July 3, 1942

NAT

Howard Charles Green

National Government

Mr. GREEN:

Has the government given any consideration to the setting up of a Canadian maritime commission, or some other organization which could handle marine insurance in Canada?

Topic:   WAR RISK INSURANCE
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR COMPENSATION FOR WAR DAMAGE TO PROPERTY
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LIB

James Lorimer Ilsley (Minister of Finance and Receiver General)

Liberal

Mr. ILSLEY:

No.

Topic:   WAR RISK INSURANCE
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR COMPENSATION FOR WAR DAMAGE TO PROPERTY
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NAT

Howard Charles Green

National Government

Mr. GREEN:

Has any consideration been given to the' suggestion made by Mr. D'Arcy Leonard, which is contained in paragraph 19 of his report, as follows:

I do think, however, that we should canvass the possibility of making an arrangement with either the maritime shipping commission of the United States or the British war risks insurance office to make sure that cover is available at reasonable rates to Canadian hulls and on cargoes in which Canadians are interested.

Has any attempt been made to come to some arrangement with either the United States maritime commission or the British war risks insurance office?

Topic:   WAR RISK INSURANCE
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR COMPENSATION FOR WAR DAMAGE TO PROPERTY
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LIB

James Lorimer Ilsley (Minister of Finance and Receiver General)

Liberal

Mr. ILSLEY:

There has been no demand. As I say, we might stimulate a demand, or the members of this house might create a demand for it, but up to the present there has been no demand. Let hon. members just think of the situation. We are not going into this business for the fun of it; we are going into it to meet an urgent, pressing, almost desperate demand that arose after Pearl Harbour, for a class of insurance which was disappearing, because it was being cancelled right and left. That is war risk insurance on property on land. That did not apply to property at sea; and we get the benefit of the government schemes in Great Britain and the United States, because the competition of those schemes brings down the commercial rates in those countries, and it is insurance granted by companies in Great Britain and the United States, to a large extent and almost entirely, that is taken out by insurers in this country. Just as the hon. member for Halifax says, they can get insurance. I do not want to set up a bargain rate on marine insurance, nor do I want to go into a scheme of marine insurance if I can help it. It is going to be difficult enough, goodness knows, to operate the scheme we have here, which we have to operate because of the terrific demand for it, but I do not want to go into that other scheme.

War Risk Insurance

Topic:   WAR RISK INSURANCE
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR COMPENSATION FOR WAR DAMAGE TO PROPERTY
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IND

Alan Webster Neill

Independent

Mr. NEILL:

Would the minister allow that order in council to be placed upon Hansard?

Topic:   WAR RISK INSURANCE
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR COMPENSATION FOR WAR DAMAGE TO PROPERTY
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LIB

James Lorimer Ilsley (Minister of Finance and Receiver General)

Liberal

Mr. ILSLEY:

Very well.

Topic:   WAR RISK INSURANCE
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR COMPENSATION FOR WAR DAMAGE TO PROPERTY
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CCF

Angus MacInnis

Co-operative Commonwealth Federation (C.C.F.)

Mr. MacINNIS:

About twenty minutes

ago the hon. member for Comox-AIberni suggested that the Minister of Fisheries should be allowed to read the order in council so that we might be able to examine it over the week-end. Then we would know what it is all about and would be prepared to act accordingly when next the bill is under discussion. I believe the house will be adjourning in a few moments, and I suggest we might have the order in council read. I do not believe hon. members from the west wish to be at all unreasonable; certainly I do not. I have no doubt we shall be prepared to cooperate with the minister, because we appreciate that where there has been no past experience in such matters the minister has a difficult task. If the order in council were read, we would know at our next meeting what we have to deal with.

Topic:   WAR RISK INSURANCE
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR COMPENSATION FOR WAR DAMAGE TO PROPERTY
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LIB

Joseph Enoil Michaud (Minister of Public Works; Minister of Fisheries)

Liberal

Mr. MICHAUD:

The order in council

will be in to-day's Votes and Proceedings, and hon. members will have ample time to familiarize themselves with its provisions. However, I would call their attention again to the fact that the purport of the order in council is to bring compassionate relief to people who might lose property because of war activities, and who could not afford to insure or would have no means of insuring such property. That is the underlying principle of the order in council. It is compassionate relief to fishermen who own fishing boats or fishing gear but who cannot afford to insure, or whose property is not insurable.

Topic:   WAR RISK INSURANCE
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR COMPENSATION FOR WAR DAMAGE TO PROPERTY
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IND

Alan Webster Neill

Independent

Mr. NEILL:

Is the word "compassionate" in the order in council?

Topic:   WAR RISK INSURANCE
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR COMPENSATION FOR WAR DAMAGE TO PROPERTY
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LIB

Joseph Enoil Michaud (Minister of Public Works; Minister of Fisheries)

Liberal

Mr. MICHAUD:

"Compassionate relief."

Topic:   WAR RISK INSURANCE
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR COMPENSATION FOR WAR DAMAGE TO PROPERTY
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LIB

Daniel (Dan) McIvor

Liberal

Mr. McIVOR:

I should like to support

the plea on behalf of shipowners on the great lakes. Their risk is coming into prominence because the great lakes are now included in the term "high seas." Anyone who has sailed lake Superior will know that the risk is just as great there as it is on either the east or west coast. I am sure the minister will take that point into consideration.

Topic:   WAR RISK INSURANCE
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR COMPENSATION FOR WAR DAMAGE TO PROPERTY
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LIB

Vincent-Joseph Pottier

Liberal

Mr. POTTIER:

The hon. member for

Fraser Valley quoted my observations at page 2855 of Hansard, as follows:

I think we should leave it as it is now.

True, the hon. member quoted at some length following that, but he did not explain the point to which I was referring. I was pleading on behalf of the fishermen so that

they would have insurance. I was objecting to an amendment the hon. member for Comox-AIberni had suggested, in which the word "ships" would have been stricken out altogether. My contention was that the word should be left in, because if it were we might have a chance to have fishing boats insured. That was the time I said, "I think we should leave it as it is now." Certainly I did not say that we should not get insurance for the fishermen, or that I was satisfied with the bill, as it was, without insurance for fishing boats. I thought the retention of the word "ships" gave us a chance of securing that kind of insurance, and that was when I made the statement. I should like to correct the impression which might have been left from the interpretation of my remarks given by the hon. member for Fraser Valley.

Topic:   WAR RISK INSURANCE
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR COMPENSATION FOR WAR DAMAGE TO PROPERTY
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NAT

Douglas King Hazen

National Government

Mr. HAZEN:

We have not made a great deal of progress, and I would suggest to the minister that the bill be brought before the committee again at as early a date as possible. I have received letters from business men in my constituency who say that their policies with Lloyds are now expiring, and that it will be impossible to get more insurance until the bill becomes law. For that reason I believe it is essential to many people that further discussion be held at as early a date as possible.

Topic:   WAR RISK INSURANCE
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR COMPENSATION FOR WAR DAMAGE TO PROPERTY
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LIB

James Lorimer Ilsley (Minister of Finance and Receiver General)

Liberal

Mr. ILSLEY:

I am just as anxious as the hon. member to get the bill through, and it will be brought up again as soon as possible.

Topic:   WAR RISK INSURANCE
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR COMPENSATION FOR WAR DAMAGE TO PROPERTY
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LIB

Paul Joseph James Martin

Liberal

Mr. MARTIN:

There is one point which should not be overlooked, and which possibly might come more correctly from hon. members on either coast. However, it should be said that there seems to be a disposition to hold up passage of part of the bill, and that that part should be held over for further refinement. But why should we delay passage of that portion of the bill to which there could be no objection. If those uncontentious parts could be accepted, we would avoid a continuation of risks which are now most serious, in the light of the world situation.

Topic:   WAR RISK INSURANCE
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR COMPENSATION FOR WAR DAMAGE TO PROPERTY
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LIB

James Joseph McCann

Liberal

The ACTING CHAIRMAN (Mr. McCann):

Shall the section carry?

Topic:   WAR RISK INSURANCE
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR COMPENSATION FOR WAR DAMAGE TO PROPERTY
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IND

Alan Webster Neill

Independent

Mr. NEILL:

No.

Topic:   WAR RISK INSURANCE
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR COMPENSATION FOR WAR DAMAGE TO PROPERTY
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NAT

Howard Charles Green

National Government

Mr. GREEN:

Could not section 2 stand?

Topic:   WAR RISK INSURANCE
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR COMPENSATION FOR WAR DAMAGE TO PROPERTY
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LIB

James Lorimer Ilsley (Minister of Finance and Receiver General)

Liberal

Mr. ILSLEY:

Yes, it certainly will.

Section stands.

The ACTING CHAIRMAN (Mr. McCann); Section 3, insurance against war damage.

Questions

Topic:   WAR RISK INSURANCE
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR COMPENSATION FOR WAR DAMAGE TO PROPERTY
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IND

Alan Webster Neill

Independent

Mr. NEILL:

Well, there is no use debating that at this time of day. It is almost six o'clock. Surely it is not proposed to enter into an extended debate at this time, because that is the main part of the bill. Surely it is not intended to pass the rest of the bill in three minutes.

Progress reported.

On motion of Mr. Crerar the house adjourned at six p.m.

Monday, July 6, 1942

Topic:   WAR RISK INSURANCE
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR COMPENSATION FOR WAR DAMAGE TO PROPERTY
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July 3, 1942