March 15, 1962

PRESENCE IN GALLERY OF DEPUTY PRIME MINISTER OF AUSTRALIA

PC

John George Diefenbaker (Prime Minister)

Progressive Conservative

Right Hon. J. G. Diefenbaker (Prime Minister):

Mr. Speaker, it is my privilege today to call the attention of the house to the presence in the Speaker's gallery of Right Hon. John McEwen, deputy prime minister of the commonwealth of Australia. Mr. McEwen has been a most distinguished leader not only in his own country but throughout the commonwealth of nations, and in 1958 he headed the Australian delegation to the trade and economic conference in Montreal. He comes to us following a stay in Washington. He is discussing with members of the government matters of international interest, including in particular the implications of the common market, as the entry of the United Kingdom may affect not only our two nations but commonwealth trade relations as a whole. To him, and through him, I extend warmest good wishes.

We recall so well an address which was given in the days of war by the prime minister of Australia, Right Hon. Robert Menzies. It will always be remembered by those who were privileged to hear it. Speaking in this chamber with great eloquence, he filled us with determination and moved us to a realization of those values which were then at stake.

Topic:   PRESENCE IN GALLERY OF DEPUTY PRIME MINISTER OF AUSTRALIA
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LIB

Lionel Chevrier (Official Opposition House Leader; Liberal Party House Leader)

Liberal

Hon. Lionel Chevrier (Laurier):

Mr. Speaker, I should like to join with the Prime Minister in welcoming to our country Right Hon. Mr. McEwen, the deputy prime minister of Australia. Our relationship with this commonwealth country has been not only cordial but very close at the United Nations and all international meetings. I am sure that those of us who sit on this side of the house will not only be happy to welcome the deputy prime minister here but will also desire to wish him well in the deliberations that I am sure he will be entering upon with the government.

(Translation):

With the consent of the house, Mr. Speaker, I should like to add only this. Since the talks to be held will also have reference to the

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common market and, consequently, to the export trade which is of particular concern to all of us, we hope that they will be successful.

On behalf of members of the opposition, I extend our best wishes to the deputy prime minister of Australia.

(Text):

Topic:   PRESENCE IN GALLERY OF DEPUTY PRIME MINISTER OF AUSTRALIA
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NDP

Herbert Wilfred Herridge

New Democratic Party

Mr. H. W. Herridge (Kootenay West):

Mr. Speaker, members of this group join with the Prime Minister and the hon. member for Laurier in extending a welcome to the deputy prime minister of Australia. We in this group have a high appreciation of the value of the commonwealth and the role it can play in international affairs. On that account we are particularly anxious on all occasions to extend a most hearty welcome to any representatives of the people from our fellow commonwealth countries.

I was interested to hear the reference made by the Prime Minister to the study of the question of the common market. I am sure this is a matter of mutual and serious concern to Canada and Australia. I trust that after the discussions which will take place in the next few days we will reach a common approach to this question as fellow members of the commonwealth who are concerned with developments in this respect.

Topic:   PRESENCE IN GALLERY OF DEPUTY PRIME MINISTER OF AUSTRALIA
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TAPE RECORDING OF HOUSE PROCEEDINGS

PC

Daniel Roland Michener (Speaker of the House of Commons)

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Speaker:

If the house will give me leave I shall be glad to make a brief statement about experiments in reporting our proceedings by mechanical means, pursuant to the authority given by the house last April. My reason for suggesting what might be called a progress report is to remove doubts which may have been left in the minds of hon. members yesterday when the matter was raised, but not proceeded with, as a question of privilege. Is it agreed that I may make a brief statement?

Topic:   TAPE RECORDING OF HOUSE PROCEEDINGS
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?

Some hon. Members:

Agreed.

Topic:   TAPE RECORDING OF HOUSE PROCEEDINGS
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PC

Daniel Roland Michener (Speaker of the House of Commons)

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Speaker:

If hon. members will refer to page 3963 of Hansard of April 25, 1961 or the Journals of that year at page 471, they will see the following:

Topic:   TAPE RECORDING OF HOUSE PROCEEDINGS
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PC

Daniel Roland Michener (Speaker of the House of Commons)

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Speaker:

By leave of the house-and I should first inform the house that I have already consulted the party leaders-I should like to ask for the approval of the house to carry out some experiments in reporting the proceedings of the house by using tape recording machines in conjunction with our sound amplification system. The purpose is to determine whether mechanical recording can usefully be used in combination with

House of Commons

shorthand reporting, as is being done in some other jurisdictions, and to develop this information for the guidance of the committee on procedure and of the house itself. As I have said, nothing is contemplated other than experimental recordings. Is it agreed? ,___ ...

