hon. member was kind enough to speak to me beforehand. I indicated my support for the principle that he discussed. I sent him a note later. I felt at the time, on reflection, that perhaps it was an appropriate thing for the Standing Committee on Procedure and Organization to look at. I believe he will be very pleased with at least that aspect of the position paper that I intend to table in the House of Commons, with the idea of referring it to the Standing Committee on Procedure and Organization.

Topic:   ORAL QUESTION PERIOD
Subtopic:   BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE
Sub-subtopic:   WEEKLY STATEMENT
Permalink
PC

Gerald William Baldwin

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Baldwin:

Mr. Speaker, before the government House leader breathes a sigh of relief and subsides on this issue, I would like to make a suggestion and also ask him a question. It may be very productive, having in mind the events of the last

day or so, for the government House leader to proceed with all due speed to bring in a motion for Parliament to reform. It might be advantageous for this House and for the people of Canada.

I would like to ask him a question with respect to the motion I brought under Standing Order 43. I know the hon. gentleman is doing his very best to see that engrossed in the form of a motion the House can deal with. However, it would be idle to proceed with the freedom of information legislation until we have some opportunity to discuss that antiquated obscenity which masquerades as the law under the Official Secrets Act. I hope this motion can be brought in at the same time so that the committee will be seized with jurisdiction.

Topic:   ORAL QUESTION PERIOD
Subtopic:   BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE
Sub-subtopic:   WEEKLY STATEMENT
Permalink
PC

Walter David Baker (Minister of National Revenue; President of the Privy Council; Leader of the Government in the House of Commons; Progressive Conservative Party House Leader)

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Baker (Nepean-Carleton):

Mr. Speaker, I never cease to marvel at the qualities of the hon. member for Peace River for creating adjectives to describe things he does not like. He expressed sentiments which most of us share. I should report to the hon. member that in fact there is a motion prepared. It is my hope we can deal with it at the same time as the freedom of information legislation. I hope so. I could not put that down today because, quite frankly, I have not had time to consult with the hon. member for Peace River, but I have talked to him about the actual wording of the motion. He knows the intention of the government. Now that he has raised it, and I was going to raise it later, I want the House to know that we will probably be putting that motion on the order paper, I guess within a day or so, so that the House can see what we have in mind.

Topic:   ORAL QUESTION PERIOD
Subtopic:   BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE
Sub-subtopic:   WEEKLY STATEMENT
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POINT OF ORDER

NDP

Lorne Edmund Nystrom (Whip of the N.D.P.)

New Democratic Party

Mr. Lorne Nystrom (Yorkton-Melville):

Mr. Speaker, I rise on a point of order. In a way, I hesitate to do so. I want to say a word in support of something Your Honour said earlier today during question period when you were chastising- perhaps that is the word-the hon. member for Nipissing (Mr. Blais) about being loquacious and using a very long preamble.

It is a fact that when that is done in the House by members of Parliament, it cuts out members of the opposition from pursuing questions. In other words, it cuts off some members of the opposition. I know Your Honour has been more than fair to all members of the House. It just happened today that, because of lengthy preambles by members of the Liberal party, we were reduced to asking three questions instead of four.

This might be an appropriate time to say that we support any policing of preambles which Your Honour may see fit to do in the House. This would mean there is more opportunity in this House to participate. Perhaps a suggestion that could be made is that if some members are consistent in terms of having long preambles, their party should be penalized and not members of other parties.

November 8, 1979

Topic:   ORAL QUESTION PERIOD
Subtopic:   POINT OF ORDER
Sub-subtopic:   MR. NYSTROM-LENGTHY PREAMBLES TO QUESTIONS PUT DURING QUESTION PERIOD
Permalink
LIB

Thomas Lefebvre (Whip of the Liberal Party)

Liberal

Mr. Thomas H. Lefebvre (Pontiac-Gatineau-Labelle):

Mr. Speaker, I rise on the same point of order. 1 am very happy the hon. member has brought this to the attention of the House. 1 will undertake to speak to the hon. member for Nipissing (Mr. Blais) and other members of my party if the hon. gentleman who has just sat down will speak to the hon. member for Nickel Belt (Mr. Rodriguez), who probably takes up more time than any five members.

Topic:   ORAL QUESTION PERIOD
Subtopic:   POINT OF ORDER
Sub-subtopic:   MR. NYSTROM-LENGTHY PREAMBLES TO QUESTIONS PUT DURING QUESTION PERIOD
Permalink
?

An hon. Member:

Bionic mouth.

