July 25, 1944

LIB

William Lyon Mackenzie King (Prime Minister; Secretary of State for External Affairs; President of the Privy Council)

Liberal

Mr. MACKENZIE KING:

I spoke of their being an asset as well.

Topic:   FAMILY ALLOWANCES
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR PAYMENTS IN RESPECT OF CHILDREN UNDER SIXTEEN
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NAT

Herbert Alexander Bruce

National Government

Mr. BRUCE:

I am afraid that he does not know much about farmers because many of them could not get a living without^ children to help them. The other day I visited an

Family Allowances

adjoining farm where I saw a child of seven years of age driving a tractor; another child of ten assisted his father to bale hay on one of these modem machines.

I take second place to nobody in my efforts over the years to assist the underprivileged. During a period of, twenty-five years, while acting as surgeon in a large hospital, at least fifty per cent of my work was devoted to operations on the poor without any recompense, and I was very happy indeed to be able to render that service. I am not unique in this particular; every medical man and every surgeon in all parts of the country are doing the same thing.

Topic:   FAMILY ALLOWANCES
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR PAYMENTS IN RESPECT OF CHILDREN UNDER SIXTEEN
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LIB

Vincent Dupuis

Liberal

Mr. DUPUIS:

We would like you to continue your "operations" in favour of social security.

Topic:   FAMILY ALLOWANCES
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR PAYMENTS IN RESPECT OF CHILDREN UNDER SIXTEEN
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NAT

Herbert Alexander Bruce

National Government

Mr. BRUCE:

I may refer for a moment to the social security committee of which I was a member and the work we have done during the last two years on the subject of national health insurance, which has a direct bearing on the bill we are now considering. Since February, 1942, when an advisory committee on health insurance was created under the chairmanship of Doctor J. J. Heagerty, an intensive study of public health and medical care has been made by them. In carrying out these studies the committee obtained the views of sixteen national groups who appointed their own committees to study the subject of health insurance. These consisted of the Canadian Medical Association, the Canadian Dental Association, the Canadian Nursing Association, and hospital and other affiliated associations. The majority favoured a provincial plan of health insurance aided by dominion grants. The question of the health of the people of Canada was also made the subject of the meeting of the Dominion Council of Health in 1941. From all this work a draft bill was presented to the committee on social security at the beginning of the 1943 session, and since then we have heard 117 witnesses, representing all phases of public opinion on the subject. We have just concluded consideration of this draft bill, but were not able to deal with the financial clauses, since these must be the subject of agreement between the dominion and the provinces. This means that it must await a dominion-provincial conference, the date of which has not yet been set, so that this important piece of legislation will have to be left over until next year.

I have given the house a brief account of the work which 'has been put into the proposed bill of national health insurance. In

contrast with this I would ask hon. members to compare the method adopted in regard to another social security measure of equal importance, the proposed family allowances bill. This bill, of a much more controversial nature, is brought down, as my leader said to-day, in the last days of the last session of a dying parliament, without any consideration at all, although it is not to become effective until July, 1945.

Topic:   FAMILY ALLOWANCES
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR PAYMENTS IN RESPECT OF CHILDREN UNDER SIXTEEN
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LIB

William Lyon Mackenzie King (Prime Minister; Secretary of State for External Affairs; President of the Privy Council)

Liberal

Mr. MACKENZIE KING:

May I ask my hon. friend on what authority he says that this is the last session of this parliament?

Topic:   FAMILY ALLOWANCES
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR PAYMENTS IN RESPECT OF CHILDREN UNDER SIXTEEN
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NAT

Herbert Alexander Bruce

National Government

Mr. BRUCE:

I assume it is to be the last

session.

Topic:   FAMILY ALLOWANCES
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR PAYMENTS IN RESPECT OF CHILDREN UNDER SIXTEEN
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LIB

William Lyon Mackenzie King (Prime Minister; Secretary of State for External Affairs; President of the Privy Council)

Liberal

Mr. MACKENZIE KING:

That is quite

different.

Topic:   FAMILY ALLOWANCES
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR PAYMENTS IN RESPECT OF CHILDREN UNDER SIXTEEN
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NAT

Herbert Alexander Bruce

National Government

Mr. BRUCE:

If I am wrong in my assumption, perhaps the Prime Minister will correct me.

Topic:   FAMILY ALLOWANCES
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR PAYMENTS IN RESPECT OF CHILDREN UNDER SIXTEEN
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LIB

William Lyon Mackenzie King (Prime Minister; Secretary of State for External Affairs; President of the Privy Council)

Liberal

Mr. MACKENZIE KING:

I have made it very plain that the life of this parliament does not expire until the 17th of April udkt. It is quite possible that there will be another session after this. I am not saying that there will be; I am not saying there will not be; but when my hon. friend says that this is the last session, then I ask him on what authority he makes the statement.

