November 29, 1957

PC

John George Diefenbaker (Prime Minister)

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Diefenbaker:

Mr. Speaker, I am speaking on the question as to whether it is a matter of urgent public importance. The resolution on the order paper-

Topic:   AGRICULTURE
Subtopic:   ALLEGED CRISIS IN INDUSTRY
Sub-subtopic:   MOTION FOR ADJOURNMENT UNDER STANDING ORDER 26
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CCF

Stanley Howard Knowles (Whip of the Co-operative Commonwealth Federation)

Co-operative Commonwealth Federation (C.C.F.)

Mr. Knowles (Winnipeg North Centre):

rise on a point of order. According to the rules, when a motion of this kind is made does Your Honour not read it out and decide whether or not it is of urgent public importance?

Topic:   AGRICULTURE
Subtopic:   ALLEGED CRISIS IN INDUSTRY
Sub-subtopic:   MOTION FOR ADJOURNMENT UNDER STANDING ORDER 26
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LIB

James Sinclair

Liberal

Mr. Sinclair:

Quite right.

Topic:   AGRICULTURE
Subtopic:   ALLEGED CRISIS IN INDUSTRY
Sub-subtopic:   MOTION FOR ADJOURNMENT UNDER STANDING ORDER 26
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PC

Daniel Roland Michener (Speaker of the House of Commons)

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Speaker:

I think the hon. member is right; it is the Speaker's duty to decide whether the matter is within the rules, though I believe it has been customary to take brief advice on the subject. Will the house allow me a minute to consider this?

Topic:   AGRICULTURE
Subtopic:   ALLEGED CRISIS IN INDUSTRY
Sub-subtopic:   MOTION FOR ADJOURNMENT UNDER STANDING ORDER 26
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PC

John George Diefenbaker (Prime Minister)

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Diefenbaker:

That was the attitude I was adopting, simply to bring to Your Honour's attention the fact that it is not one of those matters that are of such importance as require a motion for the adjournment of the house.

The resolution sets out in detail the various steps that are intended to be taken with reference to the agricultural problem of this country. I may add that the legislation committee has been working on the bill to be introduced and at twelve o'clock today will meet for the final determination of the terms of the bill. My submission is that the motion is premature; it is simply trying to beat the gun. Having regard to the resolution that is already on the order paper, it is not a matter of such importance as requires a motion for the adjournment of the house.

Topic:   AGRICULTURE
Subtopic:   ALLEGED CRISIS IN INDUSTRY
Sub-subtopic:   MOTION FOR ADJOURNMENT UNDER STANDING ORDER 26
Permalink
CCF

Hazen Robert Argue

Co-operative Commonwealth Federation (C.C.F.)

Mr. Argue:

Mr. Speaker, with your permission I would like to make a comment on the statement that has been made.

Topic:   AGRICULTURE
Subtopic:   ALLEGED CRISIS IN INDUSTRY
Sub-subtopic:   MOTION FOR ADJOURNMENT UNDER STANDING ORDER 26
Permalink
SC

Thomas James Irwin

Social Credit

Mr. Irwin:

On the point of order, paragraph 3 of standing order 26 reads in part:

He then hands a written statement of the matter proposed to be discussed to Mr. Speaker, who, if he thinks it in order-

Topic:   AGRICULTURE
Subtopic:   ALLEGED CRISIS IN INDUSTRY
Sub-subtopic:   MOTION FOR ADJOURNMENT UNDER STANDING ORDER 26
Permalink
CCF

Stanley Howard Knowles (Whip of the Co-operative Commonwealth Federation)

Co-operative Commonwealth Federation (C.C.F.)

Mr. Knowles (Winnipeg North Centre):

Not

the Prime Minister.

Topic:   AGRICULTURE
Subtopic:   ALLEGED CRISIS IN INDUSTRY
Sub-subtopic:   MOTION FOR ADJOURNMENT UNDER STANDING ORDER 26
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SC

Thomas James Irwin

Social Credit

Mr. Irwin:

Not the Prime Minister nor any other member of the house. I continue:

-and of urgent public importance, reads it out and asks whether the member has the leave of the house.