Topic:   TAPE RECORDING OF HOUSE PROCEEDINGS
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?

Some hon. Members:

Agreed.

Before the July adjournment some experiments with dictaphone machines were made in the English and French debates offices with the co-operation of the editors and certain members of the staff. These experiments were not reported last session to the committee on procedure because they were not considered conclusive and the committee itself had its hands full with other business.

To continue the experiments the assistance of the management analysis division of the civil service commission was requested. This request was initiated by the Clerk on October 5, 1961, and the terms of reference were as follows:

To survey the organization, methods and procedures of the English debates reporting branch with a view to making recommendations for their improvement.

Mr. A. M. Ervin was assigned to the work. He has undertaken a fairly broad study of reporting methods elsewhere as well as in our own house.

The recordings which are now going on began on Thursday, March 1 and continued to March 9. The second stage will begin on March 15 and will run until March 23 and conclude at that point. The method is to take ten minute sample recordings at intervals of approximately one hour during the daily sessions.

In all these experiments the belts or discs on which the proceedings are recorded have been closely guarded and put to no outside, ulterior or improper use. The belts and tapes from the first experiment have been destroyed, and those from Mr. Ervin's experiments will be turned over to the Speaker with his report. There has been nothing secret about the experiments other than to maintain the privacy of the records.

I think perhaps hon. members would like me to add that what we are doing should not be taken in any way as a reflection on our excellent reporting and editorial staff, but rather as an attempt at finding possible means of assisting them in their difficult duties.

Topic:   TAPE RECORDING OF HOUSE PROCEEDINGS
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LIB

Lionel Chevrier (Official Opposition House Leader; Liberal Party House Leader)

Liberal

Hon. Lionel Chevrier (Laurier):

Mr. Speaker, if I were in order I think I should like to say that we are grateful for this statement you have made. There might well have been some misunderstanding about the matter. After having looked at the statement which Your Honour was good enough to let some of us have, we should like to say that we think the statement which Your Honour has just made is of significant importance,

as it affects the privileges and responsibilities of all of the members. We are wondering whether Your Honour would not look with favour on a meeting being called of the house leader and the other party leaders to consider this statement. Not only might it affect the rights and responsibilities of all of us but, from the mechanical aspect of this analysis, it might well gradually and eventually affect the rights of the Hansard reporters and those who have been carrying on so well, as Your Honour has just said.

Topic:   TAPE RECORDING OF HOUSE PROCEEDINGS
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NDP

Herbert Wilfred Herridge

New Democratic Party

Mr. H. W. Herridge (Kootenay West):

Mr. Speaker, this matter was raised by the hon. member for Vancouver East who, with his long experience, values the traditions and rights of parliament. This group appreciates your explanation this afternoon and urges that consideration be given to the suggestion made by the hon. member for Laurier.

Topic:   TAPE RECORDING OF HOUSE PROCEEDINGS
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PC

Gordon Minto Churchill (Minister of Veterans Affairs; Leader of the Government in the House of Commons; Progressive Conservative Party House Leader)

Progressive Conservative

Hon. Gordon Churchill (Minister of Veterans Affairs):

I think the proper place for it to be discussed would be when the committee under your chairmanship meets, Mr. Speaker. I refer to the committee on rules and procedures.

Topic:   TAPE RECORDING OF HOUSE PROCEEDINGS
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BANK OF CANADA

REFERENCE OF REPORT OF GOVERNOR TO STANDING COMMITTEE


On the order: Government notices of motion: March 13-The Minister of Finance-That the annual report of the governor of the Bank of Canada, together with the statement of accounts, for the year ended the 31st of December, 1961, laid on the table on the 12th day of March, 1962, be referred to the standing committee on banking and commerce.


PC

Daniel Roland Michener (Speaker of the House of Commons)

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Speaker:

Pursuant to section 2 of standing order 21 this government notice of motion stands transferred to and ordered for consideration under government orders at the next sitting of the house.

Topic:   BANK OF CANADA
Subtopic:   REFERENCE OF REPORT OF GOVERNOR TO STANDING COMMITTEE
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LABOUR CONDITIONS

REQUEST FOR TABLING OF REPORT ON LABOUR FORCE


On the orders of the day:


March 15, 1962