July 2, 1943

LIB

James Garfield Gardiner (Minister of Agriculture)

Liberal

Mr. GARDINER:

Sufficient to provide

each farmer along that area with hay land from which he could be a producer of hay. Probably in some places there is much more than would be necessary for the individual farmer who may be there, and it might necessitate the re-dividing of some of the land.

The other surveys which have been made on the streams running into the Qu'Appelle have been for the purpose of determining

Supp ly-A griculture

whether a storage basin can be found up at the head or along these streams in order that water so stored may be utilized to irrigate lands on lower levels or replenish the waters of the various lakes. Generally speaking, that is the plan and, as has been pointed out, $50,000 has been spent on the laying out of the work which has to do with determining what can be done with the land in that particular area. There have been other sums, such as $20,000 and $40,000, on different dams put in along those areas in order to control the water in the lakes.

In a season like this the water does rise to heights which will cause damage, unless the land around the edge is protected by riprapping against wash-outs; and there has been some rip-rapping done on these areas. That, generally speaking, is the nature of the work carried on. I think it is looked upon as something which will assist greatly the people in those areas, if we again have the drouths we had in the past.

Topic:   MUNITIONS AND SUPPLY
Subtopic:   ALLEGED DISCRIMINATION IN PLACEMENT OP CARS
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NAT

Ernest Edward Perley

National Government

Mr. PERLEY:

What about the settlement of Indians? I understand that on hay land from which the Indians cut 300 tons of hay last year they cannot cut any this year.

Topic:   MUNITIONS AND SUPPLY
Subtopic:   ALLEGED DISCRIMINATION IN PLACEMENT OP CARS
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LIB

James Garfield Gardiner (Minister of Agriculture)

Liberal

Mr. GARDINER:

There were some areas up there last year which, even if we had not done anything, would have been flooded to a greater extent than they had been in many years. The last time I drove through Fort Qu'Appelle the dam was not holding back the water. In the first place there was not anything in the dam to hold back the water. The water was running within three feet from the top of the works. All of this meant that no water backed up behind that. The dam had nothing to do with it. The -water was there because this was an exceptionally wet season this year. When the works are completed the land on the reserve to the west may be flooded. I do not know whether that is the reserve the hon. member is speaking about.

Topic:   MUNITIONS AND SUPPLY
Subtopic:   ALLEGED DISCRIMINATION IN PLACEMENT OP CARS
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NAT

Ernest Edward Perley

National Government

Mr. PERLEY:

No; it is at Round lake.

Topic:   MUNITIONS AND SUPPLY
Subtopic:   ALLEGED DISCRIMINATION IN PLACEMENT OP CARS
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LIB

James Garfield Gardiner (Minister of Agriculture)

Liberal

Mr. GARDINER:

The work at Round lake may have something to do with the flooding there. But there will be land in the reserve to the west of Echo lake which will have to be taken over by rehabilitation from the Indian affairs branch if the works are completed as advised by the engineers. If any lands are flooded and remain flooded as a result of the work which has been put in, arrangement is made either to get an easement in connection with those lands, or to take them over and make them part of the plan.

Topic:   MUNITIONS AND SUPPLY
Subtopic:   ALLEGED DISCRIMINATION IN PLACEMENT OP CARS
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NAT

Ernest Edward Perley

National Government

Mr. PERLEY:

I understand the Indians on the reserve are dissatisfied with the arrangement which has Been made. I know the situation well, and I think they have had an unfair and unreasonable deal.

Topic:   MUNITIONS AND SUPPLY
Subtopic:   ALLEGED DISCRIMINATION IN PLACEMENT OP CARS
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LIB

James Garfield Gardiner (Minister of Agriculture)

Liberal

Mr. GARDINER:

I will look into it.

Topic:   MUNITIONS AND SUPPLY
Subtopic:   ALLEGED DISCRIMINATION IN PLACEMENT OP CARS
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LIB

Joseph-Arthur Bradette (Deputy Speaker and Chair of Committees of the Whole of the House of Commons)

Liberal

The CHAIRMAN:

Shall the item carry?