Topic:   FAMILY ALLOWANCES
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR PAYMENTS IN RESPECT OF CHILDREN UNDER SIXTEEN
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NAT

Herbert Alexander Bruce

National Government

Mr. BRUCE:

The Prime Minister has not denied that it may be the last session.

I would ask, Mr. Speaker, why this great haste. If so urgently needed, why was it not made immediately effective?

Topic:   FAMILY ALLOWANCES
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR PAYMENTS IN RESPECT OF CHILDREN UNDER SIXTEEN
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LIB

Norman Alexander McLarty (Secretary of State of Canada)

Liberal

Mr. McLARTY:

The hon. member knows that, as in the case of unemployment insurance, the setting up of the administration machinery must be given very careful and studied consideration.

Topic:   FAMILY ALLOWANCES
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR PAYMENTS IN RESPECT OF CHILDREN UNDER SIXTEEN
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NAT

Herbert Alexander Bruce

National Government

Mr. BRUCE:

I would ask, Mr. Speaker,

whether it would be improper to suggest that it may have some connection with an election in an adjoining province, when it is hoped that this bill will assist the return of a Liberal government. That province because of its large families will derive the greatest benefit from this measure, at the expense of the other provinces, particularly Ontario, which pays one-half of the taxes of Canada.

I would not like the house to think for a moment that I am against providing for the care of children in families where the wage-earner himself is unable to provide adequately for them. I am entirely in favour of giving help to those low income group families through social services to ensure that the

Family Allowances

children will benefit by better nutrition, better educational facilities, better playground facilities, medical care, and better housing-

Topic:   FAMILY ALLOWANCES
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR PAYMENTS IN RESPECT OF CHILDREN UNDER SIXTEEN
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LIB

Paul Joseph James Martin (Parliamentary Assistant to the Minister of Labour)

Liberal

Mr. MARTIN:

Will the hon. gentleman

permit a question?

Topic:   FAMILY ALLOWANCES
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR PAYMENTS IN RESPECT OF CHILDREN UNDER SIXTEEN
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NAT

Herbert Alexander Bruce

National Government

Mr. BRUCE:

-which are of the greatest importance in preventing juvenile delinquency as well as in promoting health.

Topic:   FAMILY ALLOWANCES
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR PAYMENTS IN RESPECT OF CHILDREN UNDER SIXTEEN
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LIB

Paul Joseph James Martin (Parliamentary Assistant to the Minister of Labour)

Liberal

Mr. MARTIN:

I take it that he will not.

Topic:   FAMILY ALLOWANCES
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR PAYMENTS IN RESPECT OF CHILDREN UNDER SIXTEEN
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NAT

Herbert Alexander Bruce

National Government

Mr. BRUCE:

But can any one guarantee

that the five to eight dollars allowed for each child will provide anything like the advantages in health and well-being which the services to which I have just referred will do?

Topic:   FAMILY ALLOWANCES
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR PAYMENTS IN RESPECT OF CHILDREN UNDER SIXTEEN
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LIB

Paul Joseph James Martin (Parliamentary Assistant to the Minister of Labour)

Liberal

Mr. MARTIN:

How long would it take to get these services?

Topic:   FAMILY ALLOWANCES
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR PAYMENTS IN RESPECT OF CHILDREN UNDER SIXTEEN
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NAT

Karl Kenneth Homuth

National Government

Mr. HOMUTH:

You have had years to try and do it. Why did you not do it?

Topic:   FAMILY ALLOWANCES
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR PAYMENTS IN RESPECT OF CHILDREN UNDER SIXTEEN
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LIB

Thomas Vien (Speaker of the Senate)

Liberal

Mr. SPEAKER:

Order.

Topic:   FAMILY ALLOWANCES
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR PAYMENTS IN RESPECT OF CHILDREN UNDER SIXTEEN
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NAT

Herbert Alexander Bruce

National Government

Mr. BRUCE:

I think it is time that some of these services were augmented. I believe some are in existence and would be helped very much by a subsidy.

We all agree that additional assistance is needed for the wage-earner in the low wage group with a large family. Cash grants would seem to be the easiest and perhaps the simplest way-

Topic:   FAMILY ALLOWANCES
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR PAYMENTS IN RESPECT OF CHILDREN UNDER SIXTEEN
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July 25, 1944