May 27, 1958

LIB

Jean-Thomas Richard

Liberal

Mr. Richard (Ottawa East):

That is only the hon. gentleman's opinion.

The next important factor in trade, of course, is to keep our markets abroad and this again relates to the diversion of trade from the United States. The best customer Canada has is the United States of America, and we cannot afford to lose that customer. Some correction should be made by this government in the near future so the United States will not take too seriously the flippant attitude held by some hon. members opposite. I was very glad to hear a young Conservative but a very bright one, the hon. member for Calgary South (Mr. Smith), say this morning that we should be good Canadians but that does not mean we should be anti-American. Of course the ridings in Canada are not the same and some people are politically inclined to forget on occasion what is the general good. I do hope I am not imputing any motives to hon. members in saying this.

The Address-Mr. J. T. Richard

In any event we will have to extend our markets throughout the world. We are now talking about peace and increased co-operation with the U.S.S.R. If we ever achieve that kind of hopeful situation about which we talk so much we will have to do a lot of peddling to win markets from the U.S.S.R. on the basis of even competition. (Translation) :

And I would now like to congratulate the member for Labelle (Mr. Courtemanche) who has recently been appointed Secretary of State. I hope that he will gain for himself a good reputation as a leader in a department which has been too long neglected. I am confident that he will get down to work immediately and that he will be able to provide us with the assistance we have been looking for for a number of years. And, to be perfectly fair, I must include here the administration that preceded that of the Conservative party.

(Text):

I am, of course, pointing these remarks in the direction of the Minister of Citizenship and Immigration (Mrs. Fairclough). I have just congratulated the new Secretary of State (Mr. Courtemanche). I am sorry the hon. lady who was the former secretary of state did not have a long enough tenure of office to do the many things which we expected she would accomplish in the different branches which came under her jurisdiction, prior to her appointment to the position she now holds. However, I might say for her benefit and the benefit of all those who are here that she acquired the reputation of being a very friendly and efficient minister in the Department of Secretary of State, although I must express regret that she was unable to retain the location of the patent office in the centre of the city as so many of us requested last year.

The present Secretary of State will, I hope, have an opportunity to remain in his post long enough to become closely acquainted with the several branches for which he answers to this house.

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LIB

John Whitney Pickersgill

Liberal

Mr. Pickersgill:

Not too long; just four years.

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LIB

Jean-Thomas Richard

Liberal

Mr. Richard (Ottawa East):

The tenure of office of the secretary of state in this country has never been very long. Whether a government has stayed in office for 22 years or for one year, those who have occupied the post of secretary of state have held it for too short a period. That includes the hon. member for Essex East (Mr. Martin) who was minister of that department for too short a time.

I appreciate that the present minister will have to familiarize himself with the workings

The Address-Mr. J. T. Richard of the civil service commission, and I hope he may soon announce that he is ready to submit to this house a revised Civil Service Act. I understand that the commission is at present engaged in making a study of civil service legislation in other countries and will make suggestions to the government at an early date. I have requested a revision of this act for many years.

I would suggest to the Secretary of State that he bring some pressure to bear on the Minister of Finance and the Prime Minister to raise the pensions of retired civil servants. This is a very urgent problem for many of these faithful servants, and one which should receive top priority. The question of entirely inadequate superannuation for retired *civil servants is an old and sad story which has often been recounted on the floor of this house. These people suffer actual hardship, want, deprivation and perhaps even malnutrition. This government promised during the last session to do something about this problem. The time has come to quit talking and do something in this regard. I believe it was estimated last session by some bon. members that it would cost in the neighbourhood of between $5 million and $10 million to cover the adjustment of these pensions. The number of people in this category diminishes with the years. Many have already died and many others, of course, have not too many years to go. I urge this government to act on its promise and do something tangible about the superannuation of retired civil servants, instead of just talking about it.

While I am dealing with the Department of *Secretary of State I might ask the minister also to acquaint himself with the work of the royal commission on patents, trademarks and copyrights. I understand that some of the work has been completed, and I hope the reports will be tabled as soon as they have been received by the minister and the government.

The speech from the throne refers to the enactment of a new national capital act to replace the present Federal District Commission Act. I am very anxious to examine the proposals which are to be contained in this act. The former Liberal government had prepared similar legislation which was not proceeded with. I urge all new hon. members who are not familiar with the national capital plan to acquaint themselves with it. I would suggest that they make inquiries for literature, information and maps from the information branch of the federal district commission, which has an excellent and competent staff.

Hon. members who study the problems of the national capital are confronted with the fact that there is no official approved plan.

This has given rise to many misgivings and misunderstandings. The citizens who reside in the city of Ottawa and surrounding areas are handicapped by the uncertainties created by the possible expropriation of their land for parks or roadways, or by the possible restriction of their right to erect buildings of their choice. The government should immediately request the assistance of the province of Ontario and the municipalities within the national capital area to approve a proper plan and give it the necessary legal force and effect.

Over the years the federal district commission has bought most of the land needed for the new parkways. Perhaps it has been because of this-federal district commission energy, enterprise and finances going into this land acquisition program-that very little actual parkway construction on the Ottawa side has been done. Now is the time to get to work on it. Construction of the Ottawa river parkway and the new east and west parkways would not only add to the beauty of the national capital but would make a very considerable contribution toward relieving unemployment in the Ottawa-Hull area. The planning has all been done and the land has been acquired. This government should allow the federal district commission, properly financed, to proceed with these parkways.

I understand that the cost of the parkway from Lazy bay to Britannia would be under $2 million, but that expenditure would afford a great deal of relief to unemployment in this area and at the same time would provide the national capital with one of the most beautiful parkways in its proposed plan.

There is another matter that interests us a great deal, namely the matter of transportation in the city of Ottawa. In an ordinary city, of course, this would not be a matter of interest to the federal government or should not relate itself to the federal government. I am sure that one of the greatest problems that has been facing the Ottawa transportation system over the past few years has been the fact that the government buildings have been decentralized. This has given rise to the creation of new systems of transportation by bus over new routes which pay at the peak hours but are not paying at all at other hours. In any event, this same system of transportation is one that must provide civil servants with transportation to buildings in Tunney's Pasture, the national research building and the Central Mortgage and Housing Corporation building as well as other establishments. Then, of course, there will be this new area near Hog's Back where the government is erecting more office buildings.

This service is now operated at a loss to the Ottawa transportation commission, and I believe the time has come for the government to think about paying a standby service charge to the Ottawa transportation commission on an annual basis in much the same way as grants are paid under the Municipal Grants Act.

I would also suggest to the government that it take great care to study the methods followed in acquiring land for the purpose of the national capital plan. The Expropriation Act in its present form is, in my opinion, a very unfair instrument and should be used sparingly. I have repeatedly requested the Minister of Justice to study the Expropriation Act and the methods of acquiring land by the Department of Public Works and the federal district commission. I hope I will be more successful in the present parliament, especially in view of the fact that it is proposed by this government in the speech from the throne to acquire a great acreage of land, known as the green belt, outside of the limits of the city of Ottawa.

(Translation):

Mr. Speaker, I should like also to address myself to the government and ask the Minister of Finance (Mr. Fleming) to help our university and college students. I suggest that more scholarships be granted our students through the medium of the Federation of Universities rather than through the medium of politicians. I would also suggest to the Minister of Finance to allow parents of students to deduct, for income tax purposes, the expenses incurred either in the way of tuition fees, books, instruments or living costs while studying in other cities.

You know as well as I do, Mr. Speaker, that the situation of the students is very difficult this year. Having no work to help them out, hundreds and perhaps even thousands of them will not have the required funds next fall to carry on their studies. And in addition to that, I noted recently that the Department of National Defence had given instructions not to employ for more than two week periods university students graduated as officers. This is a pity, because those students, apart from being good officer material and able to improve their training, thus indirectly received the amounts enabling them to continue their studies in the universities.

Finally, Canada is always spoken of as a great nation and a lot is also said about national unity and the part we play in the world. I am only referring briefly again to this matter. I am in favour of a distinctive national flag. I hope that during the present parliament, hon. members will express their views and preferences on the subject. Ten

The Address-Mr. McFarlane years from now, we shall celebrate the centenary of the Canadian Confederation. We are proclaiming ourselves everywhere as one nation; but, in order to rally the people, we must have a distinctive flag. It is up to us to take action so that all Canadians may proudly salute their country's flag and make this emblem known and respected by every other nation in the world.

(Text):

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PC

Murray Lincoln McFarlane

Progressive Conservative

Mr. M. L. McFarlane (Kootenay East):

Mr. Speaker, I would like at this time to add my belated congratulations to you personally on. your election to the office that you now hold. Being a new member of this august assembly and from what I have noticed during the past two weeks I sincerely feel, Mr. Speaker,, that you will preside with impartiality and justice to all hon. members. I also wish to express my best wishes to the Deputy Speaker and to the deputy chairman of committees of the whole house. I am sure that could the constituents of Kootenay East, whom I represent, be present in the galleries they would also feel that no more competent choices could be made at the opening of the house than that of the incumbents of those positions in this house.

I also wish to congratulate the mover (Mr. Lafreniere) and the seconder (Mr. Nielsen) of the address in reply to the speech from the throne. Naturally I am not in full agreement with all of their suggestions but I am convinced that many of them are worthy of consideration at the proper time.

Firstly, I would like to express publicly my appreciation to the supporters from Kootenay East. I wish to thank the key men in the various parts of our constituency and also all those who contributed in any way toward my election and my presence here today. Had it not been for the policies presented by the other candidates in our constituency, who promised everything from the cradle to the grave, things would have been different. During our campaign the constituents in many instances preferred forums and after listening to the other three candidates present their programs and promises there was little left for me to promise any of my constituents. All that I promised was good government, and I am certain that the Prime Minister (Mr. Diefenbaker) will carry out the promise that I made at that time.

I would like to thank the Prime Minister publicly for his leadership of the Conservative party. When the history of parliament is written we shall And that he will head the list as one of Canada's leading statesmen. I should also like publicly to thank the Minister of Transport (Mr. Hees) and the Minister of

The Address-Mr. McFarlane Agriculture (Mr. Harkness) for their assistance during the election campaign.

The constituency of Kootenay East is situated in the southeastern section of the province of British Columbia and is one of the least known sections of the province, although it is approximately 300 miles long and 200 miles wide, including approximately 50,000 square miles of territory. Victoria, the capital of British Columbia, considers that the province consists of Vancouver and the lower mainland. Any place in the interior is riot considered. In Ottawa we are likewise unknown which is substantiated by the fact that little has been done for the constituency during the past 20 years. In many instances the people of Alberta feel that Kootenay East is a part of Alberta and is a wealthy section.

We have a very difficult constituency to cover and when the election was called on February 1, I had a vision of campaigning in inclement weather over slippery roads, through heavy snows and rough weather to boot. But, true to the tradition of the Conservative party, the Prime Minister lived up to his promises and gave us typical Diefenbaker weather as a promise of better things to come. This type of weather had not been known in the Kootenays since the last Conservative government.

In order to assist the people in the area and also the people from Vancouver and Vancouver Centre, Mr. Speaker, I should like to familiarize you with the promised land and I should like to take you on a short tour of Kootenay East.

In the southern section of the Kootenay we have our agricultural assets. In this area we grow apples, soft fruits, wheat, grains of all kinds and hay. Here we produce the best apples in Canada. At the present time we have 15,000 acres under wheat cultivation on reclaimed land which also grows many kinds of other grains including, as I stated before, our hay crop. It is hoped that the Minister of Agriculture will consider support prices for the products of this district. We are especially proud of our apple crop but in order to survive we must be able to dispose of our produce.

The fruit industry in the Creston valley can supply sufficient apples for the three western provinces but owing to provincial regulations the export out of the province Is confined and many thousands of pounds of apples are left to waste for lack of markets which are available in the prairies provinces. With proper legislation we could place apples in every home in the prairie provinces at a price that the consumer could afford to pay. It is now possible, by the fast movement of transportation from the producing areas to the consumer areas, that fruit on the trees

today can be on the consumer's table tomorrow. We should give a great deal of thought to this feature of our economy. For many years we have lived in an era whereby transportation was a main item but now times have changed and I think our legislation should be brought up to date. We must make possible the disposition of our fruit products so that our farmers can survive, and I feel that now is the time to take the necessary action. This is a major factor in helping to re-establish and to increase fruit farming in the Kootenay valley.

