May 28, 1948

CCF

Frederick Samuel Zaplitny

Co-operative Commonwealth Federation (C.C.F.)

Mr. ZAPLITNY:

I wish to say only a brief word in support of the resolution and to say also that I am sure we appreciate the sentiments of the hon. member who has just taken his seat. The ancestors of several of my colleagues in this group were from the maritime provinces, and I find them to be industrious and worthy members of the House of Commons.

As one who comes from that part of Manitoba which has suffered from flood conditions, may I say I sympathize with the conditions described by the hon. member for Fraser Valley. I hope the government will continue to do everything possible to look ..after that immediate situation.

I am inclined to agree with the statement -of the hon. member for Souris that it might be necessary and desirable to extend the Prairies Farm Rehabilitation Act so that it would apply to all parts of Canada. That would be a step toward solving the recurring arguments and disputes about jurisdiction, because we would then have one piece of legislation applicable to all parts of Canada, and the matter of jurisdiction would no longer come up.

Recently in Manitoba we suffered severe damage from flooding. In at least two instances the dominion government has a definite share of the responsibility. However I shall not discuss the matter now. There will be an opportunity on another occasion. But if the

Prairie Farm Rehabilitation Act were revised so as to make it applicable to all parts of Canada I believe we would save ourselves a great deal of time in disputing just where the federal government should take over.

I would leave one further thought in connection with the reclamation of land. Now that immigration is again on the increase, it is particularly important that we look toward possibilities of reclaiming land, whether it be in the east, the west or any other part of Canada, where it is possible. Although this is a large country in area, unfortunately much of the land is not arable. There is a certain amount of submarginal and marginal land which, with the application of certain public works and reclamation projects could be brought under cultivation.

If the Minister of Agriculture is to make good his dream of 15,000,000 people in the prairie provinces, and if he is to find room for a portion of them on the land, I believe it will be necessary to carry out projects in other parts of Canada where land may be reclaimed and put into useful production.

As a member from one of the prairie provinces, I am happy to support the resolution, remembering well that in the years of drought and of other misfortunes the people from other parts of Canada came willingly to our assistance.

Topic:   MARSHLANDS
Subtopic:   RECLAMATION AND DEVELOPMENT-ASSISTANCE TO MARITIME PROVINCES
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SC

John Horne Blackmore

Social Credit

Mr. BLACKMORE:

May I add my word of appreciation to the minister for having introduced this legislation. I believe it is fitting to put all Canadians behind the maritimers. This is a move in the right direction. As the hon. member for Davenport has said so well on many occasions, Canada as a whole must stand as a whole; all parts of Canada must be behind those in need, and each part must be interested in every other part, so that this magnificent heritage can be kept at its highest possible degree of value and passed on in that condition to the generations to come.

As the hon. member for Dauphin has just said, the reclamation of our soil is extremely important. I am not sure that up to now we have fully realized how precious and sacred our soil is. Anything that tends to destroy it in any part of Canada is a threat to Canada's strength, and must be resisted and overcome.

This brings me to the conditions in the Fraser valley already mentioned. I feel keenly sympathetic toward the people of the Fraser valley because of their great misfortune. It was only a short time ago that my area was in danger of flooding. I would urge upon the government that they take the dollar sign right out of this question of the Fraser valley flooding. In my view the Fraser valley must

Reclamation of Marshlands

be rescued, salvaged and rehabilitated at the earliest possible day, because it is an important part of Canada. The federal government must lead, in collaboration with British Columbia, to put all Canadians behind British Columbia in its time of distress.

If the minister has not already heard, I am sure he will be pleased to know that the St. Mary's river dam, in which he has been so deeply interested, and for the forwarding and building of which he has done so much, has now passed one great crisis. That grand tunnel which had to be constructed in order to divert the water to permit the building of the dam was completed on Saturday, May 22, according to the Lethbridge Herald. That means great rejoicing in my constituency and through southern Alberta. I personally rejoice and I wish to give the minister full credit for his share in this accomplishment.

This helps me to understand how glad members of the maritime provinces must be because of the measure now to be introduced. I wish to assure people from the maritimes that we Albertans and westerners are just as glad as they are.

Topic:   MARSHLANDS
Subtopic:   RECLAMATION AND DEVELOPMENT-ASSISTANCE TO MARITIME PROVINCES
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PC

George Randolph Pearkes

Progressive Conservative

Mr. PEARKES:

Mr. Chairman, like other hon. members I am pleased to see the bill is being introduced to reclaim land from the ravages of the sea. I regret exceedingly, however, its limited aspects. It deals with the lands in three provinces, and three only. It is about time Canada realized that there are more than three provinces which may be claimed as being maritime provinces.

