January 30, 1979

LIB

William Andres (Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of State (Multiculturalism))

Liberal

Mr. Andres:

In fact, the hon. member for Villeneuve (Mr. Caouette) felt it was too restrictive and not broad enough. Time and again we have heard that this bill is too encompassing, too broad and too vague. The opposition say that if it only asked one question, they would support it immediately. I do not understand that level of thinking. I see a question in this bill: the protection of the Canadian people is at stake. If members opposite do not understand that, it is because they are not familiar with the bill.

Referenda

This bill is very definitely aimed at the referendum that is supposed to be held in Quebec. The bill has an expiry date. It is under the complete control of this parliament. Where are the broad powers? Where is the question that hon. members opposite look for? Only parliament can initiate a referendum the result of which would be subject to the approval of parliament. If members opposite do not have faith and trust-

Topic:   GOVERNMENT ORDERS
Subtopic:   CANADA REFERENDUM ACT
Sub-subtopic:   MEASURE TO PROVIDE FOR HOLDING OF REFERENDUMS ON CONSTITUTION
Permalink
?

Donald Stovel Macdonald

Miss MacDonald:

In this government?

Topic:   GOVERNMENT ORDERS
Subtopic:   CANADA REFERENDUM ACT
Sub-subtopic:   MEASURE TO PROVIDE FOR HOLDING OF REFERENDUMS ON CONSTITUTION
Permalink
LIB

William Andres (Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of State (Multiculturalism))

Liberal

Mr. Andres:

I said in parliament. The bill will be under the complete control of this parliament. It is ironic that as we will be facing the electorate of this country-

Topic:   GOVERNMENT ORDERS
Subtopic:   CANADA REFERENDUM ACT
Sub-subtopic:   MEASURE TO PROVIDE FOR HOLDING OF REFERENDUMS ON CONSTITUTION
Permalink
PC

James McPhail Gillies

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Gillies:

Soon, I hope.

Topic:   GOVERNMENT ORDERS
Subtopic:   CANADA REFERENDUM ACT
Sub-subtopic:   MEASURE TO PROVIDE FOR HOLDING OF REFERENDUMS ON CONSTITUTION
Permalink
?

Donald Stovel Macdonald

Miss MacDonald:

That is the referendum they ran away from.

Topic:   GOVERNMENT ORDERS
Subtopic:   CANADA REFERENDUM ACT
Sub-subtopic:   MEASURE TO PROVIDE FOR HOLDING OF REFERENDUMS ON CONSTITUTION
Permalink
LIB

William Andres (Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of State (Multiculturalism))

Liberal

Mr. Andres:

Members opposite feel confident. However, I can understand why their confidence has been somewhat clouded in the last few weeks by the jolly running around of their glorious leader and the various views expressed by some of the new shining stars on the horizon.

Topic:   GOVERNMENT ORDERS
Subtopic:   CANADA REFERENDUM ACT
Sub-subtopic:   MEASURE TO PROVIDE FOR HOLDING OF REFERENDUMS ON CONSTITUTION
Permalink
LIB

Joseph Jacques Jean Chrétien (Minister of Finance)

Liberal

Mr. Chretien:

Tiny stars.

Topic:   GOVERNMENT ORDERS
Subtopic:   CANADA REFERENDUM ACT
Sub-subtopic:   MEASURE TO PROVIDE FOR HOLDING OF REFERENDUMS ON CONSTITUTION
Permalink
LIB

William Andres (Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of State (Multiculturalism))

Liberal

Mr. Andres:

I can understand why they have even lost faith in themselves. Consequently, they do not understand the true meaning of this bill and the protection that is included therein. The referendum is advisory. We are seeking advice from the Canadian people on a question as important as their own future. It complements the parliamentary system by providing an additional check. In no way does it withdraw the powers of parliament or the responsibility of parliamentarians.

Topic:   GOVERNMENT ORDERS
Subtopic:   CANADA REFERENDUM ACT
Sub-subtopic:   MEASURE TO PROVIDE FOR HOLDING OF REFERENDUMS ON CONSTITUTION
Permalink
PC

Howard Earl Johnston

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Johnston (Okanagan-Kootenay):

It sounds superfluous.

Topic:   GOVERNMENT ORDERS
Subtopic:   CANADA REFERENDUM ACT
Sub-subtopic:   MEASURE TO PROVIDE FOR HOLDING OF REFERENDUMS ON CONSTITUTION
Permalink
LIB

William Andres (Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of State (Multiculturalism))

Liberal

Mr. Andres:

In no way can this referendum be compared to the plebiscites of 1898 or 1942. In no way can it be compared to any question facing this nation because it talks about the future of this country.

It has been stated that referenda tend to be divisive. They are not; they are consultative. It is when people are not consulted that the division creeps in.