Next on our tour through Kootenay East, Mr. Speaker, I should like to take you into my home town of Cranbrook. Here we have an aggressive community with a population of 6,000 and serving another 2,000 in the immediate rural area. It is an exceptionally good tourist centre. We have a beautiful municipal tourist park and many other tourist centres in the area. It is a natural stop between Spokane, Washington and Banff, Alberta and our tourist importance is increasing year by year. The city itself is well laid out, with wide streets and all facilities. Taking it all in all, it is one of the most progressive cities in the interior. Our airport is open all the year round and is kept in excellent condition by our city employees. At this time I should like to request the Minister of Transport seriously to consider our request to lengthen the runways for the larger planes that are now required for the increasing traffic.

On leaving Cranbrook I should like to take you to the little city of Kimberley, twenty miles to the north, the home of the largest lead and zinc mine in the world, with the concentrator and fertilizer plants nearby. Here we also have a very progressive community with a population of 9,000. The homes are attractive and well looked after. They also have an excellent militia force but are lacking in facilities. I have been advised that the new armoury building which was to have been built last year has been cancelled. I respectfully request, that the Minister of National Defence (Mr. Pearkes) reconsider the request of the Kimberley unit and the Kimberley people for an armoury in that city. A visit to Kimberley is a "must" when in the district. The welcome mat is out to visitors at any time.

On leaving Kimberley, Mr. Speaker, I wish to take you up to the beautiful Windermere valley. We have two hot springs in this area, one privately owned and one located in the national park at Redman. This is a beautiful area and I would certainly recommend a visit to this section of our constituency. Owing to the increasing number of tourists passing through the park last year-there were over

700,000 last year-I would request that some consideration should be given by the Minister of Northern Affairs and National Resources (Mr. Hamilton) to the park facilities in this area. This will be a major item in the not too distant future, which will further be aggravated by the completion of the trans-Canada highway which passes through that area.

Also in the valley we have the headwaters of the Columbia and the Kootenay rivers. Many years ago a canal was constructed between the two rivers, with the thought in mind that this would lead to navigation and development of both the Kootenay and Columbia rivers. Old timers of that area advise me that only one boat passed through the canal and that since that time it has gradually deteriorated into disuse. At the present time we are still waiting for the decision of the governments of Canada and the United States as to the construction of the Libby dam in Montana in the United States. A considerable study was made of the water systems of Eritish Columbia and special attention was paid to the construction of Libby dam and the upstream benefits which British Columbia would derive from the construction of this dam. The study was made by the international joint commission and, after two years, was completed in 1950. For eight years we in the Kootenay have waited for some action on the part of the federal government to complete this dam.

Also there is the matter of the proposed construction of Mica dam on the Columbia river in the northern part of the Kootenay area. I would also request the Minister of Northern Affairs and National Resources to finalize this work. We are in need of power in Kootenay East. Without power we are in a position of not being able to bring in industry or to bring in the various items that would contribute to the economy of our area.

On returning to my home town I should like to take you out to the city of Fernie. The city of Fernie at the present time is, or I should say was, a coal mining area. Last February the mines closed and we are now hoping and very seriously asking for the support of the government to assist in sponsoring new development along other lines. Had the government during the past twenty years had the vision which the Prime Minister has at the present time and which is required for good administration, the coal situation, especially in the Crowsnest pass area and in the areas of Alberta would not be in the dire situation in which it is today. The handwriting was on the wall in large letters ten years ago when the railways converted to oil burning locomotives, thus practically eliminating the commercial market. The domestic market for coal is not sufficient to keep the

The Address-Mr. McFarlane mines operating except for a short time during the winter months. No action was taken by the previous government to make available a substitute industry to replace the coal industry which up to 1947 was a major item in the economy of Kootenay East. I am of the opinion that this area should be classed as a distress area and that immediate action should be taken by the Minister of Public Works (Mr. Green) and the Minister of Transport to alleviate the unemployment situation.

Fernie is a one-industry town. They have depended on the coal industry since early in the 1900's in order to maintain their city. We must have some other means by which to take up the slack until new developments are made or new industries come into the area.

I believe, personally, that at some future time, perhaps not in our generation but a little later, coal will once again come into its own, not as a heating product but as a component for manufacturing other commodities. I would urge this government to give serious consideration to the many sug-questions that have been made in this connection. It is my belief that many of the suggestions made by various interested parties in the Fernie district are quite feasible.

I should like also to make reference to the gas pipe lines. We are now in the midst of running gas pipe lines all over this great Canada of ours. Trunk lines are being established in Alberta, and in many cases they will go through the southern section of British Columbia. I would ask the Minister of Transport to make sure that when any future contracts are let for the construction of pipe lines to our area the gas will be available to the residents of British Columbia and that the rates charged will be comparable to that charged consumers at the other end of the pipe line.

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CCF

Harold Edward Winch

Co-operative Commonwealth Federation (C.C.F.)

Mr. Winch:

And not more than that cost.

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PC

Murray Lincoln McFarlane

Progressive Conservative

Mr. McFarlane:

I might mention that there is quite a difference between the cost and the rate.

The next subject to which I shall refer is a trans-Canada highway. This highway has, as yet, not been completed. I want to tell the Minister of National Defence and the Minister of Public Works that we have waited for 20 years to have a trans-Canada highway through our section of the country. There are practically 40 miles of new road to be constructed before the trans-Canada highway will be completed in British Columbia. This trans-Canada highway would be useless in time of need because, at the moment one has to use a ferry which takes 40 minutes to cover a short distance.

The Address-Mr. R. Muir

I should like to remind all hon. members that this year is the centennial of British Columbia. I do not know whether or not the federal government has made any plans to have members of the various constituencies present at some of the centennial functions. However, I would suggest that representatives of the various districts be given permission to attend functions and represent the federal government during this centennial year.

In spite of the many local problems that exist in our constituencies I believe that we are now well past the many hurdles in forming a new Canadianism. As a result of a peaceful revolution by the electors on March 31 of this year the Conservative party has been granted a mandate to bring the Canadian people out of the doldrums in which they have been for a considerable time. Many of our problems have been brought about by the lack of forethought by the previous administration, but under the leadership we now have our lost prestige can be restored and Canada may once again take her place as one of the leading nations of the world.

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PC

Robert Muir

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Robert Muir (Cape Breton North and Victoria):

I rise at this time, Mr. Speaker, to take part in this debate, and in doing so I deem it a pleasure and a privilege to congratulate you upon your re-election to the high position which you now hold. I should like to concur in the remarks of the many hon. members who have preceded me when they mentioned your fine qualities which so aptly fit you for your high office. May I also join with other hon. members in extending my best wishes to the hon. member for Longueuil (Mr. Sevigny) upon his appointment as Deputy Speaker, and to the hon. member for Spadina (Mr. Rea) upon his election as deputy chairman of committees. I have not any doubt that they will bring honour and dignity to the positions they now hold or that they will rule justly and fairly.

I should like also at this time to extend my congratulations to the mover (Mr. Lafre-niere) and seconder (Mr. Nielsen) of the address in reply to the speech from the throne upon the excellent manner in which they carried out their first assignment in this house. Their constituents can well be proud of their representatives.

My first words in this debate must be words of gratitude to the electors of my riding for once again placing their faith in me and sending me back to this house as their representative. I shall do my utmost to justify the confidence they have placed in me.

In his remarks the other day the hon. member for Queens-Lunenburg (Mr. Crouse)

[Mr. MeFarlane.l

cited many firsts to the credit of the province of Nova Scotia. I should like now to mention another that occurred in my own constituency of Cape Breton North and Victoria. I refer to the landing of John Cabot on the North American continent. I doubt if the hon. members from Newfoundland will appreciate my remarks on this subject. However, since I am not an authority on the matter I shall refer them to those who are. I would direct your attention to the following paragraph which appears in the Encyclopaedia Britannica, eleventh edition, volumes 3-4, page 922:

Cabot set sail from Bristol on Tuesday, the 2nd of May, 1497 on board a ship called the "Mathew", manned by 18 men. At length, after being 52 days at sea, at five o'clock on Saturday morning, June 24, they reached the northern extremity of Cape Breton Island. The royal banner was unfurled, and in solemn form Cabot took possession of the country In the name of King Henry VII. Cape North was named "Cape Discovery", and St. Paul island, which lies opposite, was called the island of St. John.

I know that all historians do not agree as to the actual site of the Cabot landfall but the preponderance of historical findings point to Cape North in northern Cape Breton. This location is the one most generally accepted today. A few of the authorities who favour Cape Breton are as follows: Dr. S. E. Dawson, Royal Society of Canada; Rev. M. Harvey, LL.D., St. John's, Newfoundland; Mon. d'Avezac, Geographical Society of France; Dr. Charles Deane, Boston; Sir John Bourinot, C.M.G., a widely recognized authority in this house; J. Carson Breevort, Astor library, and J. F. Nieholls, city librarian, Bristol, England. I may say that there are many others.

I should like also to refer to an article that appeared in the national geographical society magazine, the issue of April, 1949, on this subject. An excerpt from that article is as follows:

The world map of Juan de la Cosa, compiled in 1500 shows the English exploration of the North American coast from Cape Breton, Nova Scotia, to Long island.

I do not wish to take up any more of the time of the house at this point, but I do feel that this information should be on the record.

I desire now to turn to the subject of housing. I am sure all hon. members were pleased to learn in the speech from the throne that this government was continuing a vigorous program of house-building. In order to fulfil this program an additional $350 million has been voted. The Minister of Public Works (Mr. Green) is to be commended upon the fine work he is doing in this connection. However, I should like to draw the minister's attention to the fact that the people of my riding are not benefiting to any degree from this legislation.

It has been said that this money will be used for direct loans in small centres and also that it is not the intention of the government to have these Canadians by passed, but it is my firm belief that many such people have been by passed because they cannot meet the stringent regulations of the act, even with the amendments of recent date. That is the reason for the small percentage of housing starts in the province of Nova Scotia. The people themselves are certainly not to blame and I have personal knowledge of a number of such people who have approached the lending institutions without success because of the reluctance of these same institutions to do business with them.

I would ask the minister to give this urgent problem his most serious consideration with an eye toward investigating the situation very thoroughly. We can sit here and vote some more millions but that would certainly not be beneficial to those who need it most because they are unable to take advantage of the legislation for the reasons I have already mentioned.

There are many people in this category in my own constituency. While on the subject of housing, I would like to deal briefly with a problem confronting approximately 60 to 75 coal miners who are at the present time in my home town of Sydney Mines, Nova Scotia. These men have been transferred from the Springhill disaster area in Nova Scotia to the Princess colliery at Sydney Mines for the purpose of employment. Many of them are the heads of families and they have had to leave their homes in Springhill, thus contributing to a serious housing shortage in my town. A great number of them came through the hell of a mine explosion, which is certainly bad enough, but they are now faced with the bleak prospect of having nowhere to go. I would ask the minister to have a representative of Central Mortgage and Housing Corporation go into this area to meet with the civic, company and the union officials and to lend assistance and give advice with a view to finding a solution to the problem of these men. It is only within the last few days that I have had a further request for assistance in this matter from the hon. Stephen T. Pyke, minister of public works for the province of Nova Scotia.

At this point I had intended to spend some time in discussing the Port Edward naval base, which has already been mentioned in this house, but today the hon. member for Cape Breton South (Mr. Mac-Innes) and myself have been informed by the Department of National Defence that the

The Address-Mr. R. Muir Algerine class coastal escort H.M.C.S. Wal-laceburg, which has been held in reserve will be refitted at the Port Edward naval base, Sydney, Nova Scotia. The refitting of this ship will employ practically the whole of the complement of the base for a period of some four months. In addition it is announced that a contract in the amount of over $500,000 has been let for a new steam heat system for the naval base. Construction work on this project is expected to commence shortly and will, as far as possible, utilize the local labour force.

We were very pleased indeed to receive this information, which is of great importance to the people of the area to know that they may be kept on their jobs. As I have said, we are very grateful, but this is only a stopgap. I referred to this base in the debate on the address in reply to the speech from the throne last year and at that time I suggested to the minister concerned that something of a permanent nature should be established. It is most unfortunate that we have to engage in a war before the value of this base is realized and I am still of the opinion that there should be a dispersal of naval units from some other parts of the country to this area. I would once again urge the minister and the government in the interval to give every consideration to this suggestion before any harsh steps are taken with respect to this base.