British Columbia is a maritime province. Manitoba borders on salt water. So does Ontario; and there will be opportunities in the future, if indeed they do not already exist, when land will have to be protected in all those provinces from the inroads of the sea.

It might not be desirable to include protection of prairie lands in the same bill as protection of marshlands against the sea; but I can tell the minister, who has recently returned from a trip to the Pacific coast, upon which occasion he made certain promises in various parts of British Columbia, that in my constituency there are lands which are spoiled by the inroads of the sea-not through any unusual circumstances, such as the very sad circumstances now being experienced in the Fraser valley, but from the day to day rising of the tide.

There was a few years ago a seawall or dike, if you wish so to describe it, protecting a certain valuable acreage just on the outside of Victoria. It was built not by the early pioneers. not by a benevolent imperial or benevolent French government, but by this government. And when one asks that that dike be continued or be completed for the few remaining feet yet required-and I refer to the locality known as Island-view Beach-we are told there is no money available for the reclamation or for the building of works to prevent the inroads of the sea.

I feel that this measure definitely falls short of much that might be required, in that it limits the ability to spend money for this particular type of work only to the Atlantic seaboard.

As is well known in the house, there has been a tremendous influx of people to the southern part of British Columbia. They need food and any food that can be raised is adjacent to a market. Difficulties have been enhanced recently by the increased freight rates on commodities such as potatoes and other vegetables which must be shipped in. I should like to see the provisions of this legislation extended so that dikes required for the protection of lands on the Pacific coast may also be built. If they cannot be constructed under the bill to be brought in, then I hope the Department of Public Works will complete the dikes which it started, thereby making acreage available for the growing of potatoes and vegetables urgently needed on the coast of British Columbia.

Topic:   MARSHLANDS
Subtopic:   RECLAMATION AND DEVELOPMENT-ASSISTANCE TO MARITIME PROVINCES
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SC

Patrick Harvey Ashby

Social Credit

Mr. ASHBY:

Mr. Chairman, I received a letter from home some time ago telling of the tremendous amount of soil that was being carried down the creeks and rivers of Alberta, apparently going into Hudson bay to be deposited so that perhaps some future generations may reclaim it. When this resolution was brought forward here I thought what a shame it was to permit our soils in the western provinces to be lost by erosion, wind and so on and then have to try to reclaim them somewhere else.

Dikes were built in Nova Scotia when the first settlers arrived from France and they are still holding back the sea, while those that have been built since have broken down. Orchards have been flooded, fields ruined and at odd times people have actually been forced to abandon their farms. I know I have harped on this subject many times, but here is a solution of the problem which was offered by a man in 1821. He said:

It appears impossible that the land owners should much longer submit to these intolerable burdens on their estates. They must get ofi these taxes or lose their estates, they must do a great deal more than that indeed, but that they must do at any rate.

I doubt if any finer soil can be found than is the fine silt deposited in these salt marshes.

451S

Supply-Agriculture

If this land is reclaimed it will last for hundreds and hundreds of years without any fertilizers. Speaking of fertilizers, by the way, I never use commercial fertilizers on my farm. The use of commercial fertilizers constitutes one of the greatest hazards that agriculture has to face today. Natural fertilizers preserve the soil. You may not get as good crops if you turn the straw back into the land, but-

Topic:   MARSHLANDS
Subtopic:   RECLAMATION AND DEVELOPMENT-ASSISTANCE TO MARITIME PROVINCES
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LIB

William Henry Golding (Deputy Chair of Committees of the Whole)

Liberal

The DEPUTY CHAIRMAN:

Order. I would ask the hon. member to be kind enough to deal with the resolution which is to assist Nova Scotia, New Brunswick and Prince Edward Island in the reclamation and development of marshlands.

Topic:   MARSHLANDS
Subtopic:   RECLAMATION AND DEVELOPMENT-ASSISTANCE TO MARITIME PROVINCES
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SC

Patrick Harvey Ashby

Social Credit

Mr. ASHBY:

I realize that there has been a lot of talk this afternoon outside the resolution. I simply wanted to point out the value of this soil where no commercial fertilizer will be required for hundreds and hundreds of years. It is well worth reclaiming and I am not objecting to the legislation for one moment.

We should use the experience that is already available in the individuals who have inhabited and made use of this area. They are not individuals who have been trained in our schools, colleges or universities, but they know how to build dikes. As I said before, hundreds of years ago dikes were built by individuals who had never received training in any institution and those dikes are still in existence, whereas those built in modern times have broken down.

The solution is to remove taxes from these people who do not create money but who actually create valuable assets. That should be done as a reward for rendering this service. However, they are being penalized the very money they require to maintain these dikes md reclaim the additional land. Remove that lindrance from them and there will be no need of the government going near the people to construct dikes of any kind.

