June 26, 1956

LIB

John Whitney Pickersgill (Minister of Citizenship and Immigration)

Liberal

Mr. Pickersgill:

I never admitted racial discrimination.

Topic:   SHIPPING
Subtopic:   SUPPLY SHIP "C. D. HOWE"-REPORT ON FIRE
Sub-subtopic:   REQUEST FOR ELECTION-SENATE REFORM
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CCF

Erhart Regier

Co-operative Commonwealth Federation (C.C.F.)

Mr. Regier:

At least he admitted discrimination on a television program. We have the Minister of Fisheries (Mr. Sinclair) and I will speak kindly of him. He used to represent the seat I have, and he did such a good job of educating my electorate to socialism that the Minister of National Defence (Mr. Campney) will lose if he should decide to be a candidate there the next time. We have the Minister of Veterans Affairs (Mr. Lapointe) who is overburdened. He is supposed to be licking postage stamps and to be running veterans affairs and looking after the war widows of Canada, all at the same time. Somebody mentioned that he was being appointed ambassador to France. I do not know whether he is planning on holding down all three jobs. We have the Minister of Public Works; I think I have said enough about him tonight. We have the Minister of Mines and Technical Surveys (Mr. Prudham) who, I understand, knows almost as much as I do about mines in Canada. As to the Minister of Northern Affairs and National Resources (Mr. Lesage) I wish him well indeed. I hope he can persuade the slow government-and I am not referring to the Socred government alone-of British Columbia finally to release Garibaldi park to the federal government so that we can have a national park for the people of British Columbia.

Topic:   SHIPPING
Subtopic:   SUPPLY SHIP "C. D. HOWE"-REPORT ON FIRE
Sub-subtopic:   REQUEST FOR ELECTION-SENATE REFORM
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LIB

Louis-René Beaudoin (Speaker of the House of Commons)

Liberal

Mr. Speaker:

Order. Under the provisions of standing order 56, paragraph (d), it is my duty to put the amendment to the main motion.

Topic:   SHIPPING
Subtopic:   SUPPLY SHIP "C. D. HOWE"-REPORT ON FIRE
Sub-subtopic:   REQUEST FOR ELECTION-SENATE REFORM
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LIB

Paul Joseph James Martin (Minister of National Health and Welfare)

Liberal

Mr. Martin:

I was paired with the hon. member for Cape Breton South (Mr. Gillis). Had I voted, I would have voted against the amendment.

Topic:   SHIPPING
Subtopic:   SUPPLY SHIP "C. D. HOWE"-REPORT ON FIRE
Sub-subtopic:   REQUEST FOR ELECTION-SENATE REFORM
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LIB

Louis-René Beaudoin (Speaker of the House of Commons)

Liberal

Mr. Speaker:

I declare the amendment to the main motion lost. May I be so bold as to remind the Minister of National Health and Welfare that pairs are not announced until after the Clerk has given the results of the vote to the Speaker and the Speaker has announced the results.

++NAYS

Messrs:

Topic:   SHIPPING
Subtopic:   SUPPLY SHIP "C. D. HOWE"-REPORT ON FIRE
Sub-subtopic:   REQUEST FOR ELECTION-SENATE REFORM
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?

Murdo William Martin

Mr. Marlin:

I am very glad to accept your direction.

Anderson Hellyer

Applewhaite Henderson

Arsenault Henry

Ashbourne Hollingworth

Batten Houck

Benidickson Howe (Port Arthur)

Blackmore Huffman

Blanchette Hunter

Boisvert James

Bonnier Johnston (Bow River)

Bourget Jutras

Bourque Kickham

Breton Kirk (Antigonish-

Brisson Guysborough)

Brown (Brantford) Kirk (Shelburne-

Brown (Essex West) Yarmouth-Clare)

Bruneau LaCroix

Buchanan Laflamme

Byrne Lafontaine

Cameron (High Park) Leduc (Jacques Cartier-

Campney Lasalle)

Caron Lefrangois

Carrick Legare

Carter MacEachen

Cauchon MacKenzie

Cavers Macnaughton

Cloutier McCann

Crestohl McCubbin

Denis McCulloch (Pictou)