While on this subject I might say that it has been brought to my attention on several occasions that some sections of the press and also some people in writing to the press have inferred that the quality of the work performed at this base has been inferior. This inference applies to the work performed on ships turned over to the Turkish government under the Mutual Aid program, and such statements are to my mind bred from ignorance of the facts. Let me say for the record here and now that we have as capable and as killed workmen at this base as are to be found anywhere in Canada, and any allegations to the contrary have been refuted officially by both the representatives of the Turkish embassy and of the Royal Canadian Navy. Statements of this nature do nothing to enhance the good name of Cape Bretoners and I would suggest that in the future anyone making a statement of like nature should first search out the true facts.

I would now like to say a word about coal. Coming from a coal mining area I was very pleased with the recent announcements with respect to an increase in the coal subvention and, as I understand it, the maximum assistance payable in the future on shipments from the maritimes to central Canada will be $5.?'

The Address-Mr. R. Muir instead of $4.75 for rail and water movements and 65 per cent of freight rates instead of 45 per cent for all rail movements. This should give our coal a better advantage in competing against United States coal in Ontario than it has had in the past. In addition, there was an offer to pay $4 per ton on the movement of coal to Europe.

These announcements, following the passing of legislation during the last session of parliament with respect to a plan for subsidizing coal used in the production of power in the Atlantic provinces, are further indications of the special consideration given by the Prime Minister (Mr. Diefenbaker) to our problems in the provinces by the sea. Such assistance is very welcome and I repeat we are truly grateful.

May I say, however, that we have just scratched the surface of the problems affecting the coal industry. The coal miners of Nova Scotia have co-operated to the fullest extent and, as a result, the production per man has greatly increased. This increase in production, together with a decrease in the markets, has contributed to a surplus stock which at the present time is close to one million tons. This condition is not a healthy one and I would suggest that this government should take steps to have the powers of the dominion coal board expanded to include an aggressive policy for finding markets for coal.

The matter of subventions remains one of the most important factors in the survival and the progress of our coal industry. It is the opinion of those most closely connected with the problems of the industry that subventions should be placed on a five-year guaranteed basis, instead of on the present basis of renewal from year to year. I understand that the operators state they cannot sell coal to customers on long-term contracts while subventions are guaranteed for only one year at a time. There is great hope of finding new markets in Britain or on the continent of Europe, but it is risky to enter into a long-term contract with the British coal board or with European firms without the assurance that subvention payments will continue for the full term of such a contract. As a result, coal producers are now handicapped in their attempts to sell coal in these markets.

One of the most serious drawbacks to the coal industry during the past few years has been the competition of oil as a fuel. Most of such oil comes from Venezuela although some imported crudes come from the United States. I would suggest that a tariff on this type of fuel be considered in order to enable the maritime coal industry to recapture some of the markets lost to oil.

[Mr. Muir (Cape Breton North and Victoria).!

The people who depend on coal for a livelihood feel, and rightly so, that all government supported institutions and buildings should, whenever possible, be heated with coal. I would like to say in passing that it is rather ironic that last year we imported something in the vicinity of 20 million tons of coal while the miners of Nova Scotia and elsewhere were working on a part-time basis. Not only that, we have seen whole communities abandoned because the mines have closed down.

Before leaving this subject may I say there is no doubt that the maritime coal industry could be stabilized and made a prosperous part of our economy if it had the support of all concerned.

May I say that the use of oil in any of the thermal plants that are to be built in the maritimes could not be called support of the coal industry. If there were a shortage of coal, all well and good; oil could then be used. But let us wait until we have that shortage. As I understand it, when the power development program was originally announced its main purpose was to provide low cost electricity and new markets for a sick coal industry. If I remember correctly, it was once stated that it would do much to ensure that coal produced in the maritime provinces would continue to be used and that it would not be replaced by oil brought in from foreign lands.

Now it appears this is not the case, and may I say that I would be remiss in my duties to my constituents if I did not view this situation with alarm and raise my voice in protest at this time. Realizing that this may possibly not be a popular stand, I further realize that this is not a popularity contest, and as long as I am a representative for Cape Breton North and Victoria I shall raise my voice on behalf of my people whenever the need arises, regardless of what government is in power.

And now a word about telephones. I should like to bring the following problem to the attention of the Minister of Transport (Mr. Hees) whose department looks after the government telephone service or at least is supposed to look after it. I am sorry the minister is not in his place now, but I presume he will read what I have said when it is printed in Hansard. In the Washabuck area of Victoria county there are occasions when there is no service for days at a time. Indeed, but for the fact that the people of the area erect very substantial fence posts along the highway, plus the assistance received from trees and stumps, I really do not know what would carry the telephone lines. We have the problem of too many phones

on one circuit, and at the first sign of a heavy dew, a slight wind, or rain or snow, the line is out. We hear some people talking about selling the C.B.C. I should be very happy if they would sell this telephone line, or at least give it away to some company that would maintain it properly. As Washa-buck is a rather isolated area, a telephone is an absolute necessity.

We also have an unsatisfactory situation existing at Little Narrows in Victoria county. For years the subscribers there have had 24-hour service until several months ago. At that time-and I suppose it was all in the spirit of progress-the department increased the subscribers' fees by $9 annually and reduced the service to the following nours: week days from 9.00 a.m. to 12.00 noon, from 1.00 p.m. to 6.00 p.m., then from 7.00 to

8.00 p.m. Sundays and holidays, a much more limited service. And this is in an area where we have a gypsum operation employing approximately 200 men. These limited hours of service impose a great hardship on the employees, on the company in carrying out their business, and on the citizens of the area in general. I am quite sure that the people of Little Narrows definitely do not want to go back to the horse and buggy days of telephone service, even if the department has a tendency to operate in that manner. I would urge the minister to have this situation remedied.

The great Alexander Graham Bell lies on top of Beinn Breagh just outside the town of Baddeck, and a few miles from the communities of Washabuck and Little Narrows. I doubt if he would rest very peacefully if he knew what was being done with his great gift to mankind.

Much has been said by a number of hon. members as to the merits of their individual constituencies. Time would not permit me to give even in limited detail some of the beauties and attractions of Cape Breton North and Victoria, but then again the fame of the highlands of Canada has spread far and wide and is quite well known to tourist and traveller alike. I should like to quote an article which appeared in the Halifax Chronicle Herald in this regard and which I feel has been well written. It is entitled "Cape Breton Provides Endless Tourist Interest" and reads as follows:

Cape Breton's historic and old world associations provide an endless interest and variety of entertainment for the cultured and enquiring mind. Cape Breton's scenic beauty has stirred the hearts and tongues of visitors to eloquent expression, has attracted artists from all over America. Cape Breton's natural recreational facilities were a main consideration in the establishment of Cape Breton Highlands National Park.

A French writer of the seventeenth century spent some time in Cape Breton. On his return to

The Address-Mr. J. A. Richard France he wrote: "Cape Breton is a very beautiful land on the coast of Acadia, where there are plains and prairies, valleys and hills and lakes and rivers, vast forests filled with oak, maple, cedar, and the finest fir trees in the world." Writers of today relate that Cape Breton is a part of Nova Scotia possessing dramatic beauty, distinct in character and different in tradition.

Cape Breton is still predominantly highland Scottish in its population. Here can be heard the old Celtic tongue that has sounded the slogan of the Highland clans on every battlefield of the empire; "a speech that fits the Highlander's mouth to a nicety, that becomes him like his kilt and bonnet; a speech adapted to a fine long grace before meals or to a lusty war cry that startles the very eagles in their eyries."

Thank you for listening. I hope to have an opportunity at a later date to take part in further deliberations of this house.

(Translation):

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LIB

Joseph-Adolphe Richard

Liberal

Mr. J. A. Richard (St. Maurice-Lafleche):

Mr. Speaker, it is with a great deal of emotion and with feelings of the deepest national pride that I rise to speak in this house.

May I be allowed, at the outset, to join those members who have spoken before me in offering my sincere congratulations to the mover (Mr. Lafreniere) and the seconder (Mr. Nielsen) of the address in reply to the speech from the throne and to say to you that they have both acquitted themselves well.

The speech from the throne no doubt forecasts a number of highly important subjects for the economic development and the general welfare of this country and I am convinced that all members of this house are most anxious to carry out the heavy responsibilities which are theirs as representatives of their fellow citizens, following in so doing the dictates of their conscience and never losing faith in the common weal and the general interest.

May I send a word of greeting at this point to the people of the whole constituency of St. Maurice-Lafleche, that extensive and fine area which I have the honour and privilege of representing in this house. I thank them most cordially for the confidence they have placed in me.

I also offer my congratulations to you, Mr. Speaker, on your appointment to the post which you occupy with such dignity, as well as to those who have been honoured with important appointments in Her Majesty's new government.

Mr. Speaker, I now come to my subject. I intend acquainting the house with the St. Maurice area and, more particularly, with the constituency of St. Maurice-Lafleche whose representative I am. I will attempt to be as brief as possible, after which I will put for-

The Address-Mr. J. A. Richard ward my suggestions for the industrial, agricultural and tourist development of this fine corner of my province.

In my constituency there are three main industrial centres, situated all three on the St. Maurice river and whose total population is in excess of 80,000. First of all, the population of the city of Shawinigan Falls, my home town, has already exceeded 38,000 inhabitants, not including the suburbs. Shawinigan South, known as the largest town in Canada, with a population of 12,000 people is practically part of the city of Shawinigan Falls. I point out in passing that this town of

12.000 people has no industry. Its people earn their living in the industries of Shawinigan Falls. I glady invite anyone interested to visit Shawinigan Falls. I believe it would be the finest place to establish a small industry. Shawinigan Falls is situated 20 miles from Three Rivers. Though it is only 57 years old, it is the princess city of the St. Maurice valley. Its people hope that before long it will be the queen of the St. Maurice valley though that may not please my colleague the hon. member for Three Rivers (Mr. Balcer).

You will find in our city a peace-loving, hard working people and qualified labour.

Besides the power stations of the Shawinigan Water and Power Company, we have pulp and paper mills, aluminum factories, textile mills and electro-chemical products, manufacturers of great importance such as the Shawinigan Chemicals, the Canadian Resins, the first of those two industries manufacturing carbide, stainless steel, acetylene, etc. and the second manufacturing vinylites and synthetic resins. We also have the Canadian Industries Limited and the DuPont Company of Canada Limited, the Canadian Carborundum, the latter being known throughout the country for the manufacture of grinding wheels and emery cutters. In the textile field, there are two companies, the Wabasso Cotton Company and the Canadian Converters. There are also about 20 other secondary industries which, with those already mentioned, provide jobs for the population.

The town of Grand Mere today is separated from Shawinigan Falls by an imaginary line, as it were, since, due to the expansion of these two sister cities, houses have multiplied everywhere along the road between the two industrial centres.

The population of Grand Mere is over

15.000 and its main industries are paper mills, electricity, textiles and footwear. The town owes its name to a rather unusual phenomenon; with the centuries no doubt, a huge rock representing the head of a grandmother had emerged at the centre of the St. Maurice river. This rock has been carefully brought

[Mr. Richard (St. Maurice-Lafleche).1

down and reconstructed in an ideal location and is now a very precious monument for the town which bears its name; Grand Mere.

Farther north, at a distance of about 60 miles, always on the St. Maurice river, we have the attractive town of La Tuque whose population is also over 15,000 and is dependent for its livelihood on an important paper mill and many other private concerns. Electricity is also produced there.

All around the three cities I just mentioned, there are 27 rural parishes. This means that the farmers of the area have the advantage of markets close by for their products and, in spite of all their difficulties, that is very helpful to them.

May I point out also that the St. Maurice valley, with its broad fields, its fine mountains, its forests where there is plenty of game, its lakes with fish a-plenty, is the admiration and the delight of lovers of the outdoors. The tourist going into this area is struck with wonderment, he extends his stay and invariably comes back. The area offers all facilities for industrial development, which led an important engineer to state at the convention of professional engineers held recently in Shawinigan Falls, that the St. Maurice area has witnessed such an expansion in the last 30 years that it deserves to be called the industrial valley of Canada. Is this not an eloquent testimony to the participation of our region in Canadian industry? Hydro-electric power has always been a great factor in this quick development and is still the prime mover of all our industries. In fact, along a 125 mile run on the St. Maurice river, we find seven power plants of a total capacity of some three million horse-power.