Topic:   MUNITIONS AND SUPPLY
Subtopic:   ALLEGED DISCRIMINATION IN PLACEMENT OP CARS
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NAT

Ernest Edward Perley

National Government

Mr. PERLEY:

Oh, no, we want more information. For instance, we have not yet discussed the matter of pastures. A large number of pastures have been established, and a great amount of stock is carried in them.

Before we leave this matter of water, may I refer to an article in a western paper, namely, the Regina Leader Post, headed ."Water for tw'enty thousand acres; project will stabilize agriculture". This has reference to the Swift Current project. Would the minister give us a little information respecting the Swift Current project, because the matter is headlined in the Leader Post to-day. It states that

20,000 acres of land will be irrigated when the project is completed.

Topic:   MUNITIONS AND SUPPLY
Subtopic:   ALLEGED DISCRIMINATION IN PLACEMENT OP CARS
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LIB

James Garfield Gardiner (Minister of Agriculture)

Liberal

Mr. GARDINER:

The Swift Current area extends on the river from south of Swift Current to Swift Current, and then east as far as Rush lake, which is a considerable distance east of Swift Current. In that area there are between 30,000 and 40,000 acres of farm land which can be irrigated, and there will be sufficient water. One of the dams is completed, and holding water now; and the other is partly completed. There will be sufficient water to irrigate that particular land. The section most affected by drouth was in the neighbourhood of Swift Current, and we have carried on irrigation work at that experimental farm for some time. That land can all be irrigated from the two dams.

The main difficulty we have had up to date is that we did not dig a ditch last year to drain Rush lake and keep it drained. There was some water In it this year as a result of the great fall of water we have had. Last year the whole lake bottom was in crop and we grew a considerable part of the flax, that is, the government grew it, under the Prairie Farm Rehabilitation Act, to supply seed for this year. We grew oats and barley as well and had very good crops. I do not think there is any exaggeration in what the Leader-Post says. I read the article. There is a possibility of irrigating 30,000 or 40,000 acres of land. We are not taking over the land; we are merely putting in the ditches and dams and making the water available to irrigate so many acres to each farmer. Each farmer will pay for the water he uses to irrigate his hay land. In the years that lie behind us we have brought hay

Supply-Agriculture

from as far east as Three Rivers, Quebec. This happened in 1937, and we now hope to be able to produce the needed hay on this land.

Topic:   MUNITIONS AND SUPPLY
Subtopic:   ALLEGED DISCRIMINATION IN PLACEMENT OP CARS
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NAT

Ernest Edward Perley

National Government

Mr. PERLEY:

Were any of the dams

washed out this year on account of the extra flow of water?

Topic:   MUNITIONS AND SUPPLY
Subtopic:   ALLEGED DISCRIMINATION IN PLACEMENT OP CARS
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LIB

James Garfield Gardiner (Minister of Agriculture)

Liberal

Mr. GARDINER:

There was one at Willows on Lake of the Rivers in Saskatchewan. We have had trouble with this one on two different occasions. I have been down to look at it personally. We may have to abandon it, but we have attempted to store water there. With the amount of water there was in the streams this year w-e have been surprised that we have not lost more dams.

We have fifty-seven pastures operating and ten under construction. I may say that so far as these pastures go, the treasury is not concerned after they are once constructed. The capital cost is put up by the treasury and that will stand for some twenty years at least. The posts that are used are creosoted and should be good for that length of time. Fees are paid by the farmers who put cattle or horses into the pasture, and these are more than sufficient to pay the cost of operation since , there is a surplus of $38,215.01. In this connection, we have three ideas in mind. First, there is the community pasture where the farmers around the pasture are organized. They have their own association which controls the number of cattle that may be put on the pasture by each farmer and also it takes care of the fees. We appoint a manager who becomes a secretary of the association. As I have just pointed out, the fees are more than sufficient to pay the operating costs including the salaries of the managers.