Deschatelets Mcllraith

Deslieres Mclvor

Dickey McLeod

Dumas McMillan

Dupuis Mang

Fairey Masse

Forgie Menard

Fraser (St. John's East) Mitchell (Sudbury)

Gagnon Patterson

Garland Pickersgill

Gauthier (Portneuf) Pommer

Gingues Poulin

Girard Power (St. John's West)

Gourd (Chapleau) Proudfoot

Habel Prudham

Hahn Purdy

Hanna Quelch

Hansell Ratelle

Hardie Richard (Ottawa East)

Harris Richard (St. Maurice-

Harrison Lafleche)

Healy Roberge

Topic:   SHIPPING
Subtopic:   SUPPLY SHIP "C. D. HOWE"-REPORT ON FIRE
Sub-subtopic:   REQUEST FOR ELECTION-SENATE REFORM
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PC

Howard Charles Green

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Howard C. Green (Vancouver-Quadra):

Mr. Speaker, there is one question I should like to raise before the motion is passed. It has to do with the conference which is to take place next week in Victoria between the premier of the province of British Columbia and the Minister of Northern Affairs and National Resources (Mr. Lesage). We were told that this conference would be concerned with the question of the development of the Columbia river in British Columbia and with other similar problems which have arisen between the federal government and the provincial government. I believe that because the future of the Columbia river is of such great concern to the whole of the coast province and of the nation there should be some consideration given to what is to be done at this conference next week before the minister leaves the house.

There have been earlier discussions in the house, but since then developments have taken place which have altered the situation considerably and which have made it even more important that a decision be reached by the federal government without any further delay as to just what part it is to take in the development of the power potential of that river.

As you know, Mr. Speaker, last year this house passed an act known as the International River Improvements Act. It contained a new principle in federal legislation in that it gave the dominion licensing control over most of the improvements which are placed on rivers flowing from Canada to the United

5424 HOUSE OF

Columbia River-Power Development States. That question had become of great importance because the government of the province of British Columbia proposed last year to enter into an agreement with the Kaiser interests in the United States for the construction of a dam near the lower end of the Arrow lakes in the Kootenay district of British Columbia. It was felt by the dominion government officials that the result of the construction of such a dam would be to prejudice the over-all development of the Columbia river system in Canada. As a result this legislation was introduced in the house and eventually was adopted with some changes which I think were very material.

Your Honour will perhaps remember that the stand taken by the official opposition on the second reading of that bill was that we believed the issue should be settled between the two governments concerned, and we asked that the bill be sent to the standing committee on external affairs for study and in order that the officials of the dominion government might be heard and also those of the provincial government.

The hearings held by that committee were very successful. As a result, quite a large measure of co-operation was reached between the two governments concerning the bill and, in its final form, the bill was modified a great deal from what it had been originally and much of the bad feeling between the two governments was done away with. I at least hoped that as a result it would be possible to have full co-operation in proceeding with plans for the use of the Columbia river. I am still hoping that that co-operation will be possible. It is only because I believe that the river cannot be developed as it should be for the greatest benefit of the people of my province, and incidentally of the Canadian people, unless the two governments can work out some cooperative plan, that I raise the matter now.

It has been recognized throughout that the key to the whole development was a dam and power plant to be erected at Mica Creek, which is up at the head of the Big Bend about 100 miles north of Revelstoke. There General McNaughton, as the leading dominion authority on the question, foresaw the erection of a very large dam, and last year, in the committee hearings, representatives of both governments admitted there was no reason why the construction of this dam could not be proceeded with just as soon as the final plans could be drawn.

A few days ago, in the sittings of the standing committee on external affairs, General McNaughton stated he was now positive that this plan could go ahead. I hold in my

hand No. 15 of the proceedings of the committee for June 14 of this year. The general had this to say at page 416 concerning Mica Creek:

We are well satisfied it represents a firm conclusion by the consulting engineers who have been doing the work for us. The Mica Creek dam, on the basis of 1,100,000 kilowatts installed would cost, including the power plant, $247 million, and it would give a firm power in kilowatts at the site of 625,000. The estimated head at the normal full pool would be 563 feet. If we include the diversion of 5,000 cubic feet per second by way of Canal Flats into the Columbia,-

There he was referring to a possible diversion of the headwaters of the Kootenay river into the Columbia. The general went on:

-it brings the installed capacity to 1,320,000 kilowatts, and raises the firm power very considerably. The dam, according to lastest proposals, will be a rock fill which is much more stable than the original concrete structure which was proposed, and it has great merit in reducing the total cost from about $417 million down to $247 million for this dam.