What I just described to you, Mr. Speaker, is the achievements of a hard working and intelligent population. I have tried, Mr. Speaker, to describe the important development of the St. Maurice valley area, which is part of the constituency of St. Maurice-Lafleche which I represent here. It has been a constant development with the exception of the depression period from 1930 to 1936 which, at home, we agree to call the Conservative depression era, which is now repeating itself. I should like, Mr. Speaker, to talk about the situation in my constituency. From August of last year, our industries started laying off employees and slowing down their production and, since then, that unfortunate laying off process has gone on increasingly, to such an extent that in the area covered by the unemployment insurance office in Shawinigan Falls we have over 7,000 unemployed who are drawing regular or

supplementary unemployment benefits. However, there is also another category of unemployed but, apparently, we can hardly determine their number. They are those who have exhausted their benefits. Several of them came to my office and are looking for a job.

I am informed that in the unemployment insurance office the applications of that category of unemployed are filed for only two weeks and it is often those people who are the most dependent upon such benefits, since they have no other help coming to them. Therefore, I would suggest to the minister concerned to consider the possibility of including that category of unemployed with those eligible for supplementary benefits.

That is not all. The town of La Tuque which is part of my constituency and is served by its own unemployment insurance office, has at least the same proportion of unemployed as Shawinigan Falls. I heard a moment ago that the paper mill of La Tuque must further reduce its production, a situation which cannot fail increasing the already alarming number of unemployed.

Mr. Speaker, I wonder what is the cause of that situation; there is still the same number of people to feed and to clothe, and as many families to provide for. Could it not be that the numerous immoderate promises of the Progressive Conservatives in the last election have created some uncertainty and uneasiness among our industrialists? According to our opponents, everything was to change for the better.

I remember hearing my opponent during the election of 1957, at Three Rivers, at a great Conservative rally, criticize the Liberal government for its surplus of over $500 million in the fiscal year 1956-57. And he said: "Elect us, ladies and gentlemen, and we promise to cut the expenses of the present Liberal administration by at least $700 million; added to a surplus of $500 million, this will mean that a sum of $1,200 million will be returned to you by means of tax reductions". Well, Mr. Speaker, what happened? The surplus of $500 million has melted or has been distributed; there have been no savings and we are awaiting the introduction of a budget involving a probable deficit of $600 to $700 million, according to the press. There is the result of those promises.

I must also mention, Mr. Speaker, the irresponsible statements of the Prime Minister (Mr. Diefenbaker) about the diversion of part 57071-3-35

The Address-Mr. J. A. Richard of our trade from the United States to the United Kingdom. I have no objection to an increase of our trade with England; that is all very well but I believe that we must keep the markets we already hold while trying to find others. These were unfortunate statements whose effects cannot easily be assessed.

Now, Mr. Speaker, 1 shall try to make a few suggestions which might help the economic recovery of our country and provide work for the unemployed.

The speech from the throne mentions large amounts of public works, well over 1,180 million. Now, I know from experience that such projects are not the answer to our present urgent needs. They require a great deal of preparatory work which takes a long time.

We have, at home, and in many other places, problems that are quite difficult to solve and, when quoting the following instance, I shall point out the sore spot in many of our municipalities. The central government has created a body called the Central Mortgage and Housing Corporation for the purpose of stimulating the building of homes, which had become a national need. To my mind, this body has filled the need. It has been a success and has rendered considerable service to our people. But, while fulfilling its function, this organization has created difficulties for the municipalities involved, since the latter have to provide municipal services to these communities. Several single family units cover as much ground on a street as one multiple dwelling unit but, from the assessment point of view, brings in far smaller returns. The municipality has to provide every service such as sewers, waterworks, street paving, sidewalks and lighting, plus supervision and maintenance. This is far too heavy a task because of the relatively light population of these extensive areas. This is the case in my constituency. Would it not be possible to create some kind of institution under the C.M.H.C., which would be authorized to enter into agreements with the provinces and municipalities involved and to lend them money at reduced interest rates in cases of need? This would allow going ahead with all urgent works and would provide employment to large numbers of workers on the spot. I would ask the minister concerned to take under serious consideration this suggestion which I believe to be progressive.

As regards my constituency more particularly, I would ask the Minister of Public

The Address-Mr. J. A. Richard Works (Mr. Green), if possible, to speed up the construction of the federal building in Shawinigan Falls. If I am not mistaken, tenders are to be called in the course of next month and right after that the contract is to be awarded. Post office employees have been working in substandard conditions for a long time already; this project has already been fully considered and is ready to be carried out.

Moreover, there is an urgent need for a federal building in Grand Mere. I would ask the minister to consider this request and to act upon it with the least possible delay.

In La Tuque, there is a special case. The municipality, wishing to extend its main street sewer system along the existing landing field, would require a grant-in-aid in proportion with the amount of tax revenue it would have drawn from buildings that would normally have been erected on that side of the street now occupied by this landing field. A request to that effect has already been filed and I wish to repeat it here.

Allow me, Mr. Speaker, to turn now to the Minister of Transport (Mr. Hees). The Canadian National station at Grand Mere is in a deplorable condition and I know that a plan is under way to restore it; I had been promised, as it were, that it would be done before 1958. I dare hope the minister will heed that request and that this plan which would contribute to reduce unemployment there will be implemented.

I agree entirely with my leader (Mr. Pearson) when he says that the only way to deal with the present situation is to leave as much money as possible in circulation; I add that it would be a good thing to give back more money to our population by increasing family allowances and extending them up to the age of 18 for students. I would also ask the hon. Minister of National Revenue (Mr. Nowlan) to amend the personal income tax act by increasing the basic exemption to $3,000 for heads of families and to $1,500 for single people.

This is surely one of the best ways to put money back into people's hands, and assure its maximum circulation.

I feel I have fulfilled my obligations towards the citizens I have been representing for several years already.

The suggestions I made prove that, while serving the citizens of my constituency to the

best of my ability, I also want to co-operate in the efficient discharge of the duties of this house.

Before resuming my seat, I want to congratulate my leader for his effort during the last election campaign, which was carried out under the most difficult circumstances, and I want to assure him that he can count at all times on my most loyal support.

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PC

Vincent Brassard

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Vincent Brassard (Chicoutimi):

Mr. Speaker, it seems to be the custom to say a few words of praise about the Speaker of the house. I therefore very willingly associate myself with all previous speakers in offering you my most sincere congratulations on your re-election to this post. If I do so, it is not because it is customary, but because the last few days I have spent here have given me the opportunity to appreciate, at their real worth, your eminent qualities of impartiality and your noble dignity. I have also noted your unlimited patience and kindness towards the new members who are not very familiar with the very complex procedure of the house. Therefore, please accept my regards, Mr. Speaker, and be assured of my entire co-operation.

I should not want to forget the Deputy Speaker of the house (Mr. Sevigny) who bears a predestined name. I congratulate him on his nomination which, I may say, pleased the whole province of Quebec.

As for the vice-chairman of committees, I beg him to accept my regards, on behalf of the whole population of my constituency.

I have nothing but admiration for the mover (Mr. Lafreniere) and seconder (Mr. Nielsen) of the address in reply to the speech from the throne. Coming, so to say, from the two opposite ends of the country, they both struck a note that bodes well for national unity.

I welcomed, as did all my fellow members and the whole province of Quebec, the appointment of the Minister of Defence Production (Mr. O'Hurley) and of the Secretary of State (Mr. Courtemanche). At the opening of parliament, Mr. Speaker, this was the best gift the right hon. Prime Minister (Mr. Diefenbaker) could make to the province of Quebec. I feel it my duty to thank him and also to congratulate the incumbents of these very important posts within the cabinet.

I have the honour to represent, Mr. Speaker, whatever my fellow representatives

may say, the most beautiful riding in the whole of Canada.

We who live under Her Gracious Majesty Queen Elizabeth II, can take pride in the fact that we are probably the only true royalists in Canada since, for as long as anybody can remember, we have been calling our area the kingdom of the Saguenay. It is in truth a very prolific kingdom since in the space of a few decades the original constituency of Chicoutimi-Sague-nay has given birth to four new constituencies.

While I make no claim to be a historian, Mr. Speaker, I would like to be allowed to say a few words about the history of that part of our country in order to call attention to the merits of our fathers and to explain the state of mind of our people.

At the beginning of the 19th century the whole area known-or rather unknown-as the kingdom of the Saguenay was the exclusive preserve of the Hudson's Bay Company which carried on the fur trade there and allowed no one to enter save its own clerks and a few missionaries. Around the middle of the 19th century the parishes of Charlevoix, perched high in the austere mountains of the north shore of the St. Lawrence, found their population grown to excessive numbers. At this time the rush towards the large urban centres of Montreal and Quebec had not yet started, nor had migration to the United States, with the consequent loss represented by those migrations. The problem was therefore to find a place to establish our surplus population. Even before the 1958 throne speech, which forecasts so brilliant a future for northern areas, our forefathers betook themselves to the north. They boldly made their way into our mysterious forests. They went up the dark and stormy waters of the Saguenay. A company was formed to carry on lumber trade and settlement, known as the "21" Company. Small sawmills were established at Ha! Ha! Bay and at Chicoutimi, with little villages around. The Hudson's Bay Company attempted to squash this attempt at colonization. In a legal sense, our forebears were all squatters. Though their establishment was illegal, they took no notice of judicial proceedings instituted against them in the Quebec courts. Finding itself unable to have the court orders executed, the Hudson's Bay Company decided to use force and to send in its henchmen to dislodge the settlers. The use of force calls for retaliation by force. It was a cold war 57071-3-35J

The Address-Mr. V. Brassard but a war none the less. There was no bloodshed, but no punches were pulled. For the sake of peace, the Hudson's Bay Company gave up before the daring and tenacity of the first settlers. About the beginning of this century, the sawmills first set up began to expand into pulp and paper mills.

Then came the electrification era with the construction of numerous and powerful hydro stations, such as the lie Maligne station built in 1926 and developing 540,000 h.p. and the Chute-a-Caron station, built in 1931 and developing 300,000 h.p. Owing to the war, the Shipshaw power station was put into service in 1943 with a capacity of 1,200,000 h.p. After the war, two new stations were built on the Peribonka river, which is a tributary of lake Saint John, both stations having a capacity of 270,000 h.p. and built respectively on the spots called La Savane and La chute au Diable. Finally there is under construction at the present time and soon to be in service, the Chute-des-passes power station, the capacity of which will be one million horsepower. This gives an impressive total of 3,580,000 h.p. for the whole Saguenay area. It is therefore not surprising that we have the greatest aluminum reduction mills in the world and that we still have some power left over for sale to any industry wanting to take advantage of an intelligent manpower and of unlimited resources in electrical power.

In parallel with all those industrial developments, our industry and business, as well as our social institutions, were expanding considerably. This particular geographic situation of an area practically isolated from the rest of the province, as well as the particular circumstances in which colonization was carried out, has stamped a particular trait upon our people. Difficulties of all kinds awaited the first settlers who had come in this distant area with no other means of communication than the Saguenay river which is closed to navigation in winter, and they automatically eliminated the weak and the timorous. Moreover, hostility on the part of the Hudson's Bay Company forced settlers to rely on force to stay put. It is therefore not surprising to find today an aggressive spirit which, if it no longer leads to pitched battles, is nevertheless characteristic of our population in the different spheres of human activity. This aggressive spirit is in no way incompatible with our kind disposition since, on March 31st last, we elected three members

The Address-Mr. V. Brassard out of four on the side of the government, in spite of the fact that the constituency of Chicoutimi had never elected a Conservative member since it was parcelled out around 1911, several years before I was born. Let us merely say that the Liberals again broke up the constituency of Chicoutimi in 1949 to create the constituency of Lapointe, no doubt to allow my namesake a comfortable seat in the opposition.

As history cannot be undone, Mr. Speaker, let us say that we are connected with the rest of Canada by the incomparable Saguenay river, open to the ocean-going vessels up to my city of Chicoutimi. I would like to describe to you with eloquence and poetry that magnificent river, but this is not the place for lyricism. That river, deeply embanked as a fiord, is spotted with wharves most of which were built under former Conservative governments and were barely maintained and repaired during the 22 years of the former administration.

