August 6, 1940

LIB

Thomas Vien (Deputy Speaker and Chair of Committees of the Whole of the House of Commons)

Liberal

The CHAIRMAN:

That does not arise out of the item now before the committee.

Topic:   PRISONERS OF WAR
Subtopic:   DEPARTMENT OF EXTERNAL AFFAIRS
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SC

Ernest George Hansell

Social Credit

Mr. HANSELL:

I feel rather keenly about this. There have been times when I could have discussed this matter, perhaps on the budget or on the speech from the throne, but the Prime Minister indicated that there was a time and a place

Topic:   PRISONERS OF WAR
Subtopic:   DEPARTMENT OF EXTERNAL AFFAIRS
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LIB

Thomas Vien (Deputy Speaker and Chair of Committees of the Whole of the House of Commons)

Liberal

The CHAIRMAN:

Can the hon. gentleman be more specific? I shall allow a certain latitude. I shall try to see if his remarks can be linked up with this item.

Topic:   PRISONERS OF WAR
Subtopic:   DEPARTMENT OF EXTERNAL AFFAIRS
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SC

Ernest George Hansell

Social Credit

Mr. HANSELL:

It is not my desire to go over the history of the present war or to embarrass the government in any way. My desire is that we might learn war no more. There are certain things operative within the relationship between one nation and another which cause war. I am not going into a detailed discussion of those systems, but I do believe that we must of necessity discover the reason for these international complications and then endeavour to find a way out.

Topic:   PRISONERS OF WAR
Subtopic:   DEPARTMENT OF EXTERNAL AFFAIRS
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LIB

Thomas Vien (Deputy Speaker and Chair of Committees of the Whole of the House of Commons)

Liberal

The CHAIRMAN:

The hon. gentleman proposes to discuss the causes of international wars.

I must rule that out of order.

Topic:   PRISONERS OF WAR
Subtopic:   DEPARTMENT OF EXTERNAL AFFAIRS
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SC

Ernest George Hansell

Social Credit

Mr. HANSELL:

I shall not dwell on that part of my remarks. May I go a little further, and say thaJt in days gone by the British empire has been highly favoured of providence.

Topic:   PRISONERS OF WAR
Subtopic:   DEPARTMENT OF EXTERNAL AFFAIRS
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LIB

Thomas Vien (Deputy Speaker and Chair of Committees of the Whole of the House of Commons)

Liberal

The CHAIRMAN:

I did not hear that.

Topic:   PRISONERS OF WAR
Subtopic:   DEPARTMENT OF EXTERNAL AFFAIRS
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SC

Ernest George Hansell

Social Credit

Mr. HANSELL:

Highly favoured of providence, highly favoured of God. But there is much that the British empire has to be ashamed of; there are many dark pages in our history. Generally speaking, however, I think our history shows that the hand of God has been with us. At this particular time we find ourselves in a most precarious position. I do not know what the future holds for us. I said the other day that the nations of the world seem to be lining up in different sections of political economy. We may find, perhaps in the not distant future,

that the Americas will be pretty well left to themselves. I do not know what the outcome of the war will be; nobody knows, but T believe of course that Great Brtiain will win. Whether at the close of the war we shall find ourselves in the same relationship with other nations as we have been in the past, I do not know. We may discover that we have a separate European economy. We may discover that we have a separate Asiatic economy. And we may discover that-

Topic:   PRISONERS OF WAR
Subtopic:   DEPARTMENT OF EXTERNAL AFFAIRS
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LIB

Thomas Vien (Deputy Speaker and Chair of Committees of the Whole of the House of Commons)

Liberal

The CHAIRMAN:

With all my good-will and my desire to help the hon. gentleman, I must tell him that his remarks are out of order at this moment. Shall the item carry?

Topic:   PRISONERS OF WAR
Subtopic:   DEPARTMENT OF EXTERNAL AFFAIRS
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SC

Ernest George Hansell

Social Credit

Mr. HANSELL:

Mr. Chairman, would

you tell me under what item I might discuss the matter of which I am speaking?

Topic:   PRISONERS OF WAR
Subtopic:   DEPARTMENT OF EXTERNAL AFFAIRS
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LIB

Thomas Vien (Deputy Speaker and Chair of Committees of the Whole of the House of Commons)

Liberal

The CHAIRMAN:

Well, it is not the duty of the chairman to tell hon. gentlemen when they should rise to speak and what subject they should discuss. I must tell them when they are out of order; and the hon. gentleman is at present out of order.

Topic:   PRISONERS OF WAR
Subtopic:   DEPARTMENT OF EXTERNAL AFFAIRS
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SC

Ernest George Hansell

Social Credit

Mr. HANSELL:

Might I ask the Prime

Minister a question? I could have discussed this matter some time ago, but the Prime Minister will recall that he suggested that we could discuss almost anything somewhere in the estimates. May I ask the Prime Minister where I can discuss this matter?

