September 18, 1945

INDUSTRIAL RELATIONS-EXTERNAL AFFAIRS

LIB

William Lyon Mackenzie King (Prime Minister; Secretary of State for External Affairs; President of the Privy Council)

Liberal

Right Hon. W. L. MACKENZIE KING (Prime Minister) moved:

That standing order 63 be amended by striking out the -words "and international" in subsection (j) and adding after subsection (k): (1) On external affairs, to consist of 20 members, 8 of whom shall constitute a quorum.

He said: Hon. members will recall that it was suggested by the leader of the opposition (Mr. Bracken) a few days ago that the committee on industrial and international relations should be divided into two separate committees, one having to do with labour and industrial relations and the other with commonwealth and foreign relations-I think those are the words my hon. friend used. I mentioned that at a previous session of parliament the same suggestion had been made. It was, I think, by my hon. friend the leader of the C.C.F. group (Mr. Coldwell). At the time I intimated that that course might be advisable.

As I said the other day, I think it is desirable to have two separate committees, one on industrial relations and the other on external relations. I chose the words "industrial relations" and "external affairs" as being sufficiently comprehensive to include all that has

been suggested. The leader of the opposition suggested, if I remember rightly, a committee on "labour and industrial relations". Of course, labour is one party to industry, and by using the expression "industrial relations", other parties, which would include management, capital and the community, would be included. I should think the more comprehensive designation would be the preferable.

In regard to international relations my hon. friend suggested "commonwealth and foreign relations". Here again I feel that the term "international relations" or "external affairs" would be broader and would include everything which is suggested by "commonwealth and foreign relations". The term "external affairs" has been used by different governments of the commonwealth in dealing with matters pertaining not only to relations between the different nations of the commonwealth, but also with regard to matters that relate to foreign countries. It is important that the distinction should be kept between foreign affairs and those affairs that might be regarded as interimperial or commonwealth. But all are included in the term "external affairs". The term was used when the Department of External Affairs was created to cover both relations within the commonwealth and relations .ith foreign countries. I therefore feel it would be preferable to use the term "external affairs rather than commonwealth and foreign relations".

The conference which was held in London in 1926 drew up a statement of the relations as they now exist within the commonwealth, and^ defined the position which had been attained by the dominions as well as by the United Kingdom. In what is known as the Balfour declaration the term used is "domestic and external affairs," there being no subordination one way or the other between the dominions in regard to the control of their own affairs, whether domestic or external, and the United Kingdom and its control of its affairs, domestic or external.

In these circumstances I would suggest that to use the term "industrial relations" in the one case and "external affairs" in the other for the names of the two committees would be the more appropriate; and may I say that the government is only too happy to have these two committees established in place of the one which at present exists.

Topic:   INDUSTRIAL RELATIONS-EXTERNAL AFFAIRS
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Mr. M. J. COLD WELL@Rosetown-Biggar

I am veiy glad to see this motion moved, and I think the Prime Minister's suggestion as to the naming of the committees is a good one. It seems to me accurately to portray what those committees should be concerned with.

Canadian Navy ______

But there is one phase of the motion which I want to draw to his attention-that it provides for only twenty members, eight of whom shall constitute a quorum. I think that this is a very important committee; more members of the house are interested in external affairs than in some of the other committees where the membership runs up to well over fifty. Indeed there is only one standing committee with a smaller number of members, and that is on debates, where we have twelve members.

The proposal for the industrial committee is, as I take it, that it remain at thirty-five members; and it seems to me that this very important committee on external affairs should have a membership at least equal to that of the industrial committee, because many members of the house will want to be on that committee.

Then, too, there are in the house at the present time several parties, all of whom will want some membership on that committee, and twenty, it seems to me, does not give the necessary representation.

I do not want to move that "20" be struck out and "35" substituted therefor. I believe that one has only to draw the matter to the attention of the Prime Minister and a satisfactory solution will be arrived at.

Topic:   INDUSTRIAL RELATIONS-EXTERNAL AFFAIRS
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LIB

William Lyon Mackenzie King (Prime Minister; Secretary of State for External Affairs; President of the Privy Council)

Liberal

Mr. MACKENZIE KING:

May I say to

my hon. friend that after the notice was placed on the order paper the Clerk drew to my attention the fact that the numbers he had inserted were "20" and "8", and I really intended to mention that if the house wished to have a larger number, a larger number could be immediately substituted. With the consent of the house I would have "35" substituted for "20" and "10" for "8" in the resolution, which would make the membership of the external affairs committee the same as that of the committee on industrial relations. Motion as amended agreed to.

Topic:   INDUSTRIAL RELATIONS-EXTERNAL AFFAIRS
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CANADIAN NAVY

INQUIRY AS TO CONDITIONS OF POST-WAR RECRUITMENT


On the orders of the day:


PC

Grote Stirling

Progressive Conservative

Hon. GROTE STIRLING (Yale):

I wish to ask the Minister of National Defence for Naval Services a question in regard to a statement which appeared in the Vancouver Daily Province to the effect that recruiting for the navy was to be opened for 4,000 out of a post-war total of 12,000. It pointed out also that those who were applying were largely civilians, but that increasing numbers of those now being demobilized were anxious to get into the permanent naval service. Would

the minister be good enough to make a statement with regard to this, as tcv whether it applies all over Canada and whether these recruits will enter direct into the Royal Canadian Navy or, as hitherto in recent years, into the volunteer reserve?