That is why, Mr. Speaker, the speech from the throne has no doubt rejoiced all the people of our constituency since the announced public works will soon bring up to date the port facilities of all our villages and especially those of the city of Chicoutimi. In 1888, Mr. Speaker, the first locomotive appeared in the village of Chambord, which is today part of the constituency of Roberval. In 1893, the same railroad was extended to Chicoutimi but, going into bankruptcy a little later, it was taken over by the Canadian National.

For all practical purposes, that railroad has remained as it was at the end of the last century, though for some years it has since become the most profitable section of the national railways due to the existence in our area of the great industry of aluminum and of many newsprint plants whose shipping is the most profitable. All this shows that our railway, serving four counties and a population of a quarter of a million people-that is the equivalent of one of our small provinces'- has long become less than adequate. It will be fully inadequate when the link from St. Felicien to Chibougamau is put into operation next year.

We must deplore, at this time, Mr. Speaker, the former administration's long delay in authorizing the building of the Chibougamau-St. Felicien branch line. Because of that delay the city of Chicoutimi lost the opportunity of completing the construction of a refining plant. The difficulty facing the sponsors was that they could not count on

[Mr. Brassard (Chicoutimi) .1

the building of the railway, so that the plant was not guaranteed supplies, and they therefore were unable to raise the funds to finance that project. When finally construction started on the branch line, there was a drop on metal stocks with the disastrous consequence that our refining plant has remained uncompleted.

Coming back to the railway, Mr. Speaker, it is a touching sight to see a modern diesel locomotive, capable of high speed, lumber along over tracks of 1888 vintage at a top speed of 40 miles an hour. It is like driving a Cadillac over a bush trail. I am sure, Mr. Speaker, that if the Minister of Transport (Mr. Hees) would kindly accept my invitation to spend a week end in Chicoutimi and to pass two whole nights in the train to cover a 300-mile stretch, he would be so shaken up that he would earmark most of his budget for the repair of that important line of our national railway network.

Another noteworthy feature in the speech from the throne is the government's interest in northern "development." His Excellency referred to a railroad going up to the Great Slave lake, and I heartily approve the project. However, northern Quebec is also part of the development program in the north and I feel that it would be quite possible to establish in my district-in view of the combined effect of our huge hydro-electric resources and our abundant labour force, together with inexhaustible resources-an industrial centre comparable to the famous Ruhr valley, since the Saguenay is also an unrivalled seaway. That, of course, provided we are linked by a railway to Seven Islands, which is at present the loading point of raw ore bound for American refineries. It is in fact imperative that our natural resources should first of all profit Canadians themselves and that Canada should put a stop to the export of non-refined ore.

Without this railway link with Chicoutimi, the port of Seven Islands is but a point through which Canada is being bled out of its wealth in favour of the Americans. With a railway, it would become a source of bountiful wealth for all of Canada. Before concluding, Mr. Speaker, may I be allowed to stress an angle of the economic war which is waged against us by the iron curtain countries and, as a result of which the Arvida aluminum plant has considerably reduced its operations. The U.S.S.R. now offers on the world market aluminum at a much lower price than is asked for Canadian aluminum, in spite of our recent price cut.

May I quote here from a speech made during one of the corporation's annual meetings by the president of the Aluminum Company.

Another noteworthy development which happened last year and should be mentioned is the appearance of competition on the part of soviet block countries, and mainly of Russia. Russian competition brought on certain marked disturbances and deprived our company of several customers. Some people naturally thought that our decision with regard to prices was aimed at meeting this competition. This conclusion does not take into account the basic difference between our two systems with regard to the part played by the state and also by industry and overlooks the fact that the Russian producer, owing to the very nature of the system in which he operates, will not consider the production cost of aluminum as a determining factor when he competes with other countries on the international market. In several cases, Russian metal sales agencies have offered to keep their price beneath any quotation we might make.

One might wonder if the government should not resort to diplomatic and economic action to protect our market in the United Kingdom, amongst others, against any dumping of light metals manufactured in Russia. The least we can say, in any case, is that dumping is a major cause of unemployment in our area, and if it is to continue, the whole district will soon be classed as an emergency zone.

Mr. Speaker, may I be allowed to suggest that the National Housing Act be amended so as to make it possible for a large number of low wage earners and workers of my constituency to benefit from its provisions? Under the present legislation it is necessary to obtain the services of our contractor to have a house built, which of course increases the cost and puts it out of the reach of these small wage earners. Thanks to the forty and even thirty-six hour week our workers have plenty of spare time and are far from lacking in skill. If the government instituted a system of supervision of the work, a large number of workers could build their own houses, make a considerable saving and lower their monthly payments to a very considerable degree.

The father of a family of seven or eight children who earns only $3,300 or $3,500 annually is quite incapable of making monthly payments of $80. Amendments to this act would be of immense benefit to the workers of this country and I will respectfully submit to the Minister of Public Works (Mr. Green) that he should study this aspect of the matter most closely.

In my constituency, Mr. Speaker, there are a number of small rural municipalities which,

The Address-Mr. V. Brassard by reason of their situation, are unable to benefit from federal public works. These small municipalities are for the most part unprovided with waterworks and sewer systems and their finances are too small to allow them to undertake work of this description. I therefore express a most ardent wish for an understanding to be arrived at at the earliest possible moment whereby the federal government would be allowed to subsidize these little municipalities so that they could attain a reasonable standard of living by carrying out public works which would have a double advantage, in so far as they would improve sanitary standards while reducing unemployment. I believe, Mr. Speaker, that this contribution would be at least as useful as our contribution to the Colombo plan.

I would not want to close my remarks without paying the people of my constituency the tribute they well deserve and thanking them for the confidence they put in your humble servant. If I am not mistaken, we have one of the highest birth-rates of the whole country, so much so that more than 20 per cent of our whole population is of primary school age. They are therefore courageous people who do not rely on immigration to populate the country and I am convinced that native Canadians make excellent citizens. That is why the federal government should study the problem and make proportionately as much money available to the people who multiply naturally as it makes available to those who have to be increased by the help of immigration.

One good way of recognizing the merits of this population would be to re-adjust the family allowance rates in accordance with the increase in the cost of living. I have not yet given up hope of seeing the Minister of Finance (Mr. Fleming), whose talents are inexhaustible, find it possible to provide for a substantial increase in family allowances when he makes his budget speech.

The city of Chicoutimi is in great need of public works to fight unemployment, of course, but also to supply the needs of the ever-increasing population of this metropolitan centre, which is also the shipping and railway terminal of the area. I am sure the government will fulfil in this field the promises made while it was in opposition and that our harbour facilities will be modernized within the framework of a vast plan involving, among other things, the relocation of the railway terminal and the disappearance of 13 level crossings.

The Address-Mr. Loiselle

I still have much to say on behalf of my constituency. However, I will have the opportunity of making further remarks in other debates.

(Text):

Before resuming my seat, Mr. Speaker, I should like to state that I have been in public life for many years. As president of the school board of my hometown, I always served my constituents to the best of my ability. I wish to assure you, Mr. Speaker, that in this house I will devote the best years of my life to the service of Canada as a whole, from the Atlantic to the Pacific.

(Translation):

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LIB

Gérard Loiselle

Liberal

Mr. Gerard Loiselle (Si. Ann):

I would feel remiss, Mr. Speaker, if I did not congratulate you, at the very beginning of my remarks, for your election as Speaker of the House of Commons. All those who sat here at the last session are aware of the tact and ability with which you presided over the debates of this house and I am sure that you will continue to discharge your responsibilities with that same dignity.

I must also sincerely congratulate the mover and seconder of the address in reply to the speech from the throne (Messrs. Lafreniere and Nielsen). They are all the more deserving of our congratulations since that honour has been bestowed upon them on their first appearance in this house, an ambition which unfortunately cannot be fulfilled by every young member. Once more, Mr. Speaker and hon. members for Quebec-Montmorency and Yukon, I offer you my most sincere congratulations on the way in which you have discharged your duty.

I wish also to offer my warmest congratulations to the hon. member for Labelle (Mr. Courtemanche) and for Lotbiniere (Mr. O'Hurley) who were appointed ministers of the crown at the opening of the session, as well as to the hon. member for Longueuil (Mr. Sevigny) and to the hon. member for Spadina (Mr. Rea), who are assuming the functions of Deputy Speaker and deputy chairman of committee of the whole. As to all those who hoped and are still looking for an appointment, I advise them to be patient and not to forget that many are called but few are chosen.

Mr. Speaker, in accordance with the good example you gave us after your election as well as the good example from the Minister of Justice (Mr. Fulton) and the Minister of Transport (Mr. Hees) who, last week, answered

questions in the beautiful French language, allow me to continue my remarks in my mother tongue.

I am proud to be a member of this 24th parliament after obtaining again, for the second consecutive time the confidence of the electors of the constituency of St. Ann.

I had the honour to take part in the last parliament which was so short-lived that many new members and myself could not gather as much experience as we wanted to in the operation of a governmental administration such as ours.

The St. Ann constituency which I have the honour of representing has very special features which are seldom found elsewhere.

It is composed mostly of workers together with an elite of professionals, businessmen and industrialists. It has people of all racial origins who live together in an exemplary brotherhood. The aspect of the riding is also very typical. It is irregular, criss-crossed by railway lines which lead to all parts of the country and to the United States, and is crossed by the Lachine canal. It is limited by the St. Lawrence river for more than half of its length. If it is of difficult access, it has on the other hand one of the most hospitable and picturesque populations. I pledge to serve each of my electors with the same devotion, whatever his origin. It is human value that I see in each of them, and it is with that ideal that I will consider their needs and serve their interests.

Mr. Speaker, everyone is aware that the city of Montreal is located at the head of a seaway which makes it one of the busiest and at the same time one of the most accessible ports. It is closer to the European countries than the Atlantic ports of Canada as well as the United States. We therefore believe that it must be given special consideration by our government.

The St. Lawrence seaway will divert to the south shore part of the traffic of Montreal harbour. As the situation will not be ?>

favourable there at the beginning, no effort should be spared to develop our port facilities since, after all, they will have to be used.

Since our port comes under federal jurisdiction, it has lost its autonomy and has often been treated as a poor relation. Certain rivalries, either in the department or in the neighbouring cities, are prejudicial to Montreal. The moment has come to make up for time lost and to spend without delay the sums necessary to preserve its supremacy. The port of Montreal will always be our most important port on account of it geographical location.

Saint John and Halifax will continue to be open to ocean-going vessels during the winter, while Montreal will remain the true Canadian port dominating the whole of our economy. The seaway will divert only the secondary trade to the great lakes and the inland ports. That is why, Mr. Speaker, I consider this question to be of foremost importance. Who will contend that the Montreal harbour facilities do not benefit the whole country? To deny it, one must have no knowledge whatever of geography. Montreal is and will remain the centre of our country and will continue to be of vital importance to other cities which will owe it indirectly their growth.

We must at all cost preserve the supremacy of the port of Montreal, our city's main industry. Montreal must benefit as much as possible from the seaway.

I know that a development program of $57 million is underway but I am wondering whether that sum of $57 million will be enough to give Montreal harbour the place we would like to see it occupy. Will this sum of $57 million be sufficient for the construction and extension of wharves, for the construction of grain elevators and sheds, for dredging the channel and for the various other necessary improvements?

The workers, the businessmen and the industrialists of Montreal need the port; the federal government must give a special attention to the harbour of Montreal and must institute, if need be, a Montreal harbour commission in view of the foremost importance of that port for the economy of the metropolitan area.

Another project which is of interest to the citizens of the constituency of St. Ann is the construction and the approaches of the bridge of St. Paul island, also called Nuns' island.

The construction of that bridge is another great achievement of the former Liberal government. Now that the work is underway, the present government must see that it is completed; to that end, the Minister of Transport (Mr. Hees) should concern himself immediately, before it is too late, with the approaches of that bridge on the island of Montreal. If the bridge were completed tomorrow, do you know where traffic would go? According to the information I have gathered, the traffic from the bridge is led directly to the southern entrance of the Atwater street tunnel. It is easy to see how silly that is. The Atwater tunnel has been constructed to replace the former Atwater street bridge and not to take care of the traffic through that new bridge.

