October 26, 1945

RAILWAYS AND SHIPPING

SECOND REPORT OF STANDING COMMITTEE


Mr. RALPH MAYBANK (Winnipeg South Centre) presented the second report of the standing committee on railways and shipping owned, operated and controlled by the government. Firearms


REFERENCE TO COMMITTEE OF SUPPLY

LIB

James Lorimer Ilsley (Minister of Finance and Receiver General)

Liberal

Hon. J. L. ILSLEY (Minister of Finance) moved:

That items 377, 378 and 421 of the estimates for 1945-46, approved and reported upon by the standing committee on railways and shipping owned, operated and controlled by the government, be referred to the committee of supply.

Topic:   REFERENCE TO COMMITTEE OF SUPPLY
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Motion agreed to.


FIREARMS


Hon. L. S. ST. LAURENT (Minister of Justice): Mr. Speaker, the hon. member for Wellington South (Mr. Gladstone) asked a question on October 22, as reported on page 1351 of Hansard, with regard to the use of firearms. I have received a report from the commissioner of the Royal Canadian Mounted Police which will constitute an answer to the question. Measures deemed to be appropriate have already been taken to control the entry of such souvenirs as revolvers, pistols, et cetera, into Canada by returning members of the Canadian armed forces. The Department of National Defence (army, navy and air force) have all issued orders prohibiting the possession or retention of any weapons or ammunition taken from the enemy in the field during hostilities or after the cessation of hostilities. Any revolvers or auto-loading pistols which are brought back from overseas have to be registered in accordance with the provisions of the criminal code. In addition, under the automatic firearms regulation, 1945, P.C. 4885, dated July 10, 1945, provision is made in this regulation banning the importation of automatic firearms. These automatic firearms are more commonly referred to as tommy guns. This regulation provides for the issuance of permits to allow persons to have such automatic firearms in their possession, but the commissioner has already issued orders to the effect that such permits are to be kept to an absolute minimum and issued only when the firearms in question have been rendered useless so that they cannot be used again for firing purposes. Remarks were also made'in the house at the same time concerning defence of Canada regulation 37A. In this regard, while certain paragraphs of that regulation were revoked, thus removing from control of that regulation all firearms surrendered by aliens under war-time legislation, the control of such firearms comes under the criminal code, and it is encumbent upon such persons to obtain a permit in form 76B from the competent provincial authorities before they can legally regain possession [Mr. Mavbank.l of any firearms which they may have originally surrendered under the defence of Canada regulations.


PC

Karl Kenneth Homuth

Progressive Conservative

Mr. HOMUTH:

Why put it on the provincial authorities?

Mr. ST. LAURENT: It so happens that

I am not responsible for the British North America Act.

Topic:   REFERENCE TO COMMITTEE OF SUPPLY
Subtopic:   FIREARMS
Sub-subtopic:   CONDITIONS OF IMPORT, POSSESSION AND USE
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PC

Karl Kenneth Homuth

Progressive Conservative

Mr. HOMUTH:

I would ask the minister

to clarify his statement. There are people who are classified under the laws of Canada as aliens who really are not aliens; they are Canadians; some of them have fought in the wars of Canada, and so on, but under the law they cannot have firearms. The minister says that under the defence of Canada regulations the responsibility for these things is provincial. We have had so much of this business of the federal government throwing responsibility on the provincial governments-

Topic:   REFERENCE TO COMMITTEE OF SUPPLY
Subtopic:   FIREARMS
Sub-subtopic:   CONDITIONS OF IMPORT, POSSESSION AND USE
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?

Some hon. MEMBERS:

Order.

Topic:   REFERENCE TO COMMITTEE OF SUPPLY
Subtopic:   FIREARMS
Sub-subtopic:   CONDITIONS OF IMPORT, POSSESSION AND USE
Permalink
PC

Karl Kenneth Homuth

Progressive Conservative

Mr. HOMUTH:

Wait just a moment; I

can yell louder than any of you. I say to the Minister of Justice in all deference and in all seriousness, and with no wish to intrude, Mr. Speaker, that some regulation should be made whereby there should be cooperation so that people in our districts wrho are ordinarily looked upon as of alien descent should have the right to firearms.

Topic:   REFERENCE TO COMMITTEE OF SUPPLY
Subtopic:   FIREARMS
Sub-subtopic:   CONDITIONS OF IMPORT, POSSESSION AND USE
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LIB

James Horace King (Speaker of the Senate)

Liberal

Mr. SPEAKER:

Order. I must remind

hon. members that the statement made by the minister is not debatable.

Topic:   REFERENCE TO COMMITTEE OF SUPPLY
Subtopic:   FIREARMS
Sub-subtopic:   CONDITIONS OF IMPORT, POSSESSION AND USE
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PC

Karl Kenneth Homuth

Progressive Conservative

Mr. HOMUTH:

It is a debatable matter

but we cannot get a chance to debate it.

Topic:   REFERENCE TO COMMITTEE OF SUPPLY
Subtopic:   FIREARMS
Sub-subtopic:   CONDITIONS OF IMPORT, POSSESSION AND USE
Permalink
PC

Gordon Knapman Fraser

Progressive Conservative

Mr. FRASER:

This matter is something

that is really-

Topic:   REFERENCE TO COMMITTEE OF SUPPLY
Subtopic:   FIREARMS
Sub-subtopic:   CONDITIONS OF IMPORT, POSSESSION AND USE
Permalink
LIB

James Horace King (Speaker of the Senate)

Liberal

Mr. SPEAKER:

Order.

Topic:   REFERENCE TO COMMITTEE OF SUPPLY
Subtopic:   FIREARMS
Sub-subtopic:   CONDITIONS OF IMPORT, POSSESSION AND USE
Permalink
PC

Gordon Knapman Fraser

Progressive Conservative

Mr. FRASER:

I just want to ask the minister a question.

Topic:   REFERENCE TO COMMITTEE OF SUPPLY
Subtopic:   FIREARMS
Sub-subtopic:   CONDITIONS OF IMPORT, POSSESSION AND USE
Permalink
LIB

James Horace King (Speaker of the Senate)

Liberal

Mr. SPEAKER:

We have not reached the

orders of the day.

Topic:   REFERENCE TO COMMITTEE OF SUPPLY
Subtopic:   FIREARMS
Sub-subtopic:   CONDITIONS OF IMPORT, POSSESSION AND USE
Permalink
PC

Gordon Knapman Fraser

Progressive Conservative

Mr. FRASER:

May I not ask a question,

Mr. Speaker?

Topic:   REFERENCE TO COMMITTEE OF SUPPLY
Subtopic:   FIREARMS
Sub-subtopic:   CONDITIONS OF IMPORT, POSSESSION AND USE
Permalink

October 26, 1945