June 18, 1940

EUROPEAN WAR

REQUEST OP FRANCE FOR TERMS-EMERGENCY MEASURES FOR ASSISTANCE OF BRITAIN AND DEFENCE OF CANADA

LIB

William Lyon Mackenzie King (Prime Minister; Secretary of State for External Affairs; President of the Privy Council)

Liberal

Right Hon. W. L. MACKENZIE KING (Prime Minister):

Mr. Speaker, at this moment the German and Italian dictators are together considering the request of France for a definition of the terms of an honourable peace. Whatever is the outcome of the conference and the consideration of the inquiries of Marshal Petain, it appears that effective French resistance on land will soon come to an end. Conditions are obscure. The eventual disposition of the French fleet and air force is at present unknown. The unprecedented offer of Great Britain to form a national union with France, with all the implications of common citizenship, common representation, common defence, and common economic control, has apparently met with a divided reception. The

suggestion that Britain and France become the Canada of Europe must strike the imagination of this country. Whether or not it proves a peaceful solution for the present distress of France, it may yet contain the future hope of a peaceful Europe. To-day Mr. Churchill, with his usual thoroughness and blunt sincerity, reviewed the state of the war. Whatever may be the present fate of France, Britain will fight on. That decision is not only Britain's decision, it is also the decision of Canada.

No word of criticism will be found upon the lips or in the heart of any man who surveys with understanding the situation in which France found herself. With her original defences broken, the Maginot line outflanked, her industrial areas and her factories in the hands of the enemy, her troops without adequate food and munitions of war, the streets of her proud capital overrun by the legions of the invader, effective resistance by soldiers whose endurance and fortitude have added new glories to the French name was no longer possible.

We who know the spirit of France know also that, if her soldiers have surrendered to the inevitable, no soldiers in the world could have continued any longer to face the overwhelming odds against which she had battled with such courage. France will arise with a new strength and a new glory from the bloodstained soil on which, three times during the last seventy years, she has fought so gallantly. Her sufferings have been our sufferings. The hallowed French earth where our dead are buried and our proud memorial stands is a part of Canada. In a very real sense she is ours and we are hers. Her romance, her chivalry, her language and her ancient faith are an imperishable part of the Canadian heritage.

If she signifies these intimate and beloved things to a large portion of our people, to the world, to the world of free men she has always personified the eternal truths of democracy and all that belongs to the enfranchisement of the human spirit. A new dawn will follow the shadows of the night. The legions of freedom will yet march again through the Arch of Triumph to the strains of La Marseillaise.

It is for us at this time to consider the new situation in which we find ourselves. I have tried from time to time to forecast the new phases of the war which were obvious, perhaps, to any student of the march of events. To-day it is still necessary, indeed it is more imperative than ever, to examine the situation in its true perspective and to assess anew what may be necessary on Canada's part to meet the new demands.

The plain facts are that the defeat of France has brought the war much nearer home to

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Canada. The British isles are threatened with invasion not as a remote possibility but as an impending actuality. It is now wholly apparent that additional measures both for the assistance of Britain and for the defence of Canada are an essential.

The policy which the government announced at the outset of the war of assisting Britain by relieving her of the duty of protecting certain areas in this hemisphere, has been greatly extended in recent weeks. I pointed out in this house on September 8 last that- ... by contributing as far as we are able to the defence of Newfoundland and the other liritisli and French territories in this hemisphere, we will not only be defending Canada but we will also be assisting Great Britain and France by enabling them to concentrate their own energies more in that part of the world in which their own immediate security is at stake.

Immediate measures were taken at that time to assist in the naval defence of Newfoundland. In the light of recent events additional responsibility has been assumed for the military defence of strategic areas there. I am pleased to be able to announce that Canadian armed forces are now on duty in Newfoundland. The house has already been informed of the contribution which Canada is making in the West Indies by replacing British troops with Canadian troops on garrison duty and thus relieving British forces for other duties. The government agreed some weeks ago to a request of the United Kingdom government that Canadian troops should assist in the defence of Iceland. The first contingent of a Canadian expeditionary force have already landed in Iceland. Further units have been detailed and will follow shortly. I need hardly point out the strategic importance not only to the security of the north Atlantic sea lanes but to the defence of this continent of maintaining control of Iceland.

The increased seriousness of the military situation abroad, and the marked expansion of all three branches of our armed services in Canada have served to arouse widespread interest and concern throughout the country regarding the raising and training of recruits. At the conclusion of my remarks the Minister of National Defence for Air (Mr. Power) will make a statement on what is now being done and what additional measures are proposed in connection with the recruitment of Canada's armed forces. A bill will be introduced in the house at once to confer upon the government special emergency powers to mobilize all our human and material resources for the defence of Canada. Although the purpose of this measure will be explained in detail on the second reading, I should like to make one or two brief observations regarding it.