The Address-Mr. Loiselle

It is therefore advisable for the government to carry out expensive land expropriation and to construct all access roads at its own expense. The original design provided for an access road which extended only as far as the southern entrance to the Atwater tunnel, as I said a moment ago. The double lateral lanes in this tunnel cannot adequately handle that traffic. No sooner would we have left that pit than we would have to jump over the railway tracks between St. Jacques street and Notre Dame street and pour traffic into a district which is already ill provided with wide through roads. It would be advisable also to think of extending the exit road as far as Dorchester boulevard, from where traffic could be easily channelled into every direction. If need be, secondary grades could be built towards those parts of the city which are generally called Pointe-Saint-Charles and Saint-Henri.

If this is not done, Mr. Speaker, this bridge will not answer the needs of the people in the way which is expected. If I have put forward this suggestion concerning the traffic which this bridge will bring into Montreal, it is because that is a highly important matter. If I have to put a resolution before the house in this connection, I will make it my duty to do so.

Mr. Speaker, since I am talking at this time of the new bridge at present under construction, I must point out that last week the Minister of Transport received a request from the provincial member for the constituency of St. Ann, the same constituency I represent in this house, with regard to the blessing of the bridge. I have not always shared the same views as the provincial member for my constituency. On more than one occasion we have been at loggerheads in our political opinions, but this time, for once, I must admit that this seems to be a sensible suggestion.

Last week end I had the pleasure of visiting the religious sisters of the Congregation de Notre-Dame, since there is some talk of naming that bridge Marguerite Bourgeois bridge. I therefore got in touch with the proper parties so as to obtain certain information in support of the suggestions I have to offer with regard to the name to be given to the new bridge. If you do not mind, Mr. Speaker, I will give certain historical notes concerning St. Paul island or Nuns' island as it is called by some people, and over which this new bridge is to be constructed.

The island of St. Paul enters history even before the discovery of Montreal. In fact, before 1664, the whole island belonged to one

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PC

Paul Léo Maurice Johnson

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Johnson:

It is an unpleasant remark. I ask the hon. member whether he wants his constituency called the province of St. Ann?

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LIB

Gérard Loiselle

Liberal

Mr. Loiselle:

No, because in such a case the riding of St. Ann would be in the province of Montreal.

If Montreal had the taxation powers granted the provinces, all the large scale works considered by its administration would not only be under way, but completed and it would be possible to look into the future, whereas it is just the contrary. Having to wait for the support of the higher levels of government, that of Quebec as well as of Ottawa, the works remain at the planning stage, and the plans on the shelves.

I know that there is talk of another national conference to be held for the purpose of determining a better distribution of sources of income. I hope advantage will be taken of this opportunity to think of municipalities, which, shackled by the smallness of their budget and the hard time they have raising taxes, are languishing or putting off urgent developments which will then cost twice as much as they would today. Administration implies foresight. Administration also means the ability to act promptly for the common good and also for the good of the individuals.

If, for reasons I do not wish to discuss here, federal-provincial relations fail as usual, the government, under the Prime Minister, will always be able to pay us, in the form of taxes on federal buildings in our cities, amounts in proportion to the services rendered and to the sacrifices we made in the past without any gratitude in return. The problem of municipalities is urgent and it is most important to find a solution which will not be a makeshift.

The federal government collects in Montreal a considerable part of its revenue. Why then would it not pay us back by giving us an exemption from the federal sales tax on all municipal purchases? This compensation would not be so high as to unbalance the budget. However, the city of Montreal would make a surprising use of this money.

In closing, Mr. Speaker, I would like to suggest to the government full consideration of the immediate needs of this municipality, needs which are much more urgent than those of some provinces. If Montreal was called the province of Montreal, I am sure that we would not have to beg of federal ministers to obtain for Montreal its rightful share.

And before closing these few remarks, I would like to make another request to the Minister of Transport. As I said a minute ago, there are several level crossings in my constituency-everyone remembers the old Bonaventure station-and there are still between Notre-Dame street and St. James street railway lines which are very ugly in a city like Montreal.

It so happens that the C.N.R. is still using steam locomotives, and this should not be allowed in the metropolis of Canada. I expressly ask the Minister of Transport today to see to it that steam locomotives are ruled out of the city of Montreal. I have already made this request to Mr. Gordon, the president of the Canadian National Railways and, in a fine letter replying to my request, he informed me that the necessary improvements would be looked after and that in the near future the steam locomotives would be taken out of service. However, I am beginning to think that those improvements are too slow in coming about and that these locomotives will not disappear for a long time yet. I insist upon those steam locomotives being replaced by diesel locomotives.

(Text):

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PC

Reginald Percy Vivian

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Percy Vivian (Durham):

Mr. Speaker, in rising to take part in this debate I am conscious of my newness in this house. I am also very much aware of the number of speeches which have preceded my having this opportunity to speak. I am also full of awareness of the particular character of the riding which I have the honour to represent, the county of Durham in the province of Ontario.

Durham is not only an historic riding it is frequently a pivotal riding. Its first member was the Hon. Edward Blake in 1867 who, at the same time as he represented Durham in this house, as the representative of South Bruce was the leader of the Liberal opposition in the legislative assembly of Ontario. In 1871 he formed a government in that province. Down through the years, the riding has expressed its views in no uncertain terms in election after election on the way in which it felt and that feeling has in the main been a national feeling rather than one concerned only with local issues.

This, I think, has been shown by the fact that in 1917 the Hon. Newton Wesley Rowell, a Liberal by former conviction, a member of the unionist government of Sir Robert Borden and a minister therein, was then elected by the greatest majority Durham has ever given to anybody in an election at any time. In the 1925-26-shall I say political difficulties-a Conservative, a farmer by profession, defeated an outstanding exponent of the Liberal party who was extremely tough

The Address-Mr. Vivian opposition and held the riding through the 1926 election. And so it is with a feeling of considerable responsibility that I rise to present to this house the views of the people I have the honour to represent.

It is not difficult to represent this riding because their views are made so clearly known. This was well shown, I think, in the last election on March 31 when their representative in this house was returned with what was for Durham a tremendous majority. One can only interpret from this that the people of Durham felt that a Diefenbaker government was the only government capable of guiding this country through the next four years and with that they expressed their approval of the accomplishments achieved by the government following June 10 in bringing so many of the election promises into fruition in spite of having only a minority of members in this house. They accept this government as proved on its past record and in faith for its future and in this I know they will not be disappointed in view of the words contained in the speech from the throne.

The throne speech is long but it is also packed with a great many things that appear to be in the best immediate interests of the people of Canada. For a little while I would like to comment on a few of the words contained therein which I think are of particular interest to the people in the county of Durham.

We welcome the words of the throne speech that have to do with the revival of interest on the part of the Canadian government in affairs of the commonwealth and of mutual interest in the existing commonwealth and its expansion through the addition of new countries. The riding of Durham has had many settlers, early from among United Empire Loyalists, others from the United Kingdom and Ireland, and more recently from newer nations and the countries of Europe who have blended themselves into a whole unit as a thinking component of this part of the province of Ontario. They look upon the commonwealth as an instrument of good and they hope it will be nurtured. They believe that the progressive development or evolution of a commonwealth of nations can lead to a greater understanding-and therefore world peace and happiness-than can the activities of an artificial hierarchy of nations of different interests who seem to spend too much of their time seeking their own national advantage. Not only do they welcome the interest of this government in the maintenance and extension of the commonwealth but they also welcome the words

in the throne speech concerning the holding of a commonwealth trade conference in Montreal this September.

I am equally sure they welcome the words in the throne speech which tell of the forthcoming visit to Canada of the President of the United States this summer. There has been a great deal of concern in the riding about relationships with our great and good neighbour to the south. If 1 interpret their views correctly-and they are my own-there is a feeling that much of what seems to have been wrong in our relationships stems from our own inability to put many things right. The people of my riding also feel that perhaps our neighbour to the south has not yet realized that the country to its north which was once a child among nations is now reaching maturity and nationhood with a mind and will of its own and therefore the delicacy of our relationships with our neighbour, which is our close family member, has been of some concern.

One of the most serious mistakes we could make in our relationship with the United States, or they with us, is for either to believe that because we speak a similar language and come from a somewhat similar background that we are the same people. In my opinion we are not. However, we are members of a large family and the relationship between us should be that which exists between the members of any large family, one of mutual respect, devotion and care for the well-being of each other. Surely this is the foundation upon which our continuing friendship should be built and a means by which minor irritations can be avoided.

There are other matters which are perhaps more mundane and prosaic but which nevertheless are of considerable importance to the people in my riding in the matter of making a living. These concerns are very little different in Durham than they are any place else in Canada and indeed many of our problems are similar to those of the rest of Canada. Basically Durham is a rural-small-urban riding and agriculture is still its most stable industry with a variety of types of manufacturing as an adjunct to this. We have beef cattle, dairy herds, canning crops, apples, tobacco and even some potatoes. Mixed farming is of particular interest in the older part of Ontario and it has engaged the attention and toil of so many of our farm families. The people in this area are not connected with the production of wheat or fish, as is the case in other parts of Canada, but their problems are related to the agricultural endeavour which depends on close markets and is in competition with many similar products which enter Canada from the south.

The matter of canning crops such as tomatoes, corn, peas and asparagus are of particular importance and therefore we welcomed what was accomplished by the Minister of Agriculture (Mr. Harkness) last session, and what is again referred to in the speech from the throne, the intention on the part of the government that agriculture shall have a fair share of the national income. We received with joy the announcement of the intention to pay a deficiency payment for asparagus and we hope something similar will be done with respect to tomatoes. We have observed the growth of marketing boards and these are welcome because they have accomplished a great deal particularly with respect to the tobacco crop.

A deficiency payment on asparagus is of little value unless the canning company is prepared to pack the product. We have had an unfortunate experience in my riding. A number of canning plants formerly owned by Canadian Canners Limited are lessening their activities and in some instances are closing down since the purchase of this company by a large United States firm. This we deplore. We also hope this will be the subject of concern to our Department of Agriculture, as it is to our farmers, and that steps may be taken to find new outlets for these cash crops upon which so many of our farmers depend.

There is one other matter which is of importance to us in agricultural pursuits, if even the small number of farm families remaining on our farms is to be retained, and I submit to you, sir, that retention of farm families is of considerable importance to us sociologically. They must be more secure in their ability to earn a living in those agricultural pursuits. A large farm family has always provided a great source of new blood to the development of the country in other ways, in the various cities, as we know', and the ability, the integrity and the adjustability of those raised on farms and in agriculture have added so much to the development of this country, and have given so much to the professions and to industry that we hope some way will be found so that there will be no further depletion of this source of our strength nationally, for if this depletion continues it will be to the detriment of the whole nation.

In manufacturing we have a very interesting situation. Not only are we processing uranium products, but we have the only file plant in Canada. The riding contains plants for the manufacture of rubber goods in relation to the automobile trade and conveyor systems and many other things as well. But these forward looking companies, many of them employing modest numbers of employees, 57071-3-36J

The Address-Mr. Vivian have gone ahead with the modernization of their plants, and by the working conditions and the character of the skilled labour which they are able to attract within the riding are ready for a great expansion in their production as soon as the market for greater productivity is available. Therefore, we did welcome the words of the speech from the throne that every effort is to be made for the expansion of trade. In this we would like to compliment the Minister of Trade and Commerce (Mr. Churchill) on all that he has done to date and on what we hope he will continue to do in the future.

The county of Durham is also very much interested in matters of health and welfare. My people welcomed the increase in payments in the old age security program and pensions and allowances for the blind and for veterans. They also know they have to pay for them, as the rest of Canada has to do. Therefore, while they consider this to be a great help they would like to see a more adequate arrangement made whereby the amounts could be greater and on a different system, on a pay-as-you-go basis. Therefore, we look forward to the report which this house expects on a new system or plan or program of social security in Canada. They are also very conscious of the value of the new hospital insurance plan, and we note that the speech from the throne refers to an amendment now introduced in this house which will make it possible for participating hospitals of provinces having hospital plans to receive payments after June.

As a physician I welcome this hospital insurance plan wholeheartedly. The present cost of hospital care, more than ever a needed medical facility within the community, has increased so much by reason of increases, in wages, services and materials that it is beyond the paying capacity of the individual when sick; and even when that individual has much in the way of insurance coverage, long-term illnesses, plus the need for ancillary services within a hospital that are beyond the insurance coverage, are sufficiently serious to reduce the economic status of a person or a family. This, to my way of thinking, is not only welcome but is long overdue.

