March 8, 1962

RAILWAYS, CANALS AND TELEGRAPH LINES CONCURRENCE IN FOURTH REPORT OF STANDING COMMITTEE


Mr. W. M. Howe (Wellinglon-Huron) presented the fourth report of the standing committee on railways, canals and telegraph lines, and moved that the report be concurred in. Motion agreed to.


NATIONAL DEFENCE

TRAINING OF UNITED KINGDOM UNITS IN CANADA

PC

Douglas Scott Harkness (Minister of National Defence)

Progressive Conservative

Hon. D. S. Harkness (Minisler of National Defence):

Mr. Speaker, I should like to make a statement with regard to the training of British army units in Canada during the forthcoming months. The house will recall that last summer, in response to a request from the United Kingdom government, the Canadian government agreed to a battalion of the British army being airlifted to Camp Gagetown in June to train with the 3rd Canadian brigade group. This exercise proved of value to all concerned.

This year, and again at the request of the United Kingdom government, we have agreed to a battalion joining Canadian regular army forces in Canada for summer training. The first battalion of the Royal Welsh Fusiliers has been nominated. Details as to the location of the training area are now being worked out and will be announced in due course. As was the case last year, the United Kingdom will bear the total administrative costs. In addition, the Canadian government has also agreed to a proposal that a British army battery and a parachute company should come to Canada later this year and early in 1963 to obtain training experience under winter conditions.

I am sure all hon. members will appreciate this further evidence of the close co-operation which exists between Canada and the United Kingdom in matters relating to our common defence effort.

26207-1-101

Topic:   NATIONAL DEFENCE
Subtopic:   TRAINING OF UNITED KINGDOM UNITS IN CANADA
Permalink

ADMINISTRATION OF JUSTICE

ACTS OF TERRORISM, B.C. MOTION FOR ADJOURNMENT UNDER STANDING ORDER 26

NDP

Herbert Wilfred Herridge

New Democratic Party

Mr. H. W. Herridge (Kootenay West):

Mr. Speaker, I beg leave to move the adjournment of the house, seconded by the hon. member for Kootenay East, under standing order 26 for the purpose of discussing a definite matter of urgent public importance, namely the need for federal assistance to the provincial government of British Columbia to effectively deal with the extremely serious situation in the Kootenays caused by continuous bombings and acts of terrorism, culminating two days ago in the destruction of half a million dollars worth of property causing unemployment to over 1,000 persons for a period of a few weeks to months.

Topic:   ADMINISTRATION OF JUSTICE
Subtopic:   ACTS OF TERRORISM, B.C. MOTION FOR ADJOURNMENT UNDER STANDING ORDER 26
Permalink
PC

Daniel Roland Michener (Speaker of the House of Commons)

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Speaker:

Before I hear the minister, perhaps I should ask the hon. member who requests leave to indicate, if he can, what is the urgency of debate. The problem of bombings and other unlawful acts by certain people in the Kootenays has engaged the attention of this house and of the country for a long time. It is true that there was recently an outbreak with particularly serious consequences to which the hon. member has referred. However, I wonder whether or not that creates an urgency of debate in a continuing problem. I would ask the hon. member to address himself briefly to that point, then I shall hear from the Minister of Justice.

Topic:   ADMINISTRATION OF JUSTICE
Subtopic:   ACTS OF TERRORISM, B.C. MOTION FOR ADJOURNMENT UNDER STANDING ORDER 26
Permalink
NDP

Herbert Wilfred Herridge

New Democratic Party

Mr. Herridge:

Mr. Speaker-

Topic:   ADMINISTRATION OF JUSTICE
Subtopic:   ACTS OF TERRORISM, B.C. MOTION FOR ADJOURNMENT UNDER STANDING ORDER 26
Permalink
PC

Daniel Roland Michener (Speaker of the House of Commons)

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Speaker:

The question is urgency of debate. Recognizing that there is a serious problem, it is a continuing one. Is there some new aspect to it now which it has not been possible to debate in this session or will not be possible to debate within a reasonable time?

Topic:   ADMINISTRATION OF JUSTICE
Subtopic:   ACTS OF TERRORISM, B.C. MOTION FOR ADJOURNMENT UNDER STANDING ORDER 26
Permalink
NDP

Herbert Wilfred Herridge

New Democratic Party

Mr. Herridge:

The urgency of the situation for the people of the Kootenays is in the fact that according to some it has now almost reached the stage of civil war with these continued bombings, acts of terrorism and sabotage. The mayors of the various cities in the Kootenays, the heads of industrial organizations and numerous unions have wired members of the government, including the

Acts of Terrorism in B.C.

Prime Minister, the member for Kootenay West and the member for Kootenay East, urging the federal government to take action. They believe the urgency is very particular at the present time, and it is on that basis I moved the adjournment of the house.