The Speaker himself decides whether or not it is a matter of urgent public importance.

Topic:   AGRICULTURE
Subtopic:   ALLEGED CRISIS IN INDUSTRY
Sub-subtopic:   MOTION FOR ADJOURNMENT UNDER STANDING ORDER 26
Permalink
PC

Daniel Roland Michener (Speaker of the House of Commons)

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Speaker:

I know what the rule says. The Speaker is actually thinking and would appreciate a little assistance in this matter.

He has had some from the Prime Minister, and would like to hear what the member for Assiniboia has to say on the subject.

Topic:   AGRICULTURE
Subtopic:   ALLEGED CRISIS IN INDUSTRY
Sub-subtopic:   MOTION FOR ADJOURNMENT UNDER STANDING ORDER 26
Permalink
CCF

Hazen Robert Argue

Co-operative Commonwealth Federation (C.C.F.)

Mr. Argue:

I would like to make some comment on the urgency question. Any member who is acquainted with the position of the agricultural industry today will realize that it is in a very deep crisis that requires immediate attention.

On the basis of what the Prime Minister has said there is still no indication as to the date on which the government will advance its own legislation. The resolution to which the Prime Minister has referred was filed on October 31, and I suggest that that is an unwarranted delay.

As far as beating the gun is concerned, to use the Prime Minister's own words, I suggest that this is not likely to be the case in any way, since this motion says that the government should provide guaranteed prices for agricultural products at a level to create parity with other prices and to assure farmers a fair share of the national income, as promised in the recent election campaign.

I would suggest that the terms of the government's own motion show that it is not the intention, according to that motion, to provide prices for agricultural products at a parity level. For all these reasons I submit that my motion is in order.

Topic:   AGRICULTURE
Subtopic:   ALLEGED CRISIS IN INDUSTRY
Sub-subtopic:   MOTION FOR ADJOURNMENT UNDER STANDING ORDER 26
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PC

Edmund Davie Fulton (Minister of Citizenship and Immigration; Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada)

Progressive Conservative

Hon. E. D. Fulton (Minister of Justice):

May

I point out that the terms of the hon. member's motion place it clearly out of order; and to assist Your Honour I would refer you to Bourinot, whose authority I have always found to be unquestioned. At page 310 of the fourth edition Bourinot says, in discussing motions to adjourn the house for the purpose of discussing a matter of urgent public importance:

All the rules of debate apply, of course, to discussions upon such a motion. Discussion cannot be raised on such a motion on any matter already appointed for consideration or of which notice has been given.

The hon. gentleman has clearly brought his motion and the discussion which would arise therefrom within the ambit of item No. 9 on today's order paper, which provides for the discussion in committee of the whole of the government resolution to introduce a measure to establish a system of guaranteed prices for agricultural commodities. Whether or not that measure will be considered adequate is a matter properly to be discussed by the hon. member on that motion, but his present motion is clearly out of order in that it seeks to anticipate the stage at which he can raise that question.

Topic:   AGRICULTURE
Subtopic:   ALLEGED CRISIS IN INDUSTRY
Sub-subtopic:   MOTION FOR ADJOURNMENT UNDER STANDING ORDER 26
Permalink
PC

Daniel Roland Michener (Speaker of the House of Commons)

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Speaker:

I thank hon. members for their assistance. As they will appreciate,

this is the first time I have had to deal with this question. It seems to me that the subject matter of the proposed discussion is one that has been discussed off and on throughout the session, perhaps not by itself but it has been a subject of continual discussion throughout the session and of questions and answers in the house. There has been and will be an opportunity to discuss the matter, more particularly because of the resolution on the order paper.