That is a very substantial reduction in the estimated cost. In the next paragraph he went on to say:

So, I think that all concerned. Including the various other consultants to whom the matter has been referred, feel that we now have a completely firm proposition for Mica. Within a matter of a very few months the designs given in this book could be translated into contract drawings, and the matter could be launched.

Mr. Speaker, may I move the adjournment of the debate.

Topic:   SHIPPING
Subtopic:   SUPPLY SHIP "C. D. HOWE"-REPORT ON FIRE
Sub-subtopic:   CONFERENCE ON DEVELOPMENT OF COLUMBIA RIVER
Permalink
LIB

Louis-René Beaudoin (Speaker of the House of Commons)

Liberal

Mr. Speaker:

I presume the proceedings from which the hon. member is quoting have been reported?

Topic:   SHIPPING
Subtopic:   SUPPLY SHIP "C. D. HOWE"-REPORT ON FIRE
Sub-subtopic:   CONFERENCE ON DEVELOPMENT OF COLUMBIA RIVER
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PC

Howard Charles Green

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Green:

Yes.

On motion of Mr. Green the debate was adjourned.

Topic:   SHIPPING
Subtopic:   SUPPLY SHIP "C. D. HOWE"-REPORT ON FIRE
Sub-subtopic:   CONFERENCE ON DEVELOPMENT OF COLUMBIA RIVER
Permalink

A message was delivered by Major C. R. Lamoureux, Gentleman Usher of the Black Rod, as follows: Mr. Speaker, the Honourable the Deputy Governor General desires the immediate attendance of this honourable house in the chamber of the honourable the Senate. Accordingly, Mr. Speaker with the house went up to the Senate chamber. And being returned: Mr. Speaker informed the house that the Deputy Governor General had been pleased to give, in Her Majesty's name, the royal assent to the following bills: An act for the relief of Michael Costom. An act for the relief of Marie Theresa Gerega St.-Jacques. An act for the relief of Julius Michael Cantor.An act for the relief of Gerald Zelman. An act for the relief of Lucille Viola Arthur Ward. An act for the relief of May O'Connor MacKenzie. An act for the relief of Rita Cleevely Scott.An act for the relief of Leah Banfield Rideout. An act for the relief of Margaret Isobel Gillespie MacKenzie. An act for the relief of Edda Roehm Sackmann. An act for the relief of Joseph Ernest Adrien Joly. An act for the relief of Jacqueline Bussiere Sirois. An act for the relief of Doris Elaine Cameron Gladwish. An act for the relief of Mary Goodman Lobell. An act Wiseman. for the relief of Jennie ZalezniakAn act for the relief of Phyllis Elizabeth Jardine Williams. An act for the relief of Martha Hope Mac-Dougall Fortier. An act for the relief of Hugh Oliver Semper. An act for the relief of Yvonne Elizabeth Thurgarland Brosseau. An act for the relief of Hugh Lawrence Byers. An act for the relief of Jean Benoit Maille. An act for the relief of Elizabeth Redling Lefebvre. An act for the relief of Marie Cecile Veronique Goudreau Johnstone, otherwise known as Lucille Goudreau Johnstone. An act for the relief of Claire Esther Cohen Weiner. An act for the relief of Vera Norine Tromley Ashford. An act for the relief of Jacques Demers. An act for the relief of Virginia Ruth Jones Lord. An act for the relief of Harold Barnes. An act for the relief of Geraldine Isabella Johnson Mole. An act for the relief of Adam Forbes. An act for the relief of Rose-Anna Rose Crombie. An act for the relief of Esther Pheobe Brunger Abels. An act for the relief of Lorna Elizabeth Cadorette Belinsky. An act for the relief of Benjamin Franklin Luther. An act for the relief of Gordon Frederick Collins. An act to amend the Canadian Farm Loan Act. An act respecting the construction of a line of railway in the province of New Brunswick by Canadian National Railway Company from a point at or near Bartibog in a westerly direction to the Tomogonops river in the vicinity of Little River lakes. An act to incorporate the Albion Insurance Company of Canada. An act respecting the Canadian forces. An act to amend the Emergency Gold Mining Assistance Act. An act to amend the Veterans' Business and Professional Loans Act. An act for granting to Her Majesty certain sums of money for the public service of the financial year ending the 31st March, 1957. The Royal Assent BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE


LIB

Walter Edward Harris (Minister of Finance and Receiver General; Leader of the Government in the House of Commons; Liberal Party House Leader)

Liberal

Mr. Harris:

Mr. Speaker, tomorrow we shall continue with this debate and then take the resolution in the name of the Minister of National Health and Welfare with respect to unemployment assistance costs.

