March 19, 1968

LIB

Lucien Lamoureux (Speaker of the House of Commons)

Liberal

Mr. Speaker:

Order. The hon. member should confine his remarks to the motion which is before the house for consideration.

Topic:   COMMITTEES OF THE HOUSE
Subtopic:   CHANGES IN PERSONNEL OF STANDING COMMITTEES
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IND

Gilles Grégoire

Independent

Mr. Gregoire:

Very well, I shall not mention any name, and I will carry on with my quotation:

I notice in the Liberal old guard the same cynical stupidity; in the youth associations, I find tire same selfish docility, and in between-

This, Mr. Speaker, is the answer to the question which the Minister of Justice asked me.

-and in between, men of my generation who are trembling with anticipation because they had a glimpse of the painted face of power.

It is the painted face of power and honours which have made the Minister of Justice change his mind since 1963.

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Subtopic:   CHANGES IN PERSONNEL OF STANDING COMMITTEES
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LIB

Pierre Elliott Trudeau (President of the Privy Council; Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada)

Liberal

Mr. Trudeau:

Would the hon. member for Lapointe allow me another question?

Topic:   COMMITTEES OF THE HOUSE
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IND

Gilles Grégoire

Independent

Mr. Gregoire:

Certainly.

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LIB

Pierre Elliott Trudeau (President of the Privy Council; Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada)

Liberal

Mr. Trudeau:

Has the hon. member joined the independentist party when he thought it might come into power?

Topic:   COMMITTEES OF THE HOUSE
Subtopic:   CHANGES IN PERSONNEL OF STANDING COMMITTEES
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IND

Gilles Grégoire

Independent

Mr. Gregoire:

Mr. Speaker, if the Minister of Justice thinks that we shall never come into power, it is all to my credit, because I

DEBATES 7785

Personnel Changes in Standing Committees did not join that party to assume power, but rather to promote ideas.

Topic:   COMMITTEES OF THE HOUSE
Subtopic:   CHANGES IN PERSONNEL OF STANDING COMMITTEES
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?

Some hon. Members:

Oh, oh.

Topic:   COMMITTEES OF THE HOUSE
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IND

Gilles Grégoire

Independent

Mr. Gregoire:

Whereas in the same article, Mr. Speaker,-

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LIB

Joseph-Alphonse-Anaclet Habel

Liberal

Mr. Habel:

Long five freedom.

Topic:   COMMITTEES OF THE HOUSE
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IND

Gilles Grégoire

Independent

Mr. Gregoire:

Another sheep is bleating, Mr. Speaker. In the same article, the Minister of Justice said, and I quote:

But I have yet to trample down democracy. That is why, on April 8, I intend to vote for the New Democratic party.

Two years later, he was a Liberal party candidate. He is-

Topic:   COMMITTEES OF THE HOUSE
Subtopic:   CHANGES IN PERSONNEL OF STANDING COMMITTEES
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LIB

Lucien Lamoureux (Speaker of the House of Commons)

Liberal

Mr. Speaker:

Order. I remind the hon. member once again that he must confine himself to the motion before the house.

Topic:   COMMITTEES OF THE HOUSE
Subtopic:   CHANGES IN PERSONNEL OF STANDING COMMITTEES
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IND

Gilles Grégoire

Independent

Mr. Gregoire:

Mr. Speaker, I would simply like to discuss, and that is not out of order, the antidemocratic action we are taking now. It seems that in the Liberal party one must behave as if one belonged to a flock of little red lambs, if not, out! No more lollipops! No more candy!

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LIB

Albert Béchard (Parliamentary Secretary to the Secretary of State of Canada)

Liberal

Mr. Bechard:

Mr. Speaker, may I direct a question to the hon. member for Lapointe?

Topic:   COMMITTEES OF THE HOUSE
Subtopic:   CHANGES IN PERSONNEL OF STANDING COMMITTEES
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IND

Gilles Grégoire

Independent

Mr. Gregoire:

Yes, certainly.

Topic:   COMMITTEES OF THE HOUSE
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LIB

Albert Béchard (Parliamentary Secretary to the Secretary of State of Canada)

Liberal

Mr. Bechard:

Does the hon. member for Lapointe find that the Ralliement Creditiste took antidemocratic action when it threw him out a few years ago?

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IND

Gilles Grégoire

Independent

Mr. Gregoire:

Mr. Speaker, the hon. member knows not whereof he speaks for, and I refer him to the statement of my former colleagues, they did not throw me out, I left on my own, and we remained good friends. Perhaps we had differences of opinion, but they did not throw me out, and the hon. member for Roberval (Mr. Gauthier) can tell you so. I was not thrown out by the hon. member for Villeneuve (Mr. Caouette) nor by anyone else, I left of my own free will, and hon. members opposite know it.

[DOT] (2:50 p.m.)

Topic:   COMMITTEES OF THE HOUSE
Subtopic:   CHANGES IN PERSONNEL OF STANDING COMMITTEES
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?

Some hon. Members:

Yes, yes.

Topic:   COMMITTEES OF THE HOUSE
Subtopic:   CHANGES IN PERSONNEL OF STANDING COMMITTEES
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?

Some hon. Members:

Oh, oh.

Topic:   COMMITTEES OF THE HOUSE
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IND

Gilles Grégoire

Independent

Mr. Gregoire:

Mr. Speaker, when efforts are made to change a political party into a

March 19, 1968

Personnel Changes in Standing Committees flock of sheep by telling its members: You will all think the same way; if you refuse, you will no longer be allowed to sit on committees, you will be deprived of your lollipop, what happens then is exactly what the Minister of Justice pointed out in his article, and I quote:

But what we did not realize clearly enough is the degree of intellectual decay where that is finally leading us. But now Mr. Pearson and the Liberal party are opening our eyes suddenly.

That was the Minister of Justice talking about the Liberal party, two years before becoming a member of that party of "decay", that party which he called antidemocratic.

They want nobody to depart from the party line, or else, out. The Minister of Justice was condemning this partisanship which prevents an individual from thinking for himself.

Because the hon. member for York-Humber voted against taxes, he is thrown out. They do not want him to have his own ideas, and now, they want to keep him from sitting on committees.

Here is how the Minister of Justice condemned this situation, and I quote:

Thus, the political philosophy ot the Liberal party is very simple-

I would like Liberals to listen carefully to what the Minister of Justice thinks of the political philosophy of the Liberal party!

Say anything, think anything; or, better still, do not think at all; but bring us into power for we can provide the best government.

Therefore, if you are a Liberal, think anything you want or, better still, do not think at all. That is what the hon. Minister of Justice says. I will end by saying, of the Liberals, that they are:

All lousy, by God!

"All lousy" that is what the hon. Minister of Justice says of the Liberals, Mr. Speaker. When one of them asserts himself, as did the hon. member for York-Humber, he is thrown out. One would think the Liberal party only likes lousy members, as the hon. Minister of Justice called them. Mr. Speaker, you are an exception. I know that you have been a member of the Liberal party. I make an exception for you.

Topic:   COMMITTEES OF THE HOUSE
Subtopic:   CHANGES IN PERSONNEL OF STANDING COMMITTEES
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?

Some hon. Members:

Hear, hear.

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March 19, 1968