The issue involved in this bill concerns the roots of our nationhood. We are not afraid to go to the people to ask if they want to remain united. I am afraid the members of the opposition know the answers but are not responsible enough to face up to them. Sincere, honest citizens want this country to remain united and strong. It is only through this consultative process that we draw the people in and give them an opportunity to voice their opinions on national unity for the good of all Canadians. Canadians feel attached to this country. It is time they now be given a chance to voice their opinions. What will the referendum prove? It will be an affirmation from Canadians, a statement that above all else they wish to continue as Canadians from coast to coast, from north to south, in a

January 30, 1979

Referenda

country with ten provinces and two territories united under the banner of Canadianism.

Topic:   GOVERNMENT ORDERS
Subtopic:   CANADA REFERENDUM ACT
Sub-subtopic:   MEASURE TO PROVIDE FOR HOLDING OF REFERENDUMS ON CONSTITUTION
Permalink
PC

Henry Perrin Beatty

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Perrin Beatty (Wellington-Grey-Dufferin-Waterloo):

Mr. Speaker, my party is quite prepared to see this bill come to a vote this evening if the other parties are prepared to allow termination of the debate. If the other parties are prepared to terminate the debate tonight, I will be the last speaker for this party. I would indicate to the government and members of the other parties that, if it is decided that the debate will not end this evening, our members may well want to participate further in the debate.

Topic:   GOVERNMENT ORDERS
Subtopic:   CANADA REFERENDUM ACT
Sub-subtopic:   MEASURE TO PROVIDE FOR HOLDING OF REFERENDUMS ON CONSTITUTION
Permalink
NDP

Stanley Howard Knowles (N.D.P. House Leader)

New Democratic Party

Mr. Knowles (Winnipeg North Centre):

Mr. Speaker, the hon. member might permit me to say that, as far as today is concerned, we have only one more speaker, the hon. member for Broadview (Mr. Rae).

[ Translation]

Topic:   GOVERNMENT ORDERS
Subtopic:   CANADA REFERENDUM ACT
Sub-subtopic:   MEASURE TO PROVIDE FOR HOLDING OF REFERENDUMS ON CONSTITUTION
Permalink
LIB

Claude-André Lachance (Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada)

Liberal

Mr. Lachance:

I rise on a point of order, Mr. Speaker.

Topic:   GOVERNMENT ORDERS
Subtopic:   CANADA REFERENDUM ACT
Sub-subtopic:   MEASURE TO PROVIDE FOR HOLDING OF REFERENDUMS ON CONSTITUTION
Permalink
LIB

Gérald Laniel (Deputy Speaker and Chair of Committees of the Whole of the House of Commons)

Liberal

Mr. Deputy Speaker:

The hon. parliamentary secretary on a point of order.

Topic:   GOVERNMENT ORDERS
Subtopic:   CANADA REFERENDUM ACT
Sub-subtopic:   MEASURE TO PROVIDE FOR HOLDING OF REFERENDUMS ON CONSTITUTION
Permalink
LIB

Claude-André Lachance (Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada)

Liberal

Mr. Lachance:

Mr. Speaker, following the hon. member's remarks, I would like to say that on our side we are ready to vote as soon as the House is ready to do so.

Topic:   GOVERNMENT ORDERS
Subtopic:   CANADA REFERENDUM ACT
Sub-subtopic:   MEASURE TO PROVIDE FOR HOLDING OF REFERENDUMS ON CONSTITUTION
Permalink
PC

Henry Perrin Beatty

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Beatty:

Mr. Speaker, I am pleased that there is a growing consensus that the debate be brought to a termination. I repeat, our party is prepared to have the vote taken this evening. If the other parties would like a vote this evening, we are prepared to terminate our participation at second reading as soon as I complete my remarks. However, if the debate continues beyond this evening, there are members on this side who may well choose to participate.

As there are only two minutes remaining before five o'clock, I wonder whether I might call it five o'clock and carry on at eight o'clock?

Topic:   GOVERNMENT ORDERS
Subtopic:   CANADA REFERENDUM ACT
Sub-subtopic:   MEASURE TO PROVIDE FOR HOLDING OF REFERENDUMS ON CONSTITUTION
Permalink
LIB

Gérald Laniel (Deputy Speaker and Chair of Committees of the Whole of the House of Commons)

Liberal

Mr. Deputy Speaker:

Is it agreed that we call it five o'clock?

Topic:   GOVERNMENT ORDERS
Subtopic:   CANADA REFERENDUM ACT
Sub-subtopic:   MEASURE TO PROVIDE FOR HOLDING OF REFERENDUMS ON CONSTITUTION
Permalink
?

Some hon. Members:

Agreed.

Topic:   GOVERNMENT ORDERS
Subtopic:   CANADA REFERENDUM ACT
Sub-subtopic:   MEASURE TO PROVIDE FOR HOLDING OF REFERENDUMS ON CONSTITUTION
Permalink

PROCEEDINGS ON ADJOURNMENT MOTION

SUBJECT MATTER OF QUESTIONS TO BE DEBATED

January 30, 1979