February 12, 1962

EXTERNAL AFFAIRS

APPOINTMENT OF AMBASSADOR TO UNITED STATES

PC

John George Diefenbaker (Prime Minister)

Progressive Conservative

Right Hon. J. G. Diefenbaker (Prime Minister):

Mr. Speaker, I wish to announce the appointment of Mr. Charles S. A. Ritchie as ambassador of Canada to the United States of America. Mr. Ritchie, who is at present permanent representatives of Canada to the United Nations, will succeed Mr. A. D. P. Heeney.

I should like to pay tribute to the outstanding service rendered by Mr. Heeney in his two tours as Canadian ambassador in Washington. He has rightly earned the highest commendation for his devoted and highly successful role as Canada's representative in the United States. His next assignment and the name of Mr. Ritchie's successor at the United Nations will be the subject of announcements at an early date.

Since joining the Department of External Affairs in 1934 Mr. Ritchie, who studied at the University of King's College, Halifax, Oxford, Harvard and the Ecole Libre de Sciences Politiques in Paris, has held a variety of important appointments at home and abroad. His first assignment abroad was in Washington in 1936 and during the war years he was a member of the high commissioner's staff at Canada house in London. He later served as counsellor at the Canadian embassy in Paris. In 1950 he became an assistant under secretary of state for external affairs, and in 1952 he was appointed deputy under secretary. He was appointed ambassador to the Federal Republic of Germany and head of the military mission, Berlin, in 1954. In 1957 he was appointed permanent representative of Canada to the United Nations. As Canada's representative there he made a valuable contribution in furthering Canadian aims in the world forum. We believe that Mr. Ritchie is particularly well qualified to discharge the important duties of head of the Canadian diplomatic mission in Washington.

Topic:   EXTERNAL AFFAIRS
Subtopic:   APPOINTMENT OF AMBASSADOR TO UNITED STATES
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LIB

Lester Bowles Pearson (Leader of the Official Opposition)

Liberal

Hon. L. B. Pearson (Leader of the Opposition):

Mr. Speaker, I am sure that all hon. members of the house will have heard with great interest about the appointment

of Mr. Ritchie to this very important diplomatic post of Canadian ambassador to the United States, a post which has been filled with such great distinction, as the Prime Minister said, for some years now by Mr. Heeney, whose retirement we all regret. Mr. Heeney has not only served Canada well in Washington but in many other capacities, and I have no doubt there will be some opportunity for the country to avail itself of his services again in the future.

If Mr. Heeney is to leave Washington I can think of no better man in the Canadian diplomatic service to take his place than Mr. Charles Ritchie. As the Prime Minister has pointed out, he is an officer with great experience and ability and he has discharged, I think, all the duties that he has been asked to discharge with great efficiency and devotion. We on this side feel that this is a first class appointment, and we wish Mr. Ritchie well in his new post.

Topic:   EXTERNAL AFFAIRS
Subtopic:   APPOINTMENT OF AMBASSADOR TO UNITED STATES
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NDP

Herbert Wilfred Herridge

New Democratic Party

Mr. H. W. Herridge (Kootenay West):

Mr. Speaker, this group heartily endorses the remarks of the leader of the official opposition with respect to the services Mr. Heeney has rendered Canada as Canadian ambassador to the United States, and with respect to the service rendered in the past to Canada by Mr. Ritchie and the greater service he now has the opportunity to render through his appointment as Canadian ambassador to the United States.

Topic:   EXTERNAL AFFAIRS
Subtopic:   APPOINTMENT OF AMBASSADOR TO UNITED STATES
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MAIN ESTIMATES, 1962-63 EXPLANATORY STATEMENT OF THE MINISTER OF FINANCE


A message from His Excellency the Governor General transmitting estimates for the financial year ending March 31, 1963, was presented by Hon. Donald M. Fleming (Minister of Finance) and read by Mr. Speaker to the house.