Topic:   CANADIAN NAVY
Subtopic:   INQUIRY AS TO CONDITIONS OF POST-WAR RECRUITMENT
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LIB

Douglas Charles Abbott (Minister of National Defence; Minister of National Defence for Naval Services)

Liberal

Hon. DOUGLAS ABBOTT (Minister of National Defence for Naval Services):

I did

not see the press item to which my hon. friend refers, but the position, as I think the house is aware, is this. A week or ten days ago-it may be two weeks-recruiting in all three services was authorized in what was referred to as an interim force, the term of enlistment to be for a period to expire on September 30, 1947. No definite number for these recruitments has been fixed, and so far no definite decision has been taken as to the size of the permanent force in any of the three services. The enlistments for these interim forces are being taken from those who are now serving. One of the main purposes in arranging for such enlistments now was to give men who might be interested in serving in the permanent forces after the war the assurance that over the next two years they would have a definite engagement and they would be able to decide, after the conditions and the size of the permanent forces were known, whether or not they would wish to serve in them. The statement which was issued at the time this type of enlistment was authorized indicated that men who enlisted for this special term would be given special consideration for enlistment in the permanent forces.

Topic:   CANADIAN NAVY
Subtopic:   INQUIRY AS TO CONDITIONS OF POST-WAR RECRUITMENT
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PC

Gordon Knapman Fraser

Progressive Conservative

Mr. FRASER:

Further in regard to the

question asked the Minister of National Defence by the member for Yale, will the minister say whether the boys who wish to sign up in the Royal Navy have to sign for seven years, or has that been reduced to five?

Topic:   CANADIAN NAVY
Subtopic:   INQUIRY AS TO CONDITIONS OF POST-WAR RECRUITMENT
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PC

Grote Stirling

Progressive Conservative

Mr. STIRLING:

The Royal Navy?

Topic:   CANADIAN NAVY
Subtopic:   INQUIRY AS TO CONDITIONS OF POST-WAR RECRUITMENT
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PC

Gordon Knapman Fraser

Progressive Conservative

Mr. FRASER:

The Royal Canadian Navy.

Topic:   CANADIAN NAVY
Subtopic:   INQUIRY AS TO CONDITIONS OF POST-WAR RECRUITMENT
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LIB

Douglas Charles Abbott (Minister of National Defence; Minister of National Defence for Naval Services)

Liberal

Mr. ABBOTT:

I think it is still seven

years, but I will make inquiries and give an answer to-morrow. I believe it is still seven years.

Topic:   CANADIAN NAVY
Subtopic:   INQUIRY AS TO CONDITIONS OF POST-WAR RECRUITMENT
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MEAT RATIONING

CONFERENCE BETWEEN GOVERNMENT AND MEAT DEALERS ASSOCIATION


On the orders of the day:


PC

Mark Cecil Senn

Progressive Conservative

Mr. M. C. SENN (Haldimand):

I should like to address a question to the Prime Minister or the responsible minister in charge of the department under which this matter comes. Owing to differences of opinion and

Meat Rationing

some misunderstanding which I think exist throughout Canada to-day with respect to the rationing of meat, will the government undertake that the conference which is to be held to-morrow between government representatives and the Retail Meat Dealers association be held in public, so that the widest possible information regarding meat rationing may be available to the people of Canada? I know a number of members who would like to attend that gathering.

Topic:   MEAT RATIONING
Subtopic:   CONFERENCE BETWEEN GOVERNMENT AND MEAT DEALERS ASSOCIATION
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LIB

William Lyon Mackenzie King (Prime Minister; Secretary of State for External Affairs; President of the Privy Council)

Liberal

Right Hon. W. L. MACKENZIE KING (Prime Minister):

I should wish to consult with the Minister of Finance before giving an answer to that question. There are advantages in having the conference in public, and there are distinct advantages also in having some conferences held in private where matters of a technical character are being discussed and where suggestions are being put forward by different sides. In most of these matters, I think, the government usually leaves it to the parties themselves. In this matter I should think that it might be advisable to ascertain in advance the opinion of the members of the wartime prices and trade board, since they will have a good deal to do and say in the matters that are being discussed. However, I am not giving any final word at the moment.

Topic:   MEAT RATIONING
Subtopic:   CONFERENCE BETWEEN GOVERNMENT AND MEAT DEALERS ASSOCIATION
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PC

Mark Cecil Senn

Progressive Conservative

Mr. SENN:

Would it be possible for us to be informed in time to attend if it is decided to hold the conference in public?

Topic:   MEAT RATIONING
Subtopic:   CONFERENCE BETWEEN GOVERNMENT AND MEAT DEALERS ASSOCIATION
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LIB

William Lyon Mackenzie King (Prime Minister; Secretary of State for External Affairs; President of the Privy Council)

Liberal

Mr. MACKENZIE KING:

I should not like to say that the government would make an announcement on the radio, but we might have it understood that if hon. members will inquire of the officials at the front door the information will be given to them at least an hour before the committee meets.

Topic:   MEAT RATIONING
Subtopic:   CONFERENCE BETWEEN GOVERNMENT AND MEAT DEALERS ASSOCIATION
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September 18, 1945