In addition to that, we have the reserve pastures that I spoke of before the dinner hour. These are large areas, some hundred thousand acres in extent. We have fenced them to keep out stock in the good years and they will be available in drouth years. They grew grass as abundantly as before live stock ran over the country at all. Conditions in that section of the province are such that, with water provided, much of the live stock can run out through the winter. Then there is another form of pasture which is associated with an irrigated area. This is a community pasture in which lands are irrigated outside the pasture and produce the fodder and grain for the live stock which runs on the pasture in the summer time. AH these have been operating successfully, and I do not think the neighbourhood would like to be without them in the future.

Topic:   MUNITIONS AND SUPPLY
Subtopic:   ALLEGED DISCRIMINATION IN PLACEMENT OP CARS
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CCF

George Hugh Castleden

Co-operative Commonwealth Federation (C.C.F.)

Mr. CASTLEDEN:

Could the minister

give us a break-down of this $2,000,000?

Topic:   MUNITIONS AND SUPPLY
Subtopic:   ALLEGED DISCRIMINATION IN PLACEMENT OP CARS
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LIB

James Garfield Gardiner (Minister of Agriculture)

Liberal

Mr. GARDINER:

The break-down is as

follows:

Salaries, including permanent and

temporary $341,802

Wages 336,000

Cost-of-living bonus 86,000

Equipment 110,500

Freight and express 14,000

Miscellaneous 8,700

Printing and stationery 19,486

Supplies and materials 127,256

Telephones, telegrams and postage 11,568

Travel 171,220

Rent 45,350

Buildings and lands 388,025

Financial assistance 339,500

The last item is the assistance given to farmers to dig dug-outs and build small dams.

Topic:   MUNITIONS AND SUPPLY
Subtopic:   ALLEGED DISCRIMINATION IN PLACEMENT OP CARS
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Item agreed to. Special. 30. Prairie Farm Assistance Act-administration, $250,000.


CCF

George Hugh Castleden

Co-operative Commonwealth Federation (C.C.F.)

Mr. CASTLEDEN:

How much was paid

out last year, and how much was collected under the one per cent arrangement?

Topic:   MUNITIONS AND SUPPLY
Subtopic:   ALLEGED DISCRIMINATION IN PLACEMENT OP CARS
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LIB

James Garfield Gardiner (Minister of Agriculture)

Liberal

Mr. GARDINER:

No money was paid out last year. I have not the figures for this year by itself, but the total levy collected in 1941-42 was $2,500,000. The total amount down to June 30, 1942, was $6,392,000. That is what was collected, and there has been approximately $2,000,000 since then. The total amount paid up to date is about $30,000,000,, and the total amount collected prior to this year was a little over $6,000,000. We have paid out $5 for $1 collected. For the year 1942 there will be none paid out, and we hope to come somewhere in the neighbourhood of $9,000,000, by the time the year's collections are in.

Topic:   MUNITIONS AND SUPPLY
Subtopic:   ALLEGED DISCRIMINATION IN PLACEMENT OP CARS
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CCF

George Hugh Castleden

Co-operative Commonwealth Federation (C.C.F.)

Mr. CASTLEDEN:

Is it expected that

there will be anything to pay out this year?

Topic:   MUNITIONS AND SUPPLY
Subtopic:   ALLEGED DISCRIMINATION IN PLACEMENT OP CARS
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LIB

James Garfield Gardiner (Minister of Agriculture)

Liberal

Mr. GARDINER:

There was nothing paid out last year, and the crop this year looks as though we shall have a repetition of what

happened last year.

Topic:   MUNITIONS AND SUPPLY
Subtopic:   ALLEGED DISCRIMINATION IN PLACEMENT OP CARS
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CCF

George Hugh Castleden

Co-operative Commonwealth Federation (C.C.F.)

Mr. CASTLEDEN:

There is an area in

Alberta where they are not going to get a crop. Does this amount of $500,000 show as not having been paid?

Topic:   MUNITIONS AND SUPPLY
Subtopic:   ALLEGED DISCRIMINATION IN PLACEMENT OP CARS
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July 2, 1943