March 16, 1942

LIB

Joseph-Arthur Bradette

Liberal

Mr. BRADETTE:

I will answer that in this way: are there not a lot of farmers in the west who will be growing wheat next summer who could be better employed in manufacturing munitions?

Topic:   CANADIAN WHEAT BOARD ACT
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR INCREASED RATE PER BUSHEL ON WHEAT DELIVERED BY PRODUCERS
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CCF

George Hugh Castleden

Co-operative Commonwealth Federation (C.C.F.)

Mr. CASTLEDEN:

They are doing it

already.

Topic:   CANADIAN WHEAT BOARD ACT
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR INCREASED RATE PER BUSHEL ON WHEAT DELIVERED BY PRODUCERS
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LIB

Joseph-Arthur Bradette

Liberal

Mr. BRADETTE:

We are realists in our own section of the country, and hon. members must be realists. The machinery used in gold mining cannot be put to making munitions, tanks or guns in a day or overnight. Hon. members may be surprised to learn that mines like the McIntyre and the Hollinger are doing some war work now, producing articles of war. I have been told by managers of these mines that if it were found necessary to close them for a period of months or years, many

of them would never come back again into production. It would be absolutely impossible to exploit them again.

Topic:   CANADIAN WHEAT BOARD ACT
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR INCREASED RATE PER BUSHEL ON WHEAT DELIVERED BY PRODUCERS
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CCF

Alexander Malcolm Nicholson

Co-operative Commonwealth Federation (C.C.F.)

Mr. NICHOLSON:

What useful purpose is being served by gold? How is it terrorizing Hitler?

Topic:   CANADIAN WHEAT BOARD ACT
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR INCREASED RATE PER BUSHEL ON WHEAT DELIVERED BY PRODUCERS
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LIB

Joseph-Arthur Bradette

Liberal

Mr. BRADETTE:

I said at the outset that I did not intend to enter into a discussion of the gold standard.

Topic:   CANADIAN WHEAT BOARD ACT
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR INCREASED RATE PER BUSHEL ON WHEAT DELIVERED BY PRODUCERS
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NAT

Karl Kenneth Homuth

National Government

Mr. HOMUTH:

Wheat is not terrorizing

Hitler very much, is it?

Topic:   CANADIAN WHEAT BOARD ACT
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR INCREASED RATE PER BUSHEL ON WHEAT DELIVERED BY PRODUCERS
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LIB

Joseph-Arthur Bradette

Liberal

Mr. BRADETTE:

Not at the moment. I

know that that question was put in all sincerity. The gold mining that is carried on in our section of the country is of benefit to the workers of Toronto and Montreal and the industrial population of the rest of Canada. We are very fortunate at the present time in that the United States still buys Canadian gold. This permits us to purchase materials used for the manufacture of munitions, guns hnd tanks to be sent to our armed forces and to our allies. It certainly greatly helps to stabilize our Canadian dollar. I want to make my argument quite clear and I do not want to be misquoted. The gold miners and farmers in my section of the country want all the good possible to be done for the western wheat growers, to do all they possibly can for a total war effort.

Topic:   CANADIAN WHEAT BOARD ACT
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR INCREASED RATE PER BUSHEL ON WHEAT DELIVERED BY PRODUCERS
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CCF

Alexander Malcolm Nicholson

Co-operative Commonwealth Federation (C.C.F.)

Mr. NICHOLSON:

Do the United States

want our gold?

Topic:   CANADIAN WHEAT BOARD ACT
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR INCREASED RATE PER BUSHEL ON WHEAT DELIVERED BY PRODUCERS
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LIB

Joseph-Arthur Bradette

Liberal

Mr. BRADETTE:

A few years ago a member of parliament attended the commencement exercises of the high school in Timmins, and he commented upon the fact that gold was taken out of the ground with hard1 work and sweat and then sent south and buried in another place. The chairman of that meeting, speaking later, told him that that argument could be carried a little further. He said, "I understand that in your section of Ontario you grow tobacco; that tobacco is made into cigarettes, smoking tobacco and cigars, and we up here turn it into ashes." That shows how far this sort of argument can go. When we talk of a total war effort we must visualize all these things. We must maintain our armed forces, and goodness knows we want to d*' that 200 per cent if possible. We must provide all necessary equipment, clothing and food to our armed forces and also our allies. We want a civilian population that is fruitfully employed. That is the only way you can maintain your armed forces. It could be argued that all breweries should1 be closed up. I do not believe that is necessary, but I will admit that if it were done we could still carry on the war just the same. It might be argued

Wheat Board Act

that we should stop the manufacture of alcoholic beverages, and we certainly could stop the manufacture of these soft drinks that are spoiling the stomachs of so many of our younger people. I could name fifty other industries that could be shut down. This simply shows what could happen if you carry an argument to an illogical conclusion, arguments that could not stand 'before the light of logic.

