February 14, 1962

LIB

Jean-Paul Deschatelets

Liberal

Mr. Deschatelets:

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker, could the separatist Conservative be asked to abide by the standing orders of the house and stop interrupting the hon. member who has the floor?

Topic:   FLAGS OF CANADA
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR REFERENDUM ON ADOPTION OF CANADIAN FLAG
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?

An hon. Member:

What do you think of separatism?

Topic:   FLAGS OF CANADA
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR REFERENDUM ON ADOPTION OF CANADIAN FLAG
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PC

Paul Raymond Martineau (Deputy Speaker and Chair of Committees of the Whole of the House of Commons)

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Deputy Speaker:

I would ask the hon. member for Maisonneuve-Rosemont to refrain from making remarks which are incompatible with the dignity of the house. However, I feel there is some basis to his point of order since there have been frequent interruptions from hon. members. I do not think those continuous interruptions are conducive to the orderly dispatch of the business of the house.

Flags of Canada

Therefore, I would ask all hon. members to co-operate with the chair so that the hon, member who has the floor may continue his remarks. It will be to the advantage of all hon. members who will speak after him to comply with the rules of the house.

Topic:   FLAGS OF CANADA
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR REFERENDUM ON ADOPTION OF CANADIAN FLAG
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LIB

Jean-Paul Deschatelets

Liberal

Mr. Deschatelets:

On the point of order, Mr. Speaker, and with all due deference to the Chair, I mentioned a moment ago that the separatist Conservative hon. member for Roberval (Mr. Tremblay) was out of order. I have nothing to withdraw from that statement when the hon. member for Roberval denounces confederation and remains a member of the Conservative government.

Topic:   FLAGS OF CANADA
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR REFERENDUM ON ADOPTION OF CANADIAN FLAG
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PC

Paul Raymond Martineau (Deputy Speaker and Chair of Committees of the Whole of the House of Commons)

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Deputy Speaker:

I ask the hon. member to resume his seat. I think he is embarking upon a discussion on another matter. It is precisely to prevent a discussion on a different matter that I ask the hon. member to confine his remarks to his point of order.

This being said, I think that it would be to the advantage of all hon. members to let the hon. member for Drummond-Arthabaska (Mr. Boulanger) carry on.

Topic:   FLAGS OF CANADA
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR REFERENDUM ON ADOPTION OF CANADIAN FLAG
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PC

Paul Léo Maurice Johnson

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Maurice Johnson (Chambly-Rouville):

Could Your Honor specify on which of the points of order raised he is upholding the member for Maisonneuve-Rosemont?

Topic:   FLAGS OF CANADA
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR REFERENDUM ON ADOPTION OF CANADIAN FLAG
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PC

Paul Raymond Martineau (Deputy Speaker and Chair of Committees of the Whole of the House of Commons)

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Deputy Speaker:

I recognize the hon. member for Drummond-Arthabaska.

Topic:   FLAGS OF CANADA
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR REFERENDUM ON ADOPTION OF CANADIAN FLAG
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LIB

Samuel Boulanger

Liberal

Mr. Boulanger:

Mr. Speaker, our leader has very clearly stated our position with regard to one distinctive flag-

Topic:   FLAGS OF CANADA
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR REFERENDUM ON ADOPTION OF CANADIAN FLAG
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LIB

Léonard-David Sweezey Tremblay

Liberal

Mr. Tremblay:

What leader?

Topic:   FLAGS OF CANADA
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LIB

Samuel Boulanger

Liberal

Mr. Boulanger:

-one national flag. I think he spoke for all of us. There cannot be any misunderstanding about our desire to give the country a distinctive national flag. We clearly stated our views on that question. We now leave it up to the Conservatives to talk the resolution out, if that is what they want.

Topic:   FLAGS OF CANADA
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR REFERENDUM ON ADOPTION OF CANADIAN FLAG
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An hon. Member:

How many did you talk out when you were in power?

Topic:   FLAGS OF CANADA
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR REFERENDUM ON ADOPTION OF CANADIAN FLAG
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LIB

Léonard-David Sweezey Tremblay

Liberal

Mr. Tremblay:

They even talked out Mr. St. Laurent.

Topic:   FLAGS OF CANADA
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR REFERENDUM ON ADOPTION OF CANADIAN FLAG
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PC

Maurice Allard

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Maurice Allard (Sherbrooke):

Mr. Speaker, I also wish to say a few words to declare myself in favour of the question contained in this resolution about a referendum:

Are you in favour of a Canadian flag on which no emblem of another country would appear?

Mr. Speaker, in the past few years, together with other hon. members, the members for Joliette-L'Assomption-Montcalm (Mr. Pigeon), for Drummond-Arthabaska (Mr.

Boulanger), the mover of the present resolution (Mr. Regnier) and a few others, I have raised, and quite rightly so, the question of the advisability of adopting a distinctive flag for Canada.

I do not like to hear the hon. member for Drummond-Arthabaska (Mr. Boulanger) and some of his colleagues make strictly political remarks in this respect because you can always find the right answers.