PC

Donald Methuen Fleming (Minister of Finance and Receiver General)

Progressive Conservative

Hon. Donald M. Fleming (Minister of Finance):

I have introduced the main estimates for the new fiscal year commencing April 1, 1962. They contemplate total budgetary expenditures of $6,276.2 million. Taking account of the result of the new fiscal arrangements with the provinces, this represents a decrease of $203.4 million as compared with a total of $6,479.6 million provided in the estimates tabled to date for the present fiscal year. Further details are available in a

752 HOUSE OF

Tabling of Main Estimates statement which has been issued to the press in keeping with the practice and on the terms prevailing for many years.

I should like to draw to the attention of the house certain notable changes which hon. members will find in the form and content of the estimates. During the session of 1960-61 the standing committee on public accounts of the House of Commons examined the form and content of the estimates. The committee in its report to the House of Commons on June 20, 1961 recommended several changes in the form of the estimates. All of these changes have been implemented in the main estimates for 1962-63.

The changes are of two types; first, those related to the form of the estimates, such as:

(a) the introduction of a new "permanent numbers" vote numbering system;

(b) the inclusion of vote numbers in the details section;

(c) the addition of a table of contents to the estimates book;

(d) the rearrangement of the sequence of information so that the details section of each departmental class would be located immediately following the vote section for that class.

The second type of change concerns the content of the estimates. Here the committee recommended the distribution, for information purposes, of the costs of major common services which are provided to other departments without a corresponding charge to their appropriations. It also recommended the rearrangement of staff detail in a manner which would result in a clearer understanding of establishment proposals.

An improved vote numbering system has been devised which will allow the printing of vote numbers in the details of estimates without causing delays in tabling estimates. It also has other advantages over the numbering system used heretofore. The essence of the new system is that annually recurring votes will be designated by the same vote numbers from year to year and supplementary votes will bear the same basic numbers as their related main estimates votes.

A criticism of Canadian estimates in the past has been that the total cost of a particular departmental area was difficult to assess because the estimates for that department did not contain provision for common services which were performed by other government agencies and provided to them free of charge. To assist in arriving at a reasonable picture of total cost without the introduction of costly accounting practices, there is now included in the details of services for each area identified in the over-all summary in the front of the blue book a list of the major services

provided free of charge to that department together with their estimated costs. In addition, the cost of accommodation provided in earlier estimates is now shown.

Salary details accounted for about 200 of the 610 pages in the blue book for 1961-62 and involved departments in thousands of man hours of work calculating their detailed costings. Moreover, because of its size and complexity its value to members of parliament as supporting detail for the "Salaries" object of expenditure was considered questionable. A new form of staff detail has been adopted in which the total personnel establishment provided for in each vote is first divided, to show tenure or security of employment, into "Continuing Establishment" and "Casuals and Others". For the former, both numbers of positions and their man year equivalents are provided. The addition of man years for "Casuals and Others" provides a measure in other than dollar terms for the total establishment.

The committee in its report invited attention to other possible changes. These are under study and will be discussed in due course with the standing committee on public accounts. It is considered that the changes recommended by the committee and incorporated in these estimates represent a major improvement.

Topic:   EXTERNAL AFFAIRS
Subtopic:   MAIN ESTIMATES, 1962-63 EXPLANATORY STATEMENT OF THE MINISTER OF FINANCE
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LIB

Lester Bowles Pearson (Leader of the Official Opposition)

Liberal

Hon. L. B. Pearson (Leader of the Opposition):

Mr. Speaker, the minister in tabling the estimates which amount this year to $6,276.2 million has indicated that this is a reduction over the estimates of last year. The minister, of course, is comparing the main estimates of this year with the main estimates plus the three supplementary estimates of last year. If a comparison is made between the main estimates of this year and last year-and that is, of course, the valid comparison-it shows a very considerable increase.

There have been $400 million of supplementary estimates, and on the assumption that there will be supplementary estimates again this year it will not be likely that we will have reduction in expenditures as indicated by the minister in comparing the main estimates of the forcoming year and the main and $400 million of supplementary estimates for the current year.

In tabling these estimates I believe the minister has given us every reason to feel, now that the estimates have been tabled, that the budget will not be long behind.