The agriculturists have problems, but so have the miners. The minute you take the livelihood away from these gold miners, 50,000 farmers in my section of the country will be without a market. The farmers of southern Ontario send their eggs, meat, vegetables and fruits up to our section. At times our farmers have fried to keep them out, but I have always argued that we are not only citizens of Ontario, we are citizens of Canada. That section provides a market for southern Ontario farmers and farmers in the province of Quebec.

I have a brother in that section who has two sons enlisted. He has fifty dairy cows, and he tells me that if the town of Timmins were closed up, there would be no reason for his farming.

Topic:   CANADIAN WHEAT BOARD ACT
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR INCREASED RATE PER BUSHEL ON WHEAT DELIVERED BY PRODUCERS
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CCF

Alexander Malcolm Nicholson

Co-operative Commonwealth Federation (C.C.F.)

Mr. NICHOLSON:

But what use is gold?

Topic:   CANADIAN WHEAT BOARD ACT
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR INCREASED RATE PER BUSHEL ON WHEAT DELIVERED BY PRODUCERS
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NAT

Karl Kenneth Homuth

National Government

Mr. HOMUTH:

Ask him what use it is not?

Topic:   CANADIAN WHEAT BOARD ACT
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR INCREASED RATE PER BUSHEL ON WHEAT DELIVERED BY PRODUCERS
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LIB

Joseph-Arthur Bradette

Liberal

Mr. BRADETTE:

Does the bon. member realize that France, Norway, Spain, Great Britain and Portugal have sent billions of dollars in gold bullion to the United States? Perhaps hon. mefnbers would be surprised to know that Hitler was highly displeased; he was quite choleric and abusive when he found that millions in gold had been taken away from France before the invasion. Do hon. members think for one moment that Hitler would not be quite happy if he could get at the gold centres of this country? This argument applies just as forcibly to Italy. However, this is not the time or place to discuss the gold standard or our monetaiy system.

My argument is that there is a ready market to-day for the gold we can produce, and this is a good thing for Canada. I have no fear that the United States will close this market because at the present time that country is spending millions in gold in south America; but if this market should be cut off, then there would be only one thing for *this country to do, build up a gold reserve of five or six billion dollars in order to keep this industry going. That is as far as I am going with this question. I know that western members, while sometimes quite rugged in their discussions, are generally speaking, fair to the rest of the country.

We have large centres of population in Timmins, Schumacher, South Porcupine, Elk

Lake, Kirkland Lake and other places in that section. All these are in the province of Ontario. There are also some fine gold developments in Manitoba and in British Columbia. There are conditions in the Pacific coast province which may make for serious worries. I mean the Japanese situation. Let no one think that the government has no difficulty in looking after the thirty thousand Japanese in British Columbia. Remember that when you come to stop the gold mining industry it will involve three 'hundred thousand people who will be thrown out of work and will constitute one of the greatest problems with Which this country has had to deal. I speak somewhat heatedly because I know something about this matter and of its full implications. I am sure that there is no hon. member who doubts my sincerity.

Topic:   CANADIAN WHEAT BOARD ACT
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR INCREASED RATE PER BUSHEL ON WHEAT DELIVERED BY PRODUCERS
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LIB

Georges Parent (Speaker of the Senate)

Liberal

Mr. SPEAKER:

I am sorry to have to inform the hon. member that his time has expired. .

Topic:   CANADIAN WHEAT BOARD ACT
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR INCREASED RATE PER BUSHEL ON WHEAT DELIVERED BY PRODUCERS
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?

Some hon. MEMBERS:

Go on.

Topic:   CANADIAN WHEAT BOARD ACT
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR INCREASED RATE PER BUSHEL ON WHEAT DELIVERED BY PRODUCERS
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LIB

Georges Parent (Speaker of the Senate)

Liberal

Mr. SPEAKER:

With the unanimous permission of the house.

Topic:   CANADIAN WHEAT BOARD ACT
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR INCREASED RATE PER BUSHEL ON WHEAT DELIVERED BY PRODUCERS
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LIB

Joseph-Arthur Bradette

Liberal

Mr. BRADETTE:

I thank the house very much for that favour. I have only a few words to add. I do not want to abuse the patience of hon. members because they have always been very kind to me.