It will be recalled, for instance, how ably the late Mackenzie King stifled in 1945 certain proposals of national interest by refusing to allow a debate on the report submitted by the joint committee of the house and Senate concerning the flags. Under an order in council dated September 5, 1945, he had then suggested as a compromise the adoption of the red ensign with the union jack in the upper quarter and the Canadian emblems in the lower quarter.

The hon. member for Drummond-Arthabaska referred earlier to certain statements made at that time by the Prime Minister (Mr. Diefenbaker).

We could also quote the words of the Right Hon. Louis St. Laurent who, following the statements of the late Mackenzie King, declared himself also in favour of the union jack. For he was backing his leader who stated that he, for one, was in favour of the inclusion of the union jack in the Canadian flag.

Topic:   FLAGS OF CANADA
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR REFERENDUM ON ADOPTION OF CANADIAN FLAG
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An hon. Member:

What page? Give us the page.

Topic:   FLAGS OF CANADA
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PC

Maurice Allard

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Allard:

That was the attitude in 1945.

Because of post-war events, there has been since then, in Canada, a constitutional evolution which resulted in the Canadian people becoming conscious of national sovereignty and independence.

All those new facts call for the implementation of this project which concerns the whole of Canada.

Topic:   FLAGS OF CANADA
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR REFERENDUM ON ADOPTION OF CANADIAN FLAG
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An hon. Member:

Give the page number.

Topic:   FLAGS OF CANADA
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR REFERENDUM ON ADOPTION OF CANADIAN FLAG
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PC

Maurice Allard

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Allard:

No purpose is served by discussing past events and remarks made in certain circumstances. This is 1962. Time and again, we have heard in this house members of all parties talk about Canada's sovereignty and independence in the economic, political and international fields.

Many events, since 1945, have made it possible to take steps forward and to achieve that sovereignty which is now evident and recognized the world over by international organizations such as the United Nations,

NATO, NORAD and all other organizations and commissions to which Canada has taken part with its distinctive character and personality.

Because of that newly acquired sovereignty and independence, the adoption of a distinctive national emblem has become appropriate and even necessary. That same feeling is being expressed by a very great majority of the Canadian people from sea to sea. We have only to rely, for example, on the reports published by the junior chambers of commerce, on the resolutions passed by various public organizations in Canada, such as the senior chamber of commerce and many others, which all express, in very precise and concrete terms, the wish of the great majority of the Canadian people to have at last a distinctive national flag, that is to say, one without the emblem of any other country.

We have a lot of respect and admiration for the flags of other countries, as well as for our mother countries. But when we, of the province of Quebec, ask for a flag, we do not wish to be misunderstood by our Englishspeaking compatriots and by our colleagues from other provinces. This is not a question of autonomy or exclusion. We are moved to do so by our Canadian patriotism. We sincerely believe that it is essential to have a distinctive flag. In order to sing with pride of our native land, in one province or another, in all parts of the world, we must have a rallying emblem.

Groups, from one end of the country to the other, have criticized some situations. In the last seven or eight months, in the province of Quebec, we witnessed the rise of a movement born of irritation and disillusion. Now, if we had, in Canada, a distinctive national flag, a flag exclusively Canadian, this would be a means of rallying the Canadians, of moving their hearts, of uniting them from coast to coast, which in the present Canadian context is difficult to achieve because our small population is scattered over a vast territory and each province is faced with various economic problems. How difficult is it to understand this Canadian reality of a people so active and so aggressive living in such a gigantic country and whose economy is complex beyond description.

Well, we need a means of unification. That essential means is a distinctive national flag around which we can rally, a distinctive national flag in every Canadian school, in

Flags of Canada

every Canadian province, which, stirring the hearts of young Canadians of every ethnical origin, would unite them under that sign of our sovereignty and independence.

Those are the few words I wanted to say. I do not want, of course, to dwell on that subject because, like other hon. members, I have a bill on Canadian sovereignty on the order paper. But I shall support any measure which will help us obtain a distinctive national flag, and I hope we have one soon.

Indeed, we shall need a flag when we celebrate our centenary. Our partnership will be 100 years old, Mr. Speaker, and if we do not act now, we shall have to celebrate the centenary of confederation without a distinctive emblem, which would be a real shame.

I am not asking for any symbols or remnants of the past on this flag, signs recalling the memory of France, like the fleur-de-lis. There is no need for such, nor any other sign. I would like us to have a distinctive and exclusively Canadian flag, so that we may celebrate the centenary of our confederation with joy and national pride.

(Text):

Topic:   FLAGS OF CANADA
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR REFERENDUM ON ADOPTION OF CANADIAN FLAG
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PC

Paul Raymond Martineau (Deputy Speaker and Chair of Committees of the Whole of the House of Commons)

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Deputy Speaker:

The hon. member for Timmins.

Topic:   FLAGS OF CANADA
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PC

Louis-Joseph Pigeon

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Pigeon:

Mr. Speaker, I should like to ask the Leader of the Opposition whether he shares the opinion of the member for Bona-vista-Twillingate.

Topic:   FLAGS OF CANADA
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PC

Paul Raymond Martineau (Deputy Speaker and Chair of Committees of the Whole of the House of Commons)

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Deputy Speaker:

The hon. member for Timmins.

Topic:   FLAGS OF CANADA
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR REFERENDUM ON ADOPTION OF CANADIAN FLAG
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February 14, 1962