April 11, 1945

IND

Joseph Sasseville Roy

Independent

Mr. ROY:

Well, Mr. Chairman, I am really at a loss to know whether it is the resolution that is before the committee or whether we are discussing some item that is not specified. For five days now I have heard many members discussing the whole resolution and they were in order. Will you therefore tell me whether we are speaking on the resolution-yes or no? Will you tell me that? If so, I will abide by your ruling.

Topic:   DEPARTMENT OF MUNITIONS AND SUPPLY
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LIB

William Henry Golding

Liberal

The ACTING CHAIRMAN (Mr. Golding):

I must rule that the hon. member is out of order. If he wished to discuss the question of conscription or anything of that kind he should have done so when the defence department was before the committee. We are now discussing munitions and supply.

Topic:   DEPARTMENT OF MUNITIONS AND SUPPLY
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NAT
LIB

William Henry Golding

Liberal

The ACTING CHAIRMAN (Mr. Golding):

rMr. Roy.l

The minister made a statement last night and gave details which are now before the committee.

Topic:   DEPARTMENT OF MUNITIONS AND SUPPLY
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IND

Joseph Sasseville Roy

Independent

Mr. ROY:

I will continue to make my

point, why I am opposing the resolution that is before the committee. This pronouncement of the Prime Minister is very clear and quite formal. I am making my point, why I oppose the resolution, andl I have serious reasons. It is of such importance, voting for or against this huge appropriation, that a member has the right to explain himself, using all the time that is allowed him. Yet the Prime Minister said, at page 2419 of Hansard-

Topic:   DEPARTMENT OF MUNITIONS AND SUPPLY
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LIB

William Henry Golding

Liberal

The ACTING CHAIRMAN (Mr. Golding):

Order. I must insist that the hon. member . keep to the question that is before the committee. The question of conscription is not before the committee. I repeat, if the hon. member had desired to discuss that point at all it should have been discussed when the Department of National Defence was before the committee. I think the hon. member appreciates that as well as I do.

Topic:   DEPARTMENT OF MUNITIONS AND SUPPLY
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IND

Joseph Sasseville Roy

Independent

Mr. ROY:

Well, Mr. Chairman, I am sorry to have to fight my case here but many members tell me I am right. Here is the resolution we have before us.

Topic:   DEPARTMENT OF MUNITIONS AND SUPPLY
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LIB
IND

Joseph Sasseville Roy

Independent

Mr. ROY:

The resolution covers all kinds

of things as to Canada's security, defence, peace and order, and that involves our external as well as our internal policy. That is the resolution which is before me.

Topic:   DEPARTMENT OF MUNITIONS AND SUPPLY
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LIB

Ian Alistair Mackenzie (Minister of Veterans Affairs; Leader of the Government in the House of Commons; Liberal Party House Leader)

Liberal

Mr. MACKENZIE (Vancouver Centre):

The Chairman is on his feet.

Topic:   DEPARTMENT OF MUNITIONS AND SUPPLY
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LIB

William Henry Golding

Liberal

The ACTING CHAIRMAN (Mr. Golding):

I hope the hon. member will cooperate with the Chair. I do not wish to be harsh in matters of this kind. I think the committee has been given great leeway all the way through, but I must insist-and I am perfectly right in insisting-that hon. members must now keep to the question before the committee. I so rule.

Topic:   DEPARTMENT OF MUNITIONS AND SUPPLY
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IND

Joseph Sasseville Roy

Independent

Mr. ROY:

I should like to abide by your

ruling, Mr. Chairman, but as I said, I wish to put this on the record. For five days general speeches have been made on the whole resolution at any stage of the discussion in the committee. You remember what has happened in this committee. My statement is quite true, and if I am not to be given the same amount of justice that was given to the rest-

Topic:   DEPARTMENT OF MUNITIONS AND SUPPLY
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LIB

William Henry Golding

Liberal

The ACTING CHAIRMAN (Mr. Golding):

Order.

War Appropriation-Munitions and Supply

Topic:   DEPARTMENT OF MUNITIONS AND SUPPLY
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IND

Joseph Sasseville Roy

Independent

Mr. ROY:

-since this debate started, I can speak within the rules long enough so that the debate may last longer than the government would like. All I ask is the same share of justice as has been given the rest.

Topic:   DEPARTMENT OF MUNITIONS AND SUPPLY
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LIB

William Henry Golding

Liberal

The ACTING CHAIRMAN (Mr. Golding):

I think the hon. member is hardly fair in using the words he has just used. I do want to be fair. As far as the Chair is concerned, I want to be fair to every member, but I must repeat that the hon. member is entirely out of order in discussing conscription on the matter with which we are now dealing. I must insist that he keep to the question that is before the committee.

Topic:   DEPARTMENT OF MUNITIONS AND SUPPLY
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NAT

William Earl Rowe

National Government

Mr. ROWE:

Mr. Chairman, on a point of order, on what item is the resolution being discussed?

Topic:   DEPARTMENT OF MUNITIONS AND SUPPLY
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LIB

William Henry Golding

Liberal

The ACTING CHAIRMAN (Mr. Golding):

We are; now discussing the Department of Munitions and Supply. We have dealt with the naval department, national defence, and so forth, and we are now discussing munitions and supply and the statement the minister made last night.

Topic:   DEPARTMENT OF MUNITIONS AND SUPPLY
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CCF

William Scottie Bryce

Co-operative Commonwealth Federation (C.C.F.)

Mr. BRYCE:

I had no intention of taking part in this argument, but I was with the deputation to which the hon. member for Winnipeg North Centre referred, ahd I wish to concur in what he said. I am quite sure he made a true statement of what really took place at that meeting. I am quite sure the minister remembers that we asked him before we left if we could make a public statement that there would be plenty of work in Winnipeg this summer, and he assured us that there would be and that he wanted us to say so. I had a conversation with the minister myself about re-tooling. It was off the record and I do not think it has ever been mentioned before by any member of the deputation or myself. I hope the minister does not mean what he said to the effect that we did not have the right to bring a deputation to him again. I hope he does not mean that I would not have the right to bring a deputation from my constituency of Selkirk if I felt like it and he was agreeable.

Topic:   DEPARTMENT OF MUNITIONS AND SUPPLY
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LIB

Clarence Decatur Howe (Minister of Reconstruction; Minister of Munitions and Supply)

Liberal

Mr. HOWE:

It all depends on whether or not hon. members who cojne with deputations are prepared to quote me correctly. The previous speaker was not. My hon. friend said he remembers the conversation about Te-tooling and he also talks about employment in the summer. I point out to him this is early April. He is quoting me correctly, and I have no objection to that; but I expect when members rise in their places in this 32283-51

House of Commons to quote me, they will quote me correctly. Is my hon. friend prepared to deny the suggestion that I am telling the truth?

Topic:   DEPARTMENT OF MUNITIONS AND SUPPLY
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CCF

William Scottie Bryce

Co-operative Commonwealth Federation (C.C.F.)

Mr. BRYCE:

I said I concur in what the hon. member for Winnipeg North Ctentre said. I say that he made a perfectly truthful statement as to what was said at the interview.

Topic:   DEPARTMENT OF MUNITIONS AND SUPPLY
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April 11, 1945