In my view7 a discussion of this kind is all to the good so long as it does not become biased and so long as those who are asking for consideration are reasonable in their demands. It is always possible to discuss national problems in a national way, trying to get at the root of the difficulty and solve it in a fashion which will be fair and acceptable to all concerned. Agriculturists do appreciate the problems of other sections of the population, and they expect to receive in turn similar" attention and sympathy. We speak profusely and no doubt properly of new deals and of a new order of things, although I believe that in some instances these expressions are used merely as catchwords and tend to blur the vision of the real issues, so promoting a state of aloofness and inability to reach the crux of our problems. No class can grow and prosper at the expense of another class. If by our study and our effort in the legislative field we can restore confidence and comfort to the primary producer, the discussions on this bill will have been time well spent.

Topic:   CANADIAN WHEAT BOARD ACT
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR INCREASED RATE PER BUSHEL ON WHEAT DELIVERED BY PRODUCERS
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CCF

Clarence Gillis

Co-operative Commonwealth Federation (C.C.F.)

Mr. GILLIS :

Before the hon. member concludes his speech, I wish he would clear my mind on one point. He spoke to a considerable extent, in the discussion on this wheat

134S

Wheat Board Act

bill, on the question of gold mining. I should like to ask him, first, if it is not now the policy of the government to curtail as far as possible gold mining as a non-essential war industry; second, are there not now a thousand miners in Kirkland Lake who are unemployed and cannot get either work or relief as far as the government are concerned?

Topic:   CANADIAN WHEAT BOARD ACT
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR INCREASED RATE PER BUSHEL ON WHEAT DELIVERED BY PRODUCERS
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LIB

Joseph-Arthur Bradette

Liberal

Mr. BRADETTE:

Of course, Mr. Speaker, it is for the government rather than myself to answer that question. I may say that the mine management of my own section-the only district of which I can speak with personal knowledge-have to face at the present time priority demands as far as steel construction and machinery are concerned, and they willingly submit to these restrictions. In some mines it is quite a problem to get the necessary labour. As far as Kirkland Lake is concerned I am not familiar with the situation, but I express sincerely the hope that the fine workers in that section of the country will find fruitful employment as soon as possible.

Topic:   CANADIAN WHEAT BOARD ACT
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR INCREASED RATE PER BUSHEL ON WHEAT DELIVERED BY PRODUCERS
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SC

Frederick Davis Shaw

Social Credit

Mr. F. D. SHAW (Red Deer):

The hon. member for Cochrane (Mr. Bradette) has just completed a rather interesting speech, although I believe he wandered somewhat from the subject, for he covered a wide field. I do not suppose that I am expected to follow suit; in fact there is not enough time for me to deal with the matters which he has given us for consideration.

One hesitates to inject himself into a debate when it reaches its final stages. However, failure on the part of one who represents one of the finest mixed farming areas in western Canada to give expression to his views at this time might lead some persons to construe that silence as indicating wholehearted approval of the policy announced for 1942. Such a conclusion would certainly be far removed from the fact.

I believe we are all ready to recognize the difficulty with which any government is confronted that endeavours to solve a problem of such magnitude as this agricultural problem. When the Minister of Trade and Commerce (Mr. MacKinnon) and the Minister of Agriculture (Mr. Gardiner) were explaining the proposed policy to us, I could not refrain from watching each minister as he was speaking and trying to determine from his actions whether or not he felt elated over the policy which he was-I was going to say-compelled to give us. I do not profess to be a professional psychologist, nor am I a recognized crystal-gazer, but I felt that it was with some reluctance that the Minister of Trade and Commerce delivered his message. I may be

wrong, but my impression was that he, as a western member, thought something better should have been offered. As for the Minister of Agriculture, I felt that he was quite jubilant as a result of having that message to deliver. In dealing with the matter of parity he made a masterly job of juggling, to the extent, in my opinion, of showing that two things which do not equal the same thing equal each other. That was my impression when the Minister of Agriculture finished. As the minister was selling us that policy, I was rather relieved that he was a Minister of Agriculture and not some type of door-to-door salesman who might camp upon my doorstep to sell Witch ointment, let us say, or Devil lotion to reduce the hefty housewife or give curly hair to the baldheaded. I fear that in either instance he would have done anything to sell his lotion or his mixture.

Topic:   CANADIAN WHEAT BOARD ACT
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR INCREASED RATE PER BUSHEL ON WHEAT DELIVERED BY PRODUCERS
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?

An hon. MEMBER:

Would they work, though?

Topic:   CANADIAN WHEAT BOARD ACT
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR INCREASED RATE PER BUSHEL ON WHEAT DELIVERED BY PRODUCERS
Permalink

March 16, 1942