March 25, 1965

PC

Lawrence Elliott Kindt

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Kindt:

Mr. Speaker-

Topic:   CRIMINAL CODE
Subtopic:   AMENDMENT RESPECTING APPEAL IN HABEAS CORPUS PROCEEDINGS
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LIB

Herman Maxwell Batten (Deputy Chair of Committees of the Whole)

Liberal

The Acting Speaker (Mr. Batten):

Does the house give unanimous consent for the hon. member to make further remarks?

Topic:   CRIMINAL CODE
Subtopic:   AMENDMENT RESPECTING APPEAL IN HABEAS CORPUS PROCEEDINGS
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?

Some hon. Members:

Agreed.

Topic:   CRIMINAL CODE
Subtopic:   AMENDMENT RESPECTING APPEAL IN HABEAS CORPUS PROCEEDINGS
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PC

Lawrence Elliott Kindt

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Kindt:

I respect your ruling, Mr. Speaker, but since the Minister of Justice (Mr. Favreau) is not here I think there are certain matters concerning the bill which we should ask the parliamentary secretary to make clear. I should like to ask him a supplementary question. As a matter of fact, I have three I want to ask. The first is in connection with these 28 words. I want to know whether it is his thinking that these Latin words inserted in the bill, which most Englishmen and Frenchmen cannot read, although we have bilingualism in this house, in their context take the place of other words and properly explain the section to the man in the street who reads it. If they do, then what is the meaning of these Latin phrases in English and in French? Some of us might be in a different position from the man in the street, even though we have not taken law. At the same time, our laws, and above all the Criminal Code, are written so that the man in the street can understand them and does not have to hire a lawyer to get an interpretation.

Therefore, I say to the parliamentary secretary that before this bill is passed we must

Criminal Code

know what these words mean. Their meaning ought to be spelled out and made clear. This has not been done, and I am inclined to think that the parliamentary secretary himself does not know the meaning

Mr. Frank Howard (Skeenal: Mr. Speaker, one brief comment without trying to provoke any additional debate. I know that the sponsor of this particular bill is vitally interested in having it-

Topic:   CRIMINAL CODE
Subtopic:   AMENDMENT RESPECTING APPEAL IN HABEAS CORPUS PROCEEDINGS
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LIB

Herman Maxwell Batten (Deputy Chair of Committees of the Whole)

Liberal

The Acting Speaker (Mr. Batten):

Order. I understand that the hon. member for Skeena (Mr. Howard) has already made some remarks on this bill on second reading. If that is so, then he must ask for unanimous consent of the house before he can speak again.

Topic:   CRIMINAL CODE
Subtopic:   AMENDMENT RESPECTING APPEAL IN HABEAS CORPUS PROCEEDINGS
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?

Some hon. Members:

Agreed.

Topic:   CRIMINAL CODE
Subtopic:   AMENDMENT RESPECTING APPEAL IN HABEAS CORPUS PROCEEDINGS
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NDP

Frank Howard

New Democratic Party

Mr. Howard:

Mr. Speaker, I do not ask unanimous consent. The remarks I had to make before were on a point of order; I made no speech on the bill.

Topic:   CRIMINAL CODE
Subtopic:   AMENDMENT RESPECTING APPEAL IN HABEAS CORPUS PROCEEDINGS
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LIB

Herman Maxwell Batten (Deputy Chair of Committees of the Whole)

Liberal

The Acting Speaker (Mr. Batten):

I

apologize to the hon. member.

Topic:   CRIMINAL CODE
Subtopic:   AMENDMENT RESPECTING APPEAL IN HABEAS CORPUS PROCEEDINGS
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NDP

Frank Howard

New Democratic Party

Mr. Howard:

I want only to say that I know the sponsor of the bill, the hon. member for Leeds (Mr. Matheson), being in the unique position of sponsoring a public bill which finally gets to this stage, wants to see it reach its final conclusion and become part of the statutes of Canada. So do I, because the cause is admirable and the objective is worth while.