Topic:   PRISONERS OF WAR
Subtopic:   DEPARTMENT OF EXTERNAL AFFAIRS
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LIB

William Lyon Mackenzie King (Prime Minister; Secretary of State for External Affairs; President of the Privy Council)

Liberal

Mr. MACKENZIE KING:

There have

been several occasions. One, as the hon. member himself has remarked, was when we were dealing with the speech from the throne; also there have been opportunities when we were going into supply; and there were other opportunities. I think he is right in saying that some latitude has been and should be allowed on the estimates for external affairs. But this session has been very largely taken up with external affairs, and on many occasions when we have been discussing international affairs my hon. friend might have spoken. It seems to me that there is a very slim house to-day for the consideration of a subject so important as the cause of the war and the other questions he is raising. I think he might reasonably hold over the matter to a subsequent session, unless meanwhile there is a possibility of something being determined as a result of the discussion.

Topic:   PRISONERS OF WAR
Subtopic:   DEPARTMENT OF EXTERNAL AFFAIRS
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SC

Ernest George Hansell

Social Credit

Mr. HANSELL:

Perhaps I could reserve

my remarks for some future occasion. But may I point out that, to save time and comply with the Prime Minister's request that we get on with our war effort, I did not speak on the speech from the throne. For the same reason I spoke for less than five minutes on the

Supply-External Affairs

budget. I hoped that I might speak along this line under the estimates of the Department of External Affairs.

Topic:   PRISONERS OF WAR
Subtopic:   DEPARTMENT OF EXTERNAL AFFAIRS
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Item agreed to. J,2. Representation abroad, including salaries of high commissioners, ministers plenipotentiary, consuls, secretaries and staff, notwithstanding anything to the contrary in the Civil Service Act or any of its amendments, $626,575.


NAT

Howard Charles Green

National Government

Mr. GREEN:

Would the Prime Minister

state in what countries we have representation at the present time?

Topic:   PRISONERS OF WAR
Subtopic:   DEPARTMENT OF EXTERNAL AFFAIRS
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LIB

William Lyon Mackenzie King (Prime Minister; Secretary of State for External Affairs; President of the Privy Council)

Liberal

Mr. MACKENZIE KING:

Representatives have been appointed from Canada as ministers to the United States, to France, to Japan, and more recently, to Belgium and to Holland. My hon. friend is aware that we also have representatives appointed to different parts of the British empire; representatives as high commissioners to the United Kingdom, and to Australia, New Zealand, South Africa and Ireland. That is the present extent of Canada's representation abroad.

Topic:   PRISONERS OF WAR
Subtopic:   DEPARTMENT OF EXTERNAL AFFAIRS
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NAT

Howard Charles Green

National Government

Mr. GREEN:

I understand that there is

no minister to Japan at this time and that the post has been vacant for some years. What is the intention of the government?

Topic:   PRISONERS OF WAR
Subtopic:   DEPARTMENT OF EXTERNAL AFFAIRS
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LIB

William Lyon Mackenzie King (Prime Minister; Secretary of State for External Affairs; President of the Privy Council)

Liberal

Mr. MACKENZIE KING:

There has been a vacancy for, I think, about a year and a half. Mr. McGreer is acting as charge d'affaires in Tokyo at the present time. The government has had in mind the appointing of a minister to Japan to succeed the former minister, but for one reason or another it has seemed during the past few months that it would be better to await a more opportune moment to make that particular appointment. The most I would say at the moment is that the matter is under consideration. We are getting very full information from Mr. McGreer. He is in touch with affairs in Japan and is also in touch with the British ambassador in Tokyo. Having regard to the situation eyisting in the orient, I believe we are receiving about as much information from Mr. McGreer, as charge d'affaires, as it would be possible to obtain through a minister.

With reference to what the hon. member for Temiscouata mentioned a moment ago, as to having someone in our legation at Tokyo who has a knowledge of Japanese and who also is a Canadian, I may say that we have in the person of Mr. Norman one who is a graduate of Toronto university, who holds degrees in oriental languages from not only Toronto but also from Harvard and Columbia, is a scholar in Japanese, and quite competent both to converse in and to read that language as freely as he does English.

Topic:   PRISONERS OF WAR
Subtopic:   DEPARTMENT OF EXTERNAL AFFAIRS
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NAT

Howard Charles Green

National Government

Mr. GREEN:

Has consideration been given to setting up legations in any of the South American countries? The trend of world affairs seems to be making South America of more importance in the Canadian economy, and it might be worth while to consider having representation in Brazil and Argentina. I do not know whether it would be worth while, but has the government considered it?

Topic:   PRISONERS OF WAR
Subtopic:   DEPARTMENT OF EXTERNAL AFFAIRS
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August 6, 1940