It seems to me that the hon. member's motion is defeated by subsection (d) of section 6 of standing order 26, to which the hon. member referred. It is in these words:

The motion must not anticipate a matter which has been previously appointed for consideration by the house, or with reference to which a notice of motion has been previously given and not withdrawn.

That seems to me to be an insuperable obstacle to the motion. In any event, I would not have thought the matter properly debatable on a motion of this kind at this time in view of the opportunities there are to discuss the matter and the discussion that has already taken place in the house. Therefore I must reject the hon. member's motion.

On the orders of the day:

Topic:   AGRICULTURE
Subtopic:   ALLEGED CRISIS IN INDUSTRY
Sub-subtopic:   MOTION FOR ADJOURNMENT UNDER STANDING ORDER 26
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LIB

Edward Blake Huffman

Liberal

Mr. E. B. Huffman (Kent, Onl.):

I should like to direct a question to the Prime Minister. When the Prime Minister spoke to the motion of the hon. member for Assiniboia I understood that he was of the opinion that the subject was not of sufficient urgency to warrant moving the adjournment of the house. When the Prime Minister makes his announcement on Monday respecting further legislation for this session, will he give priority to the resolution to establish guaranteed prices for agricultural products?

Topic:   AGRICULTURE
Subtopic:   ALLEGED CRISIS IN INDUSTRY
Sub-subtopic:   MOTION FOR ADJOURNMENT UNDER STANDING ORDER 26
Permalink
PC

John George Diefenbaker (Prime Minister)

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Diefenbaker:

Mr. Speaker, in the first place I did not say it was a matter of no urgency, I said urgency of debate at this time. I would point out to my hon. friend that at no time has the house been held up by the failure of the government to have its legislation ready, and if less time was taken in the discussion of certain items we would get along much faster, and I am hoping we will.

Topic:   AGRICULTURE
Subtopic:   ALLEGED CRISIS IN INDUSTRY
Sub-subtopic:   MOTION FOR ADJOURNMENT UNDER STANDING ORDER 26
Permalink
?

Some hon. Members:

Oh, oh!

Topic:   AGRICULTURE
Subtopic:   ALLEGED CRISIS IN INDUSTRY
Sub-subtopic:   MOTION FOR ADJOURNMENT UNDER STANDING ORDER 26
Permalink
?

An hon. Member:

Closure.

Topic:   AGRICULTURE
Subtopic:   ALLEGED CRISIS IN INDUSTRY
Sub-subtopic:   MOTION FOR ADJOURNMENT UNDER STANDING ORDER 26
Permalink
PC

John George Diefenbaker (Prime Minister)

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Diefenbaker:

I have had the cooperation of my right hon. friend. I want to say that, but it has not been general.

Topic:   AGRICULTURE
Subtopic:   ALLEGED CRISIS IN INDUSTRY
Sub-subtopic:   MOTION FOR ADJOURNMENT UNDER STANDING ORDER 26
Permalink
LIB

George James McIlraith

Liberal

Mr. Mcllrailh:

Why don't you answer the question?

Topic:   AGRICULTURE
Subtopic:   ALLEGED CRISIS IN INDUSTRY
Sub-subtopic:   MOTION FOR ADJOURNMENT UNDER STANDING ORDER 26
Permalink
PC

John George Diefenbaker (Prime Minister)

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Diefenbaker:

If there is a little more co-operation these matters will be introduced at the earliest stage possible. We want this

Inquiries of the Ministry legislation passed as soon as possible, but we have two items to consider. We have the item concerning the estimates that were left over from last session, which involves practically all the estimates. We have brought before the house the legislation that has been necessary to meet immediate conditions, having regard to the order of their urgency and the opportunity to have them passed by the house. The legislation with regard to agriculture is on the order paper, and if my hon. friends will get along a little-

Topic:   AGRICULTURE
Subtopic:   ALLEGED CRISIS IN INDUSTRY
Sub-subtopic:   MOTION FOR ADJOURNMENT UNDER STANDING ORDER 26
Permalink

November 29, 1957