However, I should like to say that it would have been far better had he arranged to keep the parliamentary secretary to the Minister of Justice (Mr. Macdonald) out of here. Because we now have the understanding that the amendment made by the Senate alters in no way the original bill, that they are identical; we have also the understanding that it does alter them and that it does make a difference; and we have also the understanding that it clarifies what originally was the position. I want only to say that when lawyers try to explain things like this, it does not improve bills for which they want to take some credit. They are better off to stay in their seats and let laymen discuss such matters.

Topic:   CRIMINAL CODE
Subtopic:   AMENDMENT RESPECTING APPEAL IN HABEAS CORPUS PROCEEDINGS
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Motion agreed to, amendment read the second time and concurred in.


SC

Horace Andrew (Bud) Olson

Social Credit

Mr. Olson:

Mr. Speaker, could we ask for unanimous consent of the house to give third reading to Bill No. C-35?

[Mr. Kindt.)

Topic:   CRIMINAL CODE
Subtopic:   AMENDMENT RESPECTING APPEAL IN HABEAS CORPUS PROCEEDINGS
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LIB

John Watson MacNaught (Minister Without Portfolio; Solicitor General of Canada)

Liberal

Mr. MacNaughl:

May I ask the hon. member where that bill appears on today's order paper?

Topic:   CRIMINAL CODE
Subtopic:   AMENDMENT RESPECTING APPEAL IN HABEAS CORPUS PROCEEDINGS
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SC

Horace Andrew (Bud) Olson

Social Credit

Mr. Olson:

Yes, Mr. Speaker. Bill No. C-35 appears as item No. 1 under public bills. It is the same bill we gave second reading to about 15 minutes ago.

Topic:   CRIMINAL CODE
Subtopic:   AMENDMENT RESPECTING APPEAL IN HABEAS CORPUS PROCEEDINGS
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LIB

Herman Maxwell Batten (Deputy Chair of Committees of the Whole)

Liberal

The Acting Speaker (Mr. Batten):

I am advised by the Clerk that the amendment has been agreed to by the house and there is nothing further that has to be done.

Topic:   CRIMINAL CODE
Subtopic:   AMENDMENT RESPECTING APPEAL IN HABEAS CORPUS PROCEEDINGS
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NDP

William Arnold Peters

New Democratic Party

Mr. Peters:

What about third reading?

Topic:   CRIMINAL CODE
Subtopic:   AMENDMENT RESPECTING APPEAL IN HABEAS CORPUS PROCEEDINGS
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PC

Gordon Minto Churchill (Official Opposition House Leader; Progressive Conservative Party House Leader)

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Churchill:

This is an amendment.

Topic:   CRIMINAL CODE
Subtopic:   AMENDMENT RESPECTING APPEAL IN HABEAS CORPUS PROCEEDINGS
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LIB

Herman Maxwell Batten (Deputy Chair of Committees of the Whole)

Liberal

The Acting Speaker (Mr. Batten):

The bill has already received third reading. Today it received second reading and concurrence in an amendment.

Topic:   CRIMINAL CODE
Subtopic:   AMENDMENT RESPECTING APPEAL IN HABEAS CORPUS PROCEEDINGS
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PC

Gordon Minto Churchill (Official Opposition House Leader; Progressive Conservative Party House Leader)

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Churchill:

Mr. Speaker, does that mean it does not have to go to the committee of the whole house?

Topic:   CRIMINAL CODE
Subtopic:   AMENDMENT RESPECTING APPEAL IN HABEAS CORPUS PROCEEDINGS
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LIB

Herman Maxwell Batten (Deputy Chair of Committees of the Whole)

Liberal

The Acting Speaker (Mr. Batten):

That is my understanding, yes.

Topic:   CRIMINAL CODE
Subtopic:   AMENDMENT RESPECTING APPEAL IN HABEAS CORPUS PROCEEDINGS
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PRIVATE BILLS

March 25, 1965