Resolution reported, read the second time and concurred in. Mr. Gardiner thereupon moved for leave to introduce Bill No. 328, respecting the reclamation and development of marshlands in Nova Scotia, New Brunswick and Prince Edward Island.

Motion agreed to and bill read the first time.

The house in committee of supply, Mr. Goldinig in the chair.

Topic:   MARSHLANDS
Subtopic:   RECLAMATION AND DEVELOPMENT-ASSISTANCE TO MARITIME PROVINCES
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DEPARTMENT OP AGRICULTURE


Experimental farms service



15. Branch farms and stations and illustration stations, $3,372,320.


SC

Anthony Hlynka

Social Credit

Mr. HLYNKA:

The other day I inquired whether the Department of Agriculture made

any grants to farmers who were operating illustration stations at their own expense, and the minister replied that the department pays a small rental to farmers who own and operate illustration stations of from fifteen acres up. I should like a little more information on that, since there are several farmers in my constituency who operate illustration stations. They have been able to build them up but now find it difficult to maintain them and to obtain sufficient help who would explain the results to visitors.

There is one farmer in particular in my constituency, William Zazula, of Willingdon, who has one of the finest orchards I have seen. He wrote the department asking if anything could be done to help him in the matter of expenses, in order that he could pay the hired help required to look after visitors. Thousands of people from all over Canada and the United States visit this particular farm. It is only six acres in extent, but in addition he has several acres of flowers of various kinds. Could something be done to help him? Could the Department of Agriculture, for instance, not make a grant after they have assessed the value of the station to the community, and this is more than a community affair? I think the department should encourage such illustration stations in western Canada.

I have on my file a letter written by the deputy minister of agriculture to the gentleman of whom I spoke, and in that letter the deputy minister says that, so far as the western provinces are concerned, the department had no appropriation for such assistance. Why limit such assistance to any part of Canada? I think such assistance should be given equally in all parts, particularly in the west, where the pioneers in this field are rendering a great service to this country in experimenting with various types of fruits and vegetables, grasses and so forth. I would ask the minister to consult with his officials to see whether any assistance can be given in this case. I would appreciate it if the minister would indicate how one should proceed in order to get such assistance.

Topic:   DEPARTMENT OP AGRICULTURE
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LIB

James Garfield Gardiner (Minister of Agriculture)

Liberal

Right Hon. J. G. GARDINER (Minister of Agriculture):

We do, of course, negotiate with each individual who is going to establish an illustration station and enter into an arrangement with him as to what the payment is to be. Payments are usually made on the basis of so much per acre, by rental, and the operator gets the produce of the land and sells it for his own benefit. It is an arrangement entered into with the individual who operates the station. Of course we endeavour to have

Bell Telephone Company

a uniform basis, taking into consideration the different conditions, the number of acres, and so on.

Topic:   DEPARTMENT OP AGRICULTURE
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SC

Anthony Hlynka

Social Credit

Mr. HLYNKA:

Whom would this farmer have to get in touch with? Would he have to apply to the branch of the department in Edmonton or write to Ottawa?

Topic:   DEPARTMENT OP AGRICULTURE
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LIB

James Garfield Gardiner (Minister of Agriculture)

Liberal

Mr. GARDINER:

If he wrote to Ottawa we would put him in touch with the proper party. There is a supervisor of illustration stations at Lacombe, who draws a salary, I notice, of 82,580, whose job it is to supervise the stations in that area. There is an organization right across the country, but the nearest supervisor to the farmer my hon. friend mentioned would be the one at Lacombe.

Topic:   DEPARTMENT OP AGRICULTURE
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Item agreed to. At six o'clock the Speaker resumed the chair and the house took recess. After Recess The house resumed at eight o'clock.


PRIVATE BILLS

BELL TELEPHONE COMPANY OF CANADA


On the order: Third reading of Bill No. 8 (letter C of the Senate), intituled: "An act respecting The Bell Telephone Company of Canada."-Mr. Rinfret.


LIB

William Ross Macdonald (Deputy Speaker and Chair of Committees of the Whole of the House of Commons)

Liberal

Mr. DEPUTY SPEAKER:

Mr. Rinfret moves that Bill No. 8 be now read the third time. Is it the pleasure of the house to adopt the motion?

Topic:   PRIVATE BILLS
Subtopic:   BELL TELEPHONE COMPANY OF CANADA
Permalink
?

Some hon. MEMBERS:

Carried.

Topic:   PRIVATE BILLS
Subtopic:   BELL TELEPHONE COMPANY OF CANADA
Permalink
CCF

Stanley Howard Knowles (Whip of the Co-operative Commonwealth Federation)

Co-operative Commonwealth Federation (C.C.F.)

Mr. KNOWLES:

On division.

Topic:   PRIVATE BILLS
Subtopic:   BELL TELEPHONE COMPANY OF CANADA
Permalink

May 28, 1948