Topic:   ORAL QUESTION PERIOD
Subtopic:   POINT OF ORDER
Sub-subtopic:   MR. NYSTROM-LENGTHY PREAMBLES TO QUESTIONS PUT DURING QUESTION PERIOD
Permalink
NDP

John R. Rodriguez

New Democratic Party

Mr. John Rodriguez (Nickel Belt):

On the same point of order, Mr. Speaker, it may be that my ability in the French language, which is a second language for me, is not as fluent as some members to my right. I certainly do not engage in long preambles. I do not think the Chair has ever permitted those preambles. It may be that in debate, when we had points to make about the way those to my right conducted themselves when in government, something needed to be aired and we took the appropriate time permitted under the Standing Orders of this House to do so. The hon. member who previously spoke is so completely out of order that he should withdraw that remark.

Topic:   ORAL QUESTION PERIOD
Subtopic:   POINT OF ORDER
Sub-subtopic:   MR. NYSTROM-LENGTHY PREAMBLES TO QUESTIONS PUT DURING QUESTION PERIOD
Permalink
NDP

Ian Gardiner Waddell

New Democratic Party

Mr. Ian Waddell (Vancouver-Kingsway):

Mr. Speaker, I rise as a member who for only a few months has watched some of the members of the Liberal party asking questions. 1 believe the hon. member for Yorkton-Melville (Mr. Nystrom) should be paid heed to when he states that when they take up a lot of time, we suffer and not them. They should suffer. With respect, 1 say Your Honour should crack down on them.

Some of us, perhaps, have an excuse for being a little long winded and stuttering a little, since we are new in the House, but members sitting on the front bench over there have no excuse and Your Honour has done nothing about it. 1 think you should, because we are suffering from the effect of these long answers.

Topic:   ORAL QUESTION PERIOD
Subtopic:   POINT OF ORDER
Sub-subtopic:   MR. NYSTROM-LENGTHY PREAMBLES TO QUESTIONS PUT DURING QUESTION PERIOD
Permalink
LIB

James Alexander Jerome (Speaker of the House of Commons)

Liberal

Mr. Speaker:

The hon. member for Yorkton-Melville (Mr. Nystrom) said he hesitated even to raise this matter as a point of order. There are two considerations in play here all the time. One of them is an attempt to proportion participation in the question period, which has really been quite an exciting part of my responsibility in this Parliament, much more so than in the last. But trying to apportion it with mathematical precision does not always work. There will be some days when, if we tried to measure the participation of members by a mathematical formula, we would find that one party was slightly ahead of another. I have always been quite careful that if participation from the back benches of any party is prejudiced as a result of long-winded questions or answers from the front bench, that that prejudice stay in the same party as it originated in. The fact that I was not able to do this with extreme precision today can be laid to the lengthy answers which needed to be given. That is very difficult to assess. Sometimes questions can be asked very quickly but the answers are long, not because they are drawn out deliberately

Order Paper Questions

but because sometimes they have to be long. That is very difficult to judge.

I do not think we can try to argue on the floor exactly how this should be done with mathematical precision every day, but I certainly understand and appreciate the sentiments of hon. members who have expressed themselves so far. I see the hon. member for Bellechasse (Mr. Lambert) is seeking the floor. This is one matter, I am sure, they cannot blame on the Creditistes because they were not up today and they were not up yesterday. I am sure he wanted to make that point clear.

Topic:   ORAL QUESTION PERIOD
Subtopic:   POINT OF ORDER
Sub-subtopic:   MR. NYSTROM-LENGTHY PREAMBLES TO QUESTIONS PUT DURING QUESTION PERIOD
Permalink
LIB

Yvon Pinard

Liberal

Mr. Yvon Pinard (Drummond):

Mr. Speaker, hon. members of the New Democratic Party have undoubtedly got their message across, but we of the official opposition expect the same treatment that the official opposition in the last Parliament received.

Topic:   ORAL QUESTION PERIOD
Subtopic:   POINT OF ORDER
Sub-subtopic:   MR. NYSTROM-LENGTHY PREAMBLES TO QUESTIONS PUT DURING QUESTION PERIOD
Permalink

ROUTINE PROCEEDINGS


[ Translation]


QUESTIONS ON THE ORDER PAPER


(Questions answered orally are indicated by an asterisk.)


PC

David Kilgour (Parliamentary Secretary to the President of the Privy Council)

Progressive Conservative

Mr. David Kilgour (Parliamentary Secretary to President of the Privy Council):

Mr. Speaker, the following questions will be answered today: Nos. 143, 181, 201, 273, 290 and 392.

I ask, Mr. Speaker, that the remaining questions be allowed to stand.

Topic:   ROUTINE PROCEEDINGS
Subtopic:   QUESTIONS ON THE ORDER PAPER
Permalink

November 8, 1979