Topic:   EXTERNAL AFFAIRS
Subtopic:   MAIN ESTIMATES, 1962-63 EXPLANATORY STATEMENT OF THE MINISTER OF FINANCE
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NDP

Herbert Wilfred Herridge

New Democratic Party

Mr. H. W. Herridge (Kootenay West):

Mr. Speaker, we listened with interest to the minister's statement with respect to the tabling of the estimates, but wish to reserve

any comment on the first part of the statement until we have had an opportunity to read it and make certain of the facts.

We are pleased to know that the government has given favourable consideration to the recommendation of the public accounts committee with respect to the form in which the estimates will be brought forward. Hon. members of this group, particularly the hon. member for Vancouver East, took an active part in that committee in discussing these proposed improvements.

We are convinced that the introduction of the estimates in this new form will make possible a more logical presentation and a better sequence. It will better suit the convenience of hon. members, provide for a greater understanding on the part of the public and, we hope, will mean some saving of time and money.

Topic:   EXTERNAL AFFAIRS
Subtopic:   MAIN ESTIMATES, 1962-63 EXPLANATORY STATEMENT OF THE MINISTER OF FINANCE
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PC

Donald Methuen Fleming (Minister of Finance and Receiver General)

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Fleming (Eglinton) moved:

That the message of His Excellency together with the estimates presented this day, be referred to the committee of supply.

He said: I give the house an undertaking not to move to consider these estimates in committee of supply until the debate on the speech from the throne is concluded.

Topic:   EXTERNAL AFFAIRS
Subtopic:   MAIN ESTIMATES, 1962-63 EXPLANATORY STATEMENT OF THE MINISTER OF FINANCE
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Motion agreed to.


PRIVILEGE

MR. SEVIGNY CLARIFICATION OF SPEECH IN MONTREAL ON FEBRUARY 8

PC

Joseph Pierre Albert Sévigny (Associate Minister of National Defence)

Progressive Conservative

Hon. Pierre Sevigny (Associate Minister of National Defence):

Mr. Speaker I rise on a question of personal privilege. Reference was made in this house on Friday last during my absence, to a speech which I made in Montreal on February 8. In that speech I voiced my concern over the spread of the communist ideology in various countries of the world. I made certain comments about British Guiana and Ecuador in this connection. I have since been satisfied that the governments of those countries are not communist, and I am glad to correct the statement I made. In fact, to any government trying to lead its people closer to our democratic thinking I gladly offer my congratulations.

I also made some reference to the spread of communism in the Far East and to the threat thereby posed to the west. I wish to make it amply clear that I was referring only to the threat presented by the military strength of communist China.

I guess I was a little out of line in that speech Mr. Speaker. I sincerely regret any misunderstandings or wrong conclusions

Deficiency Payment on Wool which may have resulted from my statements, and I trust that my explanation will serve to clear them up.

On the orders of the day:

Topic:   PRIVILEGE
Subtopic:   MR. SEVIGNY CLARIFICATION OF SPEECH IN MONTREAL ON FEBRUARY 8
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NDP

Herbert Wilfred Herridge

New Democratic Party

Mr. H. W. Herridge (Kootenay West):

wish to direct a question to the Associate Minister of National Defence. In view of his recent and most unfortunate blunder in respect of the political complexions of various states, would he agree he would be well advised in future to consult with the Secretary of State for External Affairs before making similar announcements?

Topic:   PRIVILEGE
Subtopic:   MR. SEVIGNY CLARIFICATION OF SPEECH IN MONTREAL ON FEBRUARY 8
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?

Some hon. Members:

Shame.

Topic:   PRIVILEGE
Subtopic:   MR. SEVIGNY CLARIFICATION OF SPEECH IN MONTREAL ON FEBRUARY 8
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PC

Daniel Roland Michener (Speaker of the House of Commons)

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Speaker:

That certainly is not asking for information, which is the limitation on questions dealt with during orders of the day. If the hon. member wishes a debate, then he must find another time.

Topic:   PRIVILEGE
Subtopic:   MR. SEVIGNY CLARIFICATION OF SPEECH IN MONTREAL ON FEBRUARY 8
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AGRICULTURE

ANNOUNCEMENT OF DEFICIENCY PAYMENT

February 12, 1962