July 20, 1942

WAR EXPENDITURES COMMITTEE


Fifth and sixth reports of special committee on war expenditures.-Mr. Fournier (Hull).


SECRET SESSION OF THE HOUSE

LIB

William Lyon Mackenzie King (Prime Minister; Secretary of State for External Affairs; President of the Privy Council)

Liberal

Right Hon. W. L. MACKENZIE KING (Prime Minister) moved:

That the secret session of the house to be held this day be not reported in the official report of the House of Commons Debates and that at the conclusion of the secret session a report of its proceedings be issued under the authority of Mr. Speaker.

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Motion agreed to. The house went into secret session.



The house in committee of supply, Mr. Yien in the chair. Progress reported. At the conclusion of the secret session, the following report of its proceedings was issued under the authority of Mr. Speaker: "A secret session of the House of Commons was held at 11 o'clock a.m. on Saturday the 18th of July, 1942. The sitting was devoted to the question of coastal defence in Canada. The situation was explained by the three Ministers of National Defence. J. Allison Glen, Speaker." On motion of Mr. Mackenzie King the house adjourned at 6.19 p.m. Monday, July 20, 1942


REPORTS OF COMMITTEES


Seventh report of special committee on war expenditures.-Mr. Fournier (Hull). Third report of special committee on reconstruction and reestablishment.-Mr. Turgeon.


QUESTIONS


(Questions answered orally are indicated by an asterisk.)


* IN'CO ME TAX-ARREARS FOR 1940 AND 1941

NAT

Mr. HAZEN:

National Government

1. How many persons have failed to pay any part of their 1940 income taxi

Questions

2. How many persons have paid only a portion of their 1940 income tax?

3. How much of the 1940 income tax remains uncollected ?

4. How many persons have failed to pay any part of their 1941 income tax?

5. How many persons have paid only a portion of their 1941 income tax?

6. How much of the 1941 income tax remains uncollected ?

7. How many persons applied to the banks for loans to pay their 1940 income tax?

8. How many persons applied to the hanks for loans to pay their 1941 income tax?

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Subtopic:   * IN'CO ME TAX-ARREARS FOR 1940 AND 1941
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LIB

Colin William George Gibson (Minister of National Revenue)

Liberal

Mr. GIBSON:

I have given a good deal of consideration to this question. I would say that it is almost impossible to give an answer to the first part of it, because of the impossibility of saying with any degree of accuracy that every person has filed a return. Our officers are investigating at all times, and the numbers vary from day to day.

With respect to the second part of the question, we have found that returns are not always accurate, and they are being amended. Therefore it is impossible to say accurately the number of persons who have made full payment.

With respect to the third part of the question, I would point out that this information cannot be given with any degree of definiteness until final clearance is given in respect of each taxpayer. The same answer would apply to parts 4, 5 and 6. The hon. member will realize that the number of accounts for 1940 amounted to 663,000, and for 1941 to 920,000, and to answer these questions for any given date would entail going through the records of all those returns. In my view the labour involved would be completely wasted because the information obtained would be good for perhaps only one day, and would not be entirely complete even for that day.

We have no information with respect to parts 7 and 8 of the question, in which the hon. member has asked how many persons applied to the banks for loans to pay their income tax.

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Subtopic:   * IN'CO ME TAX-ARREARS FOR 1940 AND 1941
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NAT

Richard Burpee Hanson (Leader of the Official Opposition)

National Government

Mr. HANSON (York-Sunbury):

I realize that there is a good deal of force in what the minister has said. I would not suppose that questions 7 and 8 could be answered, but what I think the hon. member who has asked these questions wants is the relative proportions of the 1940 and the 1941 income taxes that are in arrears, so as to be able to form some estimate of what the situation may be in respect to the tremendously increased personal income taxes for 1942. If there is no appreciable amount in arrears, or if there is no appreciable number of taxpayers who have failed to pay

and we had that information, it would give us some indication of the attitude of the country.

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Subtopic:   * IN'CO ME TAX-ARREARS FOR 1940 AND 1941
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LIB

Colin William George Gibson (Minister of National Revenue)

Liberal

Mr. GIBSON:

An indication could be given as to what is in arrears, that is, in proportion to the returns already made, but these have not all been finally checked, and any figure given could not possibly be accurate.

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Subtopic:   * IN'CO ME TAX-ARREARS FOR 1940 AND 1941
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NAT

Douglas King Hazen

National Government

Mr. HAZEN:

I thought the Minister of Finance should have information of this kind before him when he came to make up his last budget. He should have known how many people were behind with their 1940 taxes and how many had not paid. He should have known how many were behind with their 1941 taxes and how many had not paid. He must have had some idea about how many people had had to go to the banks in both years to borrow money to pay their income tax.

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Subtopic:   * IN'CO ME TAX-ARREARS FOR 1940 AND 1941
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LIB

James Lorimer Ilsley (Minister of Finance and Receiver General)

Liberal

Mr. ILSLEY:

I could not get that.

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Subtopic:   * IN'CO ME TAX-ARREARS FOR 1940 AND 1941
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NAT

Douglas King Hazen

National Government

Mr. HAZEN:

I think that information should have been available to the minister when he came to frame his budget for the present year. It may be impossible to answer the question in the form in which it is put, but, if I may be permitted to say so, I have sometimes thought that the 1942 budget has gone altogether too far. We have to maintain in this country at this particular time some buoyancy among the people on the home front. We have to keep the home fires burning brightly, and if you adopt a policy, and it is possible that this 1942 budget will have that effecU-

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Subtopic:   * IN'CO ME TAX-ARREARS FOR 1940 AND 1941
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LIB

Georges Parent (Speaker of the Senate)

Liberal

Mr. SPEAKER:

I am afraid the hon. member cannot enlarge upon the matter. Question No. 6 must be considered as having been answered.

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Subtopic:   * IN'CO ME TAX-ARREARS FOR 1940 AND 1941
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PENSIONS-NORTHWEST FIELD FORCE OF 1885

July 20, 1942