In this I have a very personal interest because it was in the autumn of 1943 when I was enabled, as a member of the then government of the province of Ontario, to state that that government would underwrite the cost of public ward care either by a hospital insurance plan or out of the consolidated revenue. The then dominion-provincial relations were such that this was not possible. What was done was in very large

The Address-Mr. Vivian measure to meet that commitment by increased grants from provincial and municipal treasuries. Therefore, it is with a great deal of satisfaction that I see this plan coming into operation, and for the work which has been done by him I wish to compliment most sincerely the former minister of national health and welfare, the hon. member for Essex East (Mr. Martin). I compliment him on the part that he has played in the longterm struggle to bring into Canada a program of this sort. Although he was not in a position to see it in actual operation, I know he will join with me in wishing the present Minister of National Health and Welfare (Mr. Monteith) every good wish for the success of this plan, because, it is not going to be easy. There are going to be a great many headaches in bringing this plan into actual operation.

While we at this level contribute money and have some guidance in the way in which it is spent in the various provinces in which this plan will be in force, much of this authority will rest with the local hospitals, commissions or boards or by whatever name the administration is set up. Some of the headaches will rest in the fact that the public, having paid a premium or a tax, will think that they, and perhaps only they, are entitled to any services at any time that they so desire. This cannot be. Admission to hospitals will still remain at the request of the physician in question and will still be granted only when there is sufficient room in the hospital in which to receive those patients. Therefore, one of the many problems will be the distribution of the number of beds and all the ancillary things that go to make up the hospital facilities of any area that has a provincial plan and with that the balancing of the number of acute public general hospital beds with the number of beds for the long stay or convalescent patient, or the more unfortunately chronically ill or the incurable type of case.

This will not be easy because the mind of the public is so set upon acute illnesses that we tend to forget the problems of the longer stay patient. We tend to overlook those problems in rehabilitation, which means so much, and can shorten so many cases of illness. We focus our attention on the more dramatic, which is the acute problem, and therefore we tend to lay more emphasis on this factor than we perhaps might otherwise do.

Another problem which is likely to arise, and which is already in force I am sorry to say, is the overcrowding of many hospitals and shortages of staff. The problem of training adequate personnel in housekeeping-I refer to medical housekeeping-is difficult.

In a recent issue of the journal of the American Medical Association the problem of inhospital infection with a staphylococcus organism is given a prominent place. During this last week it has been the subject of discussion at the public health conference in Vancouver. It is one of the problems of the type which arise in hospital housekeeping, of which the public is not generally aware. I mention it as an example of the type of thing which will have to be faced by provincial hospital organizations, and I do so only for that reason. But in this case, having regard to the question of the number of beds and their type, the problems of housekeeping of one kind or another and the question of demand from the public, I make the plea that the public control unusual demand for service until the hospitals are in a position to meet it in an orderly, regular and safe way.

There is one other thing about which I wish to speak. I have mentioned the fact that we tend to focus our attention on the dramatic. As a person particularly interested in the preventive aspects of medicine and the prevention of many of these disabilities and sicknesses that fill our hospitals, I say that we must not forget that if we are going to keep our sickness and disability rate at a minimum, our public health services must be sufficiently strengthened and manned to carry through with this endeavour. Much of this is a matter of public education. Preventive medicine is not dramatic. In many instances it appears to be only negative. In the absence of something we fail to see its value. But when we fail to carry through those things which we know how to do, these problems arise again as they arise from the failure to keep our population sufficiently vaccinated against smallpox, or fail to keep it sufficiently immune against diphtheria, or even fail to keep >it sufficiently supplied with food as, for example, failure to keep bottle fed babies supplied with orange juice.

The last issue of the Canadian Medical Association journal contains a most surprising article on the incidence of scurvy in the city of Winnipeg and the city of Toronto. It all simply boils down to the fact that these children have suffered a deficiency disease through lack of fresh juice because of ignorance rather than because of economic difficulty in buying the fruit, most of which is plentiful and cheap. I can therefore only attribute it to a breakdown in the public health services. They could strive with greater effect to reach more people in this preventive field, particularly with regard to maternal and infant hygiene. These are things in which the county of Durham is interested, particularly the last because they

have supported and found useful one of the first county health units in the province of Ontario and of these things they are aware.

We come now to this question of what else in this debate on the address in reply to the speech from the throne one can say that is of value to the people of my riding. I think there is only one thing, namely that the people of the county of Durham have approved the government on its past performance, have taken the future on faith and are prepared to pay their way and plod along with the 18 million more who are helping to develop a country of over half a continent in size. We in this house must to the best of our ability truly represent the views and perhaps the hopes and the aspirations of our ridings. It is my hope that 1 may do that.

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PC

John (Jack) McIntosh

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Jack McIntosh (Swift Current-Maple Creek):

As I rise to speak in this house for the first time may I offer my congratulations to you, Mr. Speaker, on your re-election as Speaker of the House of Commons. I should also like to extend my congratulations to the Deputy Speaker and to the hon. member for Spadina (Mr. Rea) on the appointments given to them.

At this time when national unity is so essential in our country, I believe that our party and the people of Canada generally should offer congratulations to the people of Quebec for sending to this house Conservative members of the calibre of those that we have amongst us in such great numbers. This action on the part of the people of Quebec I believe has done more to unify Canada than any act of parliament could ever do, and to prove to the world that there is at least one political party in Canada that is truly a national party.

We who have taken our seats in this house for the first time were informed by older members that we would find this experience rather confusing and possibly disappointing. At the moment I concurred. I am quite certain that had I expressed my first impression as a back-bencher the publicity received would have been as forceful as possibly the atom bomb. The deterring factor that entered my mind was one of Winston Churchill's quotations: Democratic government is the worst form of government ever devised by man except all other forms of government.

I am reminded of the first time I saw Niagara Falls. After building a picture in my own mind of how great the falls must be,

I remember the disappointment I felt at my first sight of that great tourist attraction. It was not nearly as large as I thought it should be. Likewise, I remember a sermon I once

The Address-Mr. McIntosh heard: Be careful of what you wish for, because you may get it; then it may not be good for you.

I was aware that my first impressions and my attitude would have to change before I attempted to make my maiden speech on behalf of the constituency of Swift Current-Maple Creek which I represent. This constituency covers an area of approximately 15,400 square miles and is situated in the southwest corner of Saskatchewan. The chief industries are grain farming and stock raising. Like others I am proud to be the first Conservative member in the history of this constituency of Swift Current-Maple Creek to present to this house a summary of the part the prairie people play in the economy of Canada.

At times it may appear that I am critical of the government of which I am a member. I do this with the thought in mind that if this is to be a good government, which at the moment lacks constructive criticism from those who are charged with the important responsibility of criticizing constructively, then we must set up within our own ranks a group to fulfil the role which the opposition is supposed to play in a democracy. The people of Canada in no uncertain measure have given our party members with which to do so.

Students of representative government have stated that one of the greatest dangers of democracy is the danger of class legislation.

These students further state that the two most powerful groups seeking special legislation in their own interests in Canada are organized labour and organized farmers. I am not in a position, nor am I qualified, to discuss this statemnt in regard to labour. However, having spent most of my life on a farm and working amongst farmers, I feel I can speak with some authority on their behalf.

I am sure that these students never had the opportunity or the experience of trying to organize farmers or they would have never recorded such a false impression. I admit that there are a number of individual farm organizations that may be considered pressure groups. I do not believe any amount of effort ever has or ever will be successful in organizing western grain farmers into one group. Western farmers are extremely individualistic people. During the early part of this century many of these people ventured into the west from eastern Canada, as well as from practically every country in the world. Some of these pioneers are still alive, and the descendants of others still retain this characteristic of independence. It can be said that their descendants come by their

The Address-Mr. McIntosh independence naturally, being the first generation of a group of proud and independent people.

I might point out that the western farmer is also very patriotic. I do not need to remind this house that the grain farmers were told in 1917 and again in 1942 that if they would accept a fair price for their wheat to help the war effort a grateful country would see that never again would they be asked to accept for their grain a price that did not show a reasonable profit. In 1932 wheat went down to 19 cents a bushel to the farmer. Again, in 1958, under existing legislation, wheat is being traded on the black market at 70 cents a bushel, whether we like it or not. In July, 1917 when wheat was being sold on the open market for $3.33 the Canadian government, through its agency, paid the western farmer $2.42 a bushel. Again in 1942, during world war II, the open market price for wheat went as high as $3.35 a bushel. The Canadian farmer received, through the government agency, $1.55 a bushel. With this promise of the Canadian government in mind, and remembering the comparison of the figures I have just quoted, I ask this house to lend a sympathetic ear to the presentations that have been made or will be put forth by western members. I am sure that one early request will be for deficiency payments on western grain.

On entering this house for the first time we were advised to think nationally; to weigh carefully all matters before we opposed or lent our support; to ascertain how the result of our support would affect Canada as a whole. Numerous briefs pass across our desks from industries requesting government assistance. I have one in mind, received not so long ago, concerning the mint price for gold. The group concerned suggests the government ought to consider setting a list price for gold of between $40 and $45 an ounce. We have heard the Minister of Transport (Mr. Hees) make references in this house to the subsidies paid to coast shipping to northern areas. In your eastern newspapers we read of requests being made for higher tariffs to be placed on textiles entering Canada from foreign countries in order to give protection to eastern textile industries.

We from the prairies, who are not familiar with the problems of these industries, do expect various members who are familiar with the problems to present information from the viewpoint of the constituencies which they represent. I trust that in this respect hon. members of this house will not think we are too provincial. It would appear

that some branches at least of the three industries I have just mentioned, namely mining, shipping and manufacturing, have been subsidized in one manner or another.

At six o'clock the house took recess.

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AFTER RECESS The house resumed at eight o'clock.


PC

John (Jack) McIntosh

Progressive Conservative

Mr. McIntosh:

Mr. Speaker, at six o'clock I had made reference to numerous Canadian industries which had been receiving subsidies in one manner or another. Since 1947 the western farmer has had an ever-enlarging problem with respect to wheat, which has been referred to as the cost-price squeeze. Briefly, the problem is that the cost of producing a bushel of wheat has been steadily increasing while the purchasing power of that same bushel of wheat has been steadily declining. In other words, any article which we could have bought in 1947 for one bushel of wheat would now take more than two bushels of wheat to purchase.

Numerous small problems have arisen as a result of this trend, and deficiency payments will not cure the major difficulty but will be only an interim measure. I have been informed by Liberal members of this house that wheat did not constitute the only problem to come out of Saskatchewan. I trust the hon. member to whom these members refer and who comes from Saskatchewan may give the same leadership in solving the problem of western Canadian wheat as he has given with respect to solving the problem of the unification of Canada. The mandate which he received from the people of Saskatchewan and in particular of the riding which I represent, is confirmation that our western farmers have the utmost faith in his ability to do so and the utmost faith in the principles of the party led by the right hon. member.

Let us not forget that we Progressive Conservatives retain the best of the old and traditional customs and favour the implementation of the more desirable of the new customs. Let us be guided by the basic and fundamental errors of previous governments. Our national and also world history affords convincing proof of the inability of any dictatorship or any form of dictatorship to successfully solve major problems in any country. With this knowledge let us take care that we do not continue in the same pattern, not only within our country, but within our party.

With the advent of the welfare state, let us remember that we, the party of free

enterprise to which the people have given a mandate, must not lose sight of the fact that now that the Canadian people have demonstrated their support at the polls they desire freedom of choice rather than compulsion or regimentation. The intrusion of government into private enterprise and private life has gone or is going beyond the principles of democracy and particularly the principles of our party. We of this party, I believe, will argue that government control is a cumbersome and expensive way of doing business. The people desire and are looking for a change. Let us not disappoint them. The real and permanent help which we as a government should strive to give to industry and also to individuals is of a nature which will restore usefulness and self-respect.

The fundamental principle with which we as a government should be concerned in respect of any industry in this great country of ours is the selling of the producer's product in the greatest volume at the highest possible price to the producer and at the smallest possible cost to the producer. I think we will agree the producers should have a basic price level guarantee such as agricultural Bill No. 237, which will keep them solvent and yet will not be so high that they will produce for the government rather than for the demands of the market; a guarantee which will ensure that the efficient producer can remain in business. There must also be interim measures such as subsidies, tariff protection and deficiency payments in order to bridge the gaps caused by unsolved national problems over which the individual has no control.