Topic:   ADMINISTRATION OF JUSTICE
Subtopic:   ACTS OF TERRORISM, B.C. MOTION FOR ADJOURNMENT UNDER STANDING ORDER 26
Permalink
PC

Edmund Davie Fulton (Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada)

Progressive Conservative

Hon. E. D. Fulton (Minister of Justice):

If I may say a word on this, I would prefer not to deal directly with the question of urgency because, as a minister coming from British Columbia, you will appreciate that I am aware of the nature of the problem and the serious aspect it has taken on just lately. Whether or not that kind of urgency brings it within the rule regarding urgency of debate is a question Your Honour has raised which I am content to leave where, I submit with respect and deference, you have correctly summarized it.

There are two other grounds on which I think the motion is out of order, and it is with those I should like to deal. The first is based on citation 100 in Beauchesne's fourth edition, page 89, where he says:

The definite matter of urgent public importance for the discussion of which a member may ask leave to move the adjournment of the house under standing order 26 must involve the administrative responsibility of the government.

The constitutional position, sir, as is well known, is that the responsibility for the maintenance of law and order and the protection of property is that of the provinces. So long, therefore, as the province accepts this responsibility there is no way that the federal government can intervene to give assistance in this field, so there is at present no way in which any question of the administrative responsibility of the federal government arises. No indication has been received that the province of British Columbia does not accept the responsibility of maintaining law and order. Therefore, as I say, there is no way in which this matter could come within the administrative responsibility of the federal government.

In saying this, I would not want to be taken as implying that responsibility would automatically be accepted if a request were made. There are relevant statutes and other provisions in this regard with respect to the kind of assistance and the circumstances under which assistance of the kind referred-that is, military aid and extra policing-can be requested by a province. These would have to be looked at, and certainly would be looked at, at once to see whether or not these circumstances prevailed if any such request were made. The point that is important to note here for the purpose which we are dealing with now is that no request has been made by the province. There is no indication that the province does not accept the responsibility

or feels it cannot discharge the responsibility for the maintenance of law and order. In those circumstances I submit that it is not a matter within the scope of the citation to which I have referred.

I repeat that I do not want to take what I may call, with respect, the narrow ground with regard to urgency, although I do submit with deference that you have correctly stated the position there. Rather I prefer to rest on the ground I have referred to, and on the ground contained in paragraph 5 of citation 100 at page 90 of Beauchesne's fourth edition, namely:

The adjournment of the house cannot be moved with reference to critical conditions generally prevailing in certain parts of the country.

Although it is British Columbia's misfortune, nevertheless fortunately the conditions prevailing in the constituency of my hon. friend from Kootenay West are not those generally prevailing across the country.

So on those two grounds, while respecting fully the desire of the hon. member for Kootenay West and the hon. member for Kootenay East and their anxiety in this matter, and while indicating that all hon. members in the house share that anxiety-certainly the government shares and understands their concern-nevertheless in my respectful submission this is not the kind of subject that can be debated here at this time, for the reasons I have given.

Topic:   ADMINISTRATION OF JUSTICE
Subtopic:   ACTS OF TERRORISM, B.C. MOTION FOR ADJOURNMENT UNDER STANDING ORDER 26
Permalink
PC

Daniel Roland Michener (Speaker of the House of Commons)

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Speaker:

I am not sure whether the hon. member who is asking for leave feels that the matter has been sufficiently placed before the attention of the government to allow his request to stand, or whether he would like me to deal with it on its merits.

Topic:   ADMINISTRATION OF JUSTICE
Subtopic:   ACTS OF TERRORISM, B.C. MOTION FOR ADJOURNMENT UNDER STANDING ORDER 26
Permalink
NDP

Herbert Wilfred Herridge

New Democratic Party

Mr. Herridge:

I have listened to the minister's explanation with great interest, and in view of the facts he placed before the house I feel I have nothing further to say at this time.

Topic:   ADMINISTRATION OF JUSTICE
Subtopic:   ACTS OF TERRORISM, B.C. MOTION FOR ADJOURNMENT UNDER STANDING ORDER 26
Permalink
PC

Daniel Roland Michener (Speaker of the House of Commons)

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Speaker:

In the circumstances I think I might be correct, then, in rejecting the motion at this time.

Topic:   ADMINISTRATION OF JUSTICE
Subtopic:   ACTS OF TERRORISM, B.C. MOTION FOR ADJOURNMENT UNDER STANDING ORDER 26
Permalink

UNITED NATIONS

DISARMAMENT


On the orders of the day:


LIB

Lester Bowles Pearson (Leader of the Official Opposition)

Liberal

Hon. L. B. Pearson (Leader of Ihe Opposition):

I would like to ask a question of the Prime Minister in view of the forthcoming disarmament meeting at Geneva next week. Does the government consider that the first and essential step in reaching a general

disarmament agreement should be an agreement to end all nuclear tests, with appropriate provision for inspection and control, and that this should be given first priority at the forthcoming conference?

Topic:   UNITED NATIONS
Subtopic:   DISARMAMENT
Sub-subtopic:   PRIORITY OF AGREEMENT ON NUCLEAR TESTS
Permalink

March 8, 1962