May I raise a point of order at the moment, having to do with the length of the debate upon which we are now embarked. My understanding is that when we amended the rules last year we set out to give to those members who wished to raise grievances a period of two hours less 15 minutes, as I recall it, from the time that the vote was taken on the amendment. In other words, we said that the debate on the amendment would come to an end at quarter past eight and the vote on the main motion would occur at ten o'clock. We had that period during which time we assumed there would be a grievance period. If there has been any interference with that by reason of the royal assent, to the extent of perhaps eight or nine minutes-I am not sure-I would suggest in taking that into account tomorrow that extra time be allowed for the purpose of this debate.

Topic:   SHIPPING
Subtopic:   SUPPLY SHIP "C. D. HOWE"-REPORT ON FIRE
Sub-subtopic:   THE ROYAL ASSENT
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LIB

Louis-René Beaudoin (Speaker of the House of Commons)

Liberal

Mr. Speaker:

The Clerk informs me, in relation to the point made by the Minister of Finance, that tomorrow for private members' grievances there is still available one hour plus 31 minutes-that is, altogether 91 minutes of debate-on this motion.

Topic:   SHIPPING
Subtopic:   SUPPLY SHIP "C. D. HOWE"-REPORT ON FIRE
Sub-subtopic:   THE ROYAL ASSENT
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PC

Howard Charles Green

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Green:

Could we have the other business for tomorrow?

Topic:   SHIPPING
Subtopic:   SUPPLY SHIP "C. D. HOWE"-REPORT ON FIRE
Sub-subtopic:   THE ROYAL ASSENT
Permalink
LIB

Walter Edward Harris (Minister of Finance and Receiver General; Leader of the Government in the House of Commons; Liberal Party House Leader)

Liberal

Mr. Harris:

I gave it. We go on with this debate, and then take the resolution of the Minister of National Health and Welfare.

Topic:   SHIPPING
Subtopic:   SUPPLY SHIP "C. D. HOWE"-REPORT ON FIRE
Sub-subtopic:   THE ROYAL ASSENT
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PC

Howard Charles Green

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Green:

The minister is not announcing any estimates for tomorrow?

Topic:   SHIPPING
Subtopic:   SUPPLY SHIP "C. D. HOWE"-REPORT ON FIRE
Sub-subtopic:   THE ROYAL ASSENT
Permalink
LIB

Walter Edward Harris (Minister of Finance and Receiver General; Leader of the Government in the House of Commons; Liberal Party House Leader)

Liberal

Mr. Harris:

I shall be glad to call the estimates of the Secretary of State if there is any time left after the resolution.

Topic:   SHIPPING
Subtopic:   SUPPLY SHIP "C. D. HOWE"-REPORT ON FIRE
Sub-subtopic:   THE ROYAL ASSENT
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PC

Howard Charles Green

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Green:

In that connection, could the minister tell us what other branches under the Secretary of State will be handled, for example, the library, the archives or the national gallery?

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Subtopic:   SUPPLY SHIP "C. D. HOWE"-REPORT ON FIRE
Sub-subtopic:   THE ROYAL ASSENT
Permalink
LIB

Walter Edward Harris (Minister of Finance and Receiver General; Leader of the Government in the House of Commons; Liberal Party House Leader)

Liberal

Mr. Harris:

The Secretary of State has the printing establishment as well as those estimates which are in the book in his name.

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Subtopic:   SUPPLY SHIP "C. D. HOWE"-REPORT ON FIRE
Sub-subtopic:   THE ROYAL ASSENT
Permalink

It being twelve minutes after ten o'clock the house adjourned, without question put, pursuant to standing order.



Questions


June 26, 1956