In the constituency which I represent, as in many other parts of this country, we have problems which can be solved only at the federal government level. As a newcomer to this house my present concern is how and in what manner does a backbencher contribute to the solution of such problems? Being a junior member of parliament under our parliamentary system presents a problem not previously known or anticipated by ourselves or by those who elected us. I believe we feel that we have been handed a coconut with instructions-or I should say without instructions-as to how to penetrate the hard shell with our bare hands. We know it is essential to get to the milk in order to survive. Those of us who were in the services were taught that no man is indispensable and I would remind all hon. members that the last election indicates that the same axiom applies to political parties as well as to individual members of parliament. During the past decade the people of Canada woke up to the fact that there had been a tendency on

The Address-Mr. McIntosh the part of the government to mislead them. These people are no longer willing to play the role of pupils looking to the cabinet as their teacher, they require action and not answers from their parliamentary representatives.

I would remind hon. members that in order to gain the privilege of attending this assembly for a second term and in order to think on a nation-wide basis we must first prove to those at the constituency level that we are capable of contributing to the solution of the problems in our own ridings. There will be no excuses for us to offer at the end of our term of office. We are now on our own, but we have the knowledge that the highest authority in the land has been given to us, the mandate to speak on behalf of the exceptionally great number of people it is our privilege to serve. In spite of the obstacles in our paths, our duty is clear-it is to remove such obstacles and to this end I am convinced we are pledged.

I trust I will have the opportunity to speak at a later date on such matters as unemployment insurance for farm labourers, railway and mail service to rural communities, freight rates and service at non-competitive prairie points, municipal education costs-which I am aware at the present time is a provincial matter-the question of why Canada's wheat exports to world markets have dropped from the prewar figure of 40 per cent to the present 25 per cent, the mounting costs of government administration, the financial straitjacket within which municipalities are endeavouring to operate and the tax structure which now permits the federal government to take more than 80 per cent of the total tax dollar, leaving less than 20 per cent for the provinces and the municipalities.

I have been impressed with the dignity of this house in many respects, although I have wondered at times if that same impression is shared by spectators in our public galleries.

I am referring particularly to the teachers who attend with their classes. These teachers are trying to convey to the children in their classes the responsibility resting upon the shoulders of the elected members. I would imagine that these children must wonder sometimes at the value of introducing into this house material obtained from the sports pages of the daily newspapers.

In conclusion, may I refer once more to the quotation of Winston Churchill: Democracy is the worst form of government devised by man except all others. With this thought in mind and with the knowledge that we, the party of the present government, are the exponents of free enterprise, I would ask those of you who are aware of their limitations,

The Address-Mr. Crestohl as I am aware of mine, to carefully weigh our power to inflict government interference upon private enterprise and to regiment our people into a state of totalitarianism.

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LIB

Leon David Crestohl

Liberal

Mr. L. D. Crestohl (Cartier):

Mr. Speaker, may I at the outset offer to you my congratulations upon the renewed confidence unanimously expressed by the house upon your election to preside over the twenty-fourth parliament as you so ably presided over the twenty-third parliament. At the same time I am pleased to congratulate the Deputy Speaker (Mr. Sevigny) upon his appointment and to note that he is following in the footsteps of his illustrious father who, during the course of his career, served with distinction, first as the Deputy Speaker of this house, and later as its Speaker.

I would also like to say a word to our many colleagues who are during this debate making their maiden speeches and to wish them a successful parliamentary career so long as the vicissitudes of elections allow them to remain in parliament.

Speaking about the vicissitudes of elections, all hon. members of the house have just returned from the election battlefield, and because of the majority which the government now enjoys there is an apparent truce for the next four years. A general election in Canada is indeed a gigantic effort, and we are perhaps prone to take the carrying out of a general election too much for granted. I should like the house to contemplate for a moment the tremendous effort and detail which go into the organization, direction and completion of a general election. The technical, legal and physical work is staggering. Hundreds of thousands of people are required; hundreds, if not thousands, of tons of printing are used; distribution of all this material has to be made, and all with the most careful accuracy and precision, and in compliance with a highly technical election act.

When, therefore, we, the members of the House of Commons, look a little closer at this gigantic effort and visualize what actually takes place before a new parliament is elected by most democratic procedure, it is fitting that we acknowledge the ability and the devotion to duty of the chief electoral officer, Mr. Nelson Castonguay, his deputy, Colonel E. A. Anglin, Q.C. and the other members of their staff. I want to pay tribute to the efficiency, the organizational genius, the courage in making important decisions and the extreme sense of fairness and justice of Canada's chief electoral officer. He is an exemplary civil servant, one that any country in the world would be proud to have, and he merits this recognition from all members of the house, regardless of where they sit.

May I also, Mr. Speaker, avail myself of the privilege of recording my own appreciation and, I am sure, the gratitude of many Canadians for the greetings which our Prime Minister (Mr. Diefenbaker) transmitted on behalf of the people of Canada to the prime minister of Israel on the occasion of the 10th anniversary of its founding. I deem it appropriate at this time to quote for the record both the text of the Prime Minister's greeting and the acknowledgment by Mr. Ben-Gurion, the prime minister of Israel. The following is the Canadian greeting:

Dear Mr. Prime Minister:

I am taking advantage of the visit of the Hon. William Hamilton, Postmaster General, to send this message conveying to you and to the Israel nation as a whole the sincere good wishes of the government and people of Canada on the occasion of the tenth anniversary of the State of Israel.

The achievements of the Israeli people over the last ten years in the development of their country have won universal acclaim, and we earnestly hope that the second decade of Israel's existence will see not only a continuation of your nation's rapid and fruitful progress, but also the establishment of an enduring peace on a mutually acceptable basis between Israel and its neighbours. You may rest assured that the Canadian government will continue its support of United Nations efforts to remove causes of tension and to work towards a permanent peace in the area, conscious that peaceful conditions are an essential prerequisite for Israel's prosperity and well-being.

I should like to take this opportunity to express my confidence that the close and friendly relations which have existed between our two countries ever since the founding of Israel will be still further developed and strengthened in the future.

I am,

Yours sincerely,

John G. Diefenbaker.

The following is the Israeli acknowledgment:

Dear Mr. Prime Minister:

Thank you so much for your letter of April 14th, which Mr. Hamilton has faithfully delivered into my hands. I am taking the liberty of using his good services again to send you this message of greeting and sincere appreciation for the kind words which you have addressed to me.

The government and the people of Israel will never forget the many expressions of friendship and solidarity which the Canadian people have made to them on numerous occasions, especially in periods of crisis, during the past ten years. For these, we shall always be indebted to your country.

I share with you most fervently the hope that the second decade of our existence will see the establishment of peaceful conditions in our area and, indeed, throughout the world, so that all peace-loving nations may reap the blessings of their endeavours.

May the next decade, and those that follow, witness the further strengthening of the bonds of friendship which already exist between our two peoples.

Sincerely yours,

David-Ben-Gurion

Canada's role in this historic event is well known and we can justly take pride in the leadership given by Canadian statesmen to establish the state of Israel and its entry into the family of nations.

I had the privilege of being present only a few weeks ago at a function in this city presided over by Mr. Allan Bronfman of Montreal at which an expression of gratitude from the people of Israel was conveyed to four distinguished Canadians for their assistance. The right hon. Prime Minister, the hon. Leader of the Opposition (Mr. Pearson), the Hon. Mr. Justice Rand of the Supreme Court and Sir Ellsworth Flavelle, were each the recipient from the Israeli ambassador to Canada, on behalf of his government, of a special edition of the Jerusalem bible, appropriately bound and suitably inscribed.

This is a most touching tribute expressed in a most significant form. Israel grants no titles or decorations, and when it desires to express recognition on the highest level it is so appropriate for the people of the Bible to do it by presenting Holy Bibles to those whom it wishes to honour.

I am indeed proud as a Canadian speaking in this chamber to give expression to these thoughts, and to thank fellow Canadians for the heartwarming greetings sent to the people of Israel on this dramatic and historic occasion.

I desire now to address myself to one or two phases of this debate. A few days ago, May 20th to be exact, the hon. member for Battle River-Camrose (Mr. Smallwood) made some rather inaccurate and disturbing statements. He said, for example, at page 290 of Hansard, and I quote:

The present government is the first national government in 30 years to represent all the people of Canada, the first government in 30 years that has representation from every province in the dominion.

That statement was patently incorrect. The hon. member is either badly informed or unaware of the facts, or I am sure he would not have made such an inaccurate statement.

Even more ill-considered are the statements he made at page 291 of Hansard, when he criticized the opposition for bringing 250,000 immigrants to Canada in 1956. He resents the fact that government officials met these immigrants on arrival, fed and housed them, and escorted them to the unemployment insurance office to be given jobs. The hon. gentleman seems to find the greatest fault with a group of 200 immigrants who were working on a project because, to use his own words, "Not one of them could speak the English language."

This is an attitude that can rightfully be resented by every person who has ever immigrated into Canada and by fair-minded

The Address-Mr. Crestohl Canadians across the whole country. I wonder what the Minister of Labour (Mr. Starr), the hon. member for Hamilton East (Mr. Martini) and the hon. member for Vancouver Centre (Mr. Jung), who like myself are sons of immigrants to Canada, think about their colleague's statement?

Does the hon. member pretend that only those who speak English have a right to immigrate to this country, and only those who can speak English are entitled to have employment and to enjoy the rights which the government of Canada grants to all its people?

The hon. member surely does not mean to be critical of the fact that our immigration officials extended normal Canadian hospitality and courtesies to newcomers to our shores. I rather think the officials deserve our commendation for making these immigrants welcome and helping them secure employment. This has always been and I hope always will be Canadian government policy regardless of what party might be in power.

Let the hon. member bear in mind and never forget that we in Canada today are all immigrants or the offspring of immigrants, whether our ancestors spoke English on arrival or any other language. It may be well to remind him, too, that the only natives of this wonderful country are those whom the first European explorers and settlers found here and the natives knew not a single word of English. It is unnecessary, I am sure, to remind the hon. gentleman that it was only the influx to Canada of European immigrants who spoke many languages that developed our country and helped make it the great tolerant nation it is today.

I am afraid that the hon. member for Battle River-Camrose has not grasped the full scope of what makes a nation wholesome and great, or is he proclaiming a new Conservative concept? If he was not present in the house when his colleague the hon. member for Parkdale (Mr. Maloney) spoke, I would recommend that he carefully read his speech. He will find it is a much more accurate assessment of the value of immigrants to Canada regardless of what language they speak. I quote from that speech as reported at page 251 of Hansard of May 20 last:

-"Attracted by this diversity which was our national characteristic were thousands upon thousands of people whose racial origins were to be found in the countries of central and eastern Europe and the Baltic States. They brought with them to this country their ancient cultures, their ancient traditions and customs. Each of them in its turn was to enrich our life, to add to it and to make the Canadian nationality something greater, something that it had not been before."

How different is this point of view from the one expresed by the hon. member for

562 HOUSE OF

The Address-Mr. Crestohl Battle River-Camrose. But strangely enough the government by its new and recently announced immigration policy is not consistent with the experience, theory and findings of its colleague, the hon. member for Parkdale, and its action appears to represent a new approach to immigrants and their value to our economy. It is my firm belief that an active program of immigration to Canada would quickly build a home consumers market to replace the export market which world conditions have compelled Canada to lose to a very large extent.

I am convinced that it was shortsightedness which did not allow for a greater influx of immigrants when they were available. If our population today were 30 million, as it may well have been, our problem of finding consumers for Canadian-made products would not be as acute as it is now and unemployment would not be as great.

The Liberal government since 1945 has expanded Canada's immigration program and admitted approximately 1J million immigrants. I was constantly of the opinion that it should have done much more. How shocking, therefore, is the government's announcement that it has stopped immigration except for some selectiveness and that the stoppage will continue until such time as there is relief in the unemployment situation.

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PC

Frank Charles McGee

Progressive Conservative

Mr. McGee:

What are you reading from?

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LIB

Leon David Crestohl

Liberal

Mr. Crestohl:

Mr. Speaker, if the honourable heckler will kindly identify himself or make his question clear I will be happy to answer it.

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PC

Frank Charles McGee

Progressive Conservative

Mr. McGee:

I was wondering what page you were reading from right now.

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May 27, 1958