So far as man-power is concerned, it will relate solely and exclusively to the defence of Canada on our own soil and in our own territorial waters. It will enable the government to make the most efficient use of our man-power for the varied needs of modern machine warfare. It is of the utmost importance to realize that success in war to-day depends upon the use of men for the kind of work for which they are best fitted. The armed forces are only a part of the essential equipment of war. The skilled worker in the factory, the transport worker and the farmer, to mention only a few, are as essential to the effective prosecution of war as the soldier, the sailor and the airmen. The mobilization of our resources will not, however, be confined to requiring the services of men and women. The government will have power under the provisions of the bill equally to call property and wealth, material resources and industry to the defence of Canada.

The bill is intended to remove any doubt as to the power of the government and the will of parliament that the whole material resources of the country should be available whenever they are required to meet the needs of the war. The operation of the measure will be confined to the period of the war.

Recruitment for service overseas will be maintained on a voluntary basis. No difficulty has been experienced and no difficulty is anticipated in raising by the voluntary system all the men required for service outside Canada. The bill to be introduced to-day in no way affects the raising of men to serve in the armed forces overseas. Once again I wish to repeat my undertaking, frequently given, that no measure for the conscription of men for overseas service will be introduced by the present administration.

A complete inventory of Canada's manpower and other resources, properly classified, affords a necessary basis for some of the further essential measures of home security and defence, which I have announced. A national registration of Canada's man-power will accordingly be instituted at once. Let me emphasize the fact that this registration will have nothing whatever to do with the recruitment of men for overseas service.

Among others, a national registration of Canada's man-power will have the following immediate advantages:

The national registration will constitute an additional precaution against "fifth column" activities such as sabotage and espionage which conceivably might become more menacing as external threats grow more serious. In this way, it will add to our internal security.

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National registration will also provide the government with an inventory of the mechanical and industrial skill of our population. Such an inventory will prove valuable in affording additional information on the extent of our resources of skilled labour which can be drawn upon to meet the needs of essential wartime industries. It will also show the directions in which intensive industrial and technical training is most urgently needed to provide an adequate supply of labour to -meet the growing demands of our war industries and other essential services.

I should like here to express the warm appreciation of the government of the valuable work already accomplished through the voluntary registration of women undertaken as a spontaneous contribution to the development of Canadian efficiency in wartime. The fullest use will be made of the results of the register now being completed.

It is the intention of the government also to establish without delay a new department of government to be known as the Department of National War Services, to be presided over by a minister of the crown. Since the war began, thousands of patriotic citizens have expressed a desire to engage in some voluntary war work. As the crisis has developed and will develop, there have come new obligations upon our citizens. The care and housing of evacuated children and of refugees, the provision of comforts for soldiers, the economical use of food supplies, the launching of campaigns for war loans and contributions, agricultural developments, the attraction of tourists

these and many other matters demand organization and direction.

The purpose of the new department is not merely to coordinate the activities of existing voluntary war services. It will be entrusted with the duty of directing and mobilizing the activities of thousands of our citizens who are seeking practical and useful outlets for their enthusiasm and patriotism. Women's organizations, patriotic organizations, commercial organizations, and many other groups of men and women banded together in the national interest offer a vast field of activity for spontaneous service. The object of the new department is to help Canadians to help Canada by their free-will offerings, which have been so generously made and will be so generously continued. The minister charged with the duties of this department will be expected immediately to establish a dominion-wide organization of voluntary service, which will be assisted by branch committees in all parts of the country.

Finally, I wish to announce that for some time past I have been giving careful consideration to means whereby there might be included in the government additional ministers to assist in the direction of Canada's war effort, and whose presence in the ministry might serve to give still further assurance of the power of the government adequately to meet the increased responsibilities with which it is faced. Hon. members will realize that there are many considerations of which account has to be taken in any matter which concerns the personnel of a cabinet.

I might mention as not the least important of these considerations what is required of a minister of the crown in the way of a manysided experience in the conduct and management of public affairs.

An equally important consideration is whether the talents of leading executives and business men may not be used to greater advantage in high administrative posts, and in an advisory capacity with relation to particular services, than in the ministry and in parliament.

As the house is aware, my colleague the Minister of Finance (Mr. Ralston) expects to bring down the budget before the close of the present week, and thereafter will assume his new responsibilities as Minister of National Defence. At the time that this transfer of portfolios is made, I expect to be in a position to announce the governmental changes and additions at present contemplated.

The situation which I have described, and the measures which I have indicated to meet it, require no further elaboration. The times are the most serious in our history. They hold in their keeping the destiny of Canada as a free nation. I do not doubt the ultimate result, but I realize how arduous and full of suffering may be the via dolorosa along which we must pass before the agony is ended. It is our manifest duty, as it is our unshaken determination, to use all our advantages, geographic, strategic and economic, to preserve liberty for ourselves and to help to preserve it for the British commonwealth and the other nations that yet are free. We must use them to help regain liberty for the victims of bloodthirsty tyranny. The British peoples, who taught the world the meaning of freedom, will defend it to the last. They have become the symbol, the hope and the guarantee of its continuance, and its restoration throughout the world. Endowed by the heritage of Britain and France, with pride in the strength