December 5, 1940

NAT

Richard Burpee Hanson (Leader of the Official Opposition)

National Government

Mr. HANSON (York-Sunbury):

It is nearly midnight and resolution 6 has a great many implications. I think we had better adjourn, and I suggest that to-morrow the minister make a statement-I have no doubt he has one ready-as to the implications of this resolution. I am beginning to realize all that it does imply, although I can only visualize a part of it now. We ought to be told frankly all that is intended by the administration with respect to resolution 6.

Topic:   WAYS AND MEANS
Subtopic:   WAR EXCHANGE CONSERVATION ACT, 1940
Permalink
?

Thomas Miller Bell

Mr. COLDWELL:

We have not yet passed resolution 5.

Topic:   WAYS AND MEANS
Subtopic:   WAR EXCHANGE CONSERVATION ACT, 1940
Permalink
LIB

Ernest Lapointe (Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada)

Liberal

Mr. LAPOINTE (Quebec East):

Yes, we have.

Topic:   WAYS AND MEANS
Subtopic:   WAR EXCHANGE CONSERVATION ACT, 1940
Permalink
?

Thomas Miller Bell

Mr. COLDWELL:

Resolutions 4 and 5 were called so quickly.

Topic:   WAYS AND MEANS
Subtopic:   WAR EXCHANGE CONSERVATION ACT, 1940
Permalink
LIB

James Lorimer Ilsley (Minister of Finance and Receiver General)

Liberal

Mr. ILSLEY:

Resolution 5 was called.

War Exchange Conservation Act

Topic:   WAYS AND MEANS
Subtopic:   WAR EXCHANGE CONSERVATION ACT, 1940
Permalink
?

Thomas Miller Bell

Mr. COLDWELL:

I understood the hon. member for New Westminster was discussing resolution 5.

Topic:   WAYS AND MEANS
Subtopic:   WAR EXCHANGE CONSERVATION ACT, 1940
Permalink
LIB

James Lorimer Ilsley (Minister of Finance and Receiver General)

Liberal

Mr. ILSLEY:

No, resolution 6.

Topic:   WAYS AND MEANS
Subtopic:   WAR EXCHANGE CONSERVATION ACT, 1940
Permalink
?

Thomas Miller Bell

Mr. COLDWELL:

I think resolution 5

should stand.

Topic:   WAYS AND MEANS
Subtopic:   WAR EXCHANGE CONSERVATION ACT, 1940
Permalink
LIB

James Lorimer Ilsley (Minister of Finance and Receiver General)

Liberal

Mr. ILSLEY:

Can it not be taken up on

the bill?

Topic:   WAYS AND MEANS
Subtopic:   WAR EXCHANGE CONSERVATION ACT, 1940
Permalink
NAT

Richard Burpee Hanson (Leader of the Official Opposition)

National Government

Mr. HANSON (York-Sunbury):

It can be

discussed on the bill.

Topic:   WAYS AND MEANS
Subtopic:   WAR EXCHANGE CONSERVATION ACT, 1940
Permalink
CON

Joseph Henry Harris

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. HARRIS (Danforth):

To add to what the leader of the opposition has said, I would say that resolution 6 involves a matter of tremendous importance. As I gathered from the minister's remarks, the sum involved is equal almost to the gold production of Canada; that is to say, dividends and interest payments due in the United States are of a magnitude almost equal to Canada's gold export to that country. The sum involved is some $200,000,000, a figure that astounds me. It is of tremendous moment to Canada, and when the minister makes his statement to-morrow I hope he will not shut the door on the idea that in the United States at the present time there is not only a vast volume of public opinion, but a sentiment in the hearts of United States citizens who are the recipients of dividends and interest payments on their Canadian investments, that perhaps they should not take the last pound of flesh from the Canadian people in the form of foreign exchange to pay these dividends. They are to a great degree of opinion that confidence is so high in the future possibilities of Canada, taking a long-range view over a period of many years, and visualizing the position of this dominion in world economic affairs, that directors and investors might be advised that it would be well to plough back into Canadian industry the dividends which they are receiving from their capital investments in Canada-

Topic:   WAYS AND MEANS
Subtopic:   WAR EXCHANGE CONSERVATION ACT, 1940
Permalink
NAT

Richard Burpee Hanson (Leader of the Official Opposition)

National Government

Mr. HANSON (York-Sunbury):

Or into

Canadian war loan.

Topic:   WAYS AND MEANS
Subtopic:   WAR EXCHANGE CONSERVATION ACT, 1940
Permalink
CON

Joseph Henry Harris

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. HARRIS (Danforth):

-in order to help to liquidate the position of their business in Canada, so that in turn United States investors might more and more expand their interests here and develop our resources and, from the long-range point of view, receive in the course of years more and more from their investments in this country.

I am not one w'ho is prone to suggest that we should arbitrarily declare that dividends from United States investments in Canada should not be exported. That is an arbitrary position to take and it is perhaps not good

business. But when the minister makes his statement on resolution 6, I can well believe that those who have investments here will appreciate the point that it would be good business for them to expand working capital in our Canadian industries, in their Canadian investments, rather than force us to buy United States exchange to pay these dividends.

Let me put it this way. I know cases today of estates, individual recipients of hard cash, who are living off the interest that they are receiving from dividends which they had previously earned and left in the business, first, to assist working capital and, second, to expand that business, so that their families in days to come may receive more dividends or, if they want to expand their business still further, receive more interest on dividends.

Perhaps my hon. friends to my left will hardly understand how folks could live off interest or dividends, but it is being done in Canada to-day, and in this war emergency and the feeling that is in the hearts and minds of our United States cousins at the present time, perhaps they would not like this government to stop the export of dividends. But in my opinion they would be very happy to leave those dividends in Canada, to expand their interests here and develop our natural resources, so that generations to come might obtain the benefits of the expansion which would occur if the working capital of these companies were helped out by holding the dividends here, and they perhaps could receive the interest from those dividends later. Therefore I hope that when the minister makes his statement to-morrow he will give some thought to the possibility of encouraging a movement of that kind, rather than look to the position into which we may be forced within the next twelve months, of stopping the export of dividends, because his words will be recorded in the New York Journal oj Commerce.

Topic:   WAYS AND MEANS
Subtopic:   WAR EXCHANGE CONSERVATION ACT, 1940
Permalink
LIB

James Lorimer Ilsley (Minister of Finance and Receiver General)

Liberal

Mr. ILSLEY:

As far as I can see, that

subject is not dealt with under this resolution. I thought the statement the leader of the opposition asked me to make was under resolution 6 of this resolution, which to my mind deals with an entirely different matter. As I understand it, the subject about which the hon. gentleman has been talking is quite away from resolution 6. If hon. gentlemen opposite see some deep meaning in this that I do not see, I wish they would tell me.

Topic:   WAYS AND MEANS
Subtopic:   WAR EXCHANGE CONSERVATION ACT, 1940
Permalink
CON

Joseph Henry Harris

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. HARRIS (Danforth):

Under resolution 6 as I understand it, the minister is empowered to enter into agreements to grant assistance by way of special tax credits or special allowances for depreciation or deple-

Special War Revenue Act

tion if such assistance is considered necessary in order that an expansion of the exports of any individual, partnership or corporation receiving such assistance may take place.

Topic:   WAYS AND MEANS
Subtopic:   WAR EXCHANGE CONSERVATION ACT, 1940
Permalink
LIB

James Lorimer Ilsley (Minister of Finance and Receiver General)

Liberal

Mr. ILSLEY:

It has nothing to do with

the movement of dividends.

Topic:   WAYS AND MEANS
Subtopic:   WAR EXCHANGE CONSERVATION ACT, 1940
Permalink
CON

Joseph Henry Harris

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. HARRIS (Danforth):

I would like

the minister, in making these agreements, to keep definitely in mind the idea I have tried to enunciate, with regard to those of our United States cousins who are doing a very considerable business here, with the idea of conserving exchange from any dividends which may arise from the conduct of such business.

Progress reported.

Topic:   WAYS AND MEANS
Subtopic:   WAR EXCHANGE CONSERVATION ACT, 1940
Permalink

SPECIAL WAR REVENUE ACT


Hon. J. L. ILSLEY (Minister of Finance) moved for leave to introduce Bill No. 8, to amend the Special War Revenue Act. Motion agreed to, bill read the first and second times, and the house went into committee thereon, Mr. Vien in the chair.


NAT

Grote Stirling

National Government

Mr. STIRLING:

Before we proceed in the committee stage, the undertaking having been given that we would sit until twelve o'clock, surely it would be desirable to defer this stage until to-morrow.

Topic:   SPECIAL WAR REVENUE ACT
Permalink

December 5, 1940