Mr. J. S. ROY (Gaspe):

On a question of privilege, in his answer to an interpolation of the hon. member for Temiscouata (Mr. Pouliot) yesterday in respect of my request for a secret sitting, the Prime Minister (Mr. Mackenzie King) said this-I quote from Hansard at page 2500:

The reply made to the hon. member for Gaspe last week was that he should give the information which he had to the minister of the department concerned, and if the minister thought the information to be of a kind which rendered a secret sitting advisable it would be so arranged by the government. I am advised that the information conveyed to the minister, in his opinion and the opinion of the cabinet -I can speak for the cabinet because I was present at the discussion-does not warrant the calling of a secret sitting.

As to my hon. friend's suggestion that we should have secret sessions at stated times, I think the public would be inclined to take the view that so far as sittings can be open they should be open, and that the government should resort to secret sittings only where there appears to be the strongest of reasons.

What I said in my statement of last Friday was this-I quote from Hansard at page 2470:

In view of the close proximity of the coast where enemy submarines are now operating, and by reason of particulars I possess and desire to share with the house, but which it would not be wise to disclose publicly, I would ask the government as the representative of the constituency in the vicinity of which these enemy-submarine activities are taking place that an immediate secret session of the house be held to consider these most important war developments which are taking place as far as 300 miles within our Atlantic border. These events are of such gravity that it seems to me that the people's representatives should be made aware of all details concerning the attacks and be given an opportunity to take part in deliberations on the means to protect our threatened country.

My request of Friday last for a secret sitting of the house was not based upon the necessity of having such a means of conveying my information to the Department of National Defence, but rather to the house, as I very clearly stated, to permit members of parliament to discharge their duties towards our endangered country. I am prepared to present to hon. members of this house the information which I possess and which I deeply feel should be shared by all members in order that they may truly understand at least some of the perils to which our country is exposed at the present time. In my opinion it would be wiser to discuss that very important matter in secret, and there are more than sufficiently strong reasons, as stated by the Prime Minister, when our country is being attacked as it is, for members to be given an opportunity to look after the greatest interest of all in the protection of the whole country-

Order.

Mr. ROY:

Just a few more words and I shall have finished.

Mr. SPEAKER:

I have allowed the hon. member to proceed with his statement but he has really gone farther than he could reasonably go on a question of privilege. However, he may continue and conclude what he has to say.

Mr. ROY:

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, I hope that the Prime Minister will see that due consideration is given to the request for granting a secret session as soon as possible.

Hon. C. D. HOWE (Minister of Munitions and Supply):

In reply to a question asked yesterday by the hon. member for Royal (Mr. Brooks) and other questions asked privately by the hon. senior member for Halifax (Mr. Isnor) I should like to make a brief statement as to the position of our gasoline and oil supplies in the maritime provinces.

Under normal conditions, refineries in the maritimes receive their crude oil by tanker ship from south America. Over a period of months I have had occasion to discuss the increasing gravity of the transportation problem with respect to crude oil. I sometimes fear that my warnings have gone unheeded, for now that we are faced with an acute situation in the maritimes, there is some surprise and considerable indignation that this should be so. The sinking of tanker ships by enemy submarines has greatly reduced the amount of crude that can be delivered to maritime refineries. At the same time there has been a great increase in the requirements of the armed services, particularly the navy, which is using large amounts of fuel oil. To meet this situation, >ve have had to change refinery runs from automobile gasoline to heavy fuel oils. Since the first of February last we have been able to refine very little automobile gasoline in the maritime provinces. In recent weeks the loss of tankers became so severe that shipping on the Atlantic coast was tied up for a period of ten days. This further aggravated the supply position. For some weeks now, we have been supplementing the supply of fuel oil that is available from maritime refineries by shipments in tank cars and tanker ships from Sarnia, Toronto and Montreal. At the present time we have all the tank cars that can be mobilized engaged in this service.

When the rationing system was established we deliberately fixed on a unit that would permit variation in the amount of gasoline

(Mr. St. Laurent.]

that could be purchased. We did this because we expected that the amount of gasoline available for civilian use would vary from time to time. The reduction of the content of the unit from five gallons to two gallons in the maritimes was not an arbitrary move but is based on the amount of gasoline that is available in those provinces for sale to the ordinary user. If we had left the unit at five gallons, we should have had a situation where those who reached the gasoline station first would have obtained their supplies and the balance of the population would have gone without gasoline. The suggestion has been made by the premiers of Nova Scotia and New Brunswick that the amount of the unit should be reduced in the whole of Canada. I do not see what useful purpose would be served by this as there would be no way of transporting to the maritimes the surplus gasoline which would be available in other parts of the country. All the tank car and tanker ship capacity that can be mobilized is now carrying fuel oil to the maritimes for the navy and the merchant marine. Undoubtedly the reduction in the unit will work much inconvenience and hardship. I do not see what alternative there is to this if we are to meet the needs of the armed services. I am sure that when the facts of the situation are known, the people of the maritime provinces will accept this privation with their customary good spirit and patriotism.

With regard to curtailment in other parts of Canada I may say that the situation in Canada is exactly parallel with the situation in United States. There the area along the northern portion of the eastern states is very severely rationed, whereas all areas of the United States outside of that zone have no rationing in force at this time.

Mr. A. J. BROOKS (Royal):

There is a feeling that gasoline is being shipped from the martime provinces to the province of Quebec, and that if we are to have curtailment in the maritimes there should also be curtailment in Quebec, or the gasoline should be left in the maritime provinces.

Mr. HOWE:

No gasoline has been shipped from the martime provinces to Quebec to my knowledge. But I may say that in the past five weeks large quantities of gasoline have been shipped from the province of Quebec to the maritime provinces. So that I think my hon. friend should not cast aspersions.

Mr. BROOKS:

I want to correct that; I am not casting aspersions. It is not my opinion; I have heard that report. It is the opinion of some people in the maritime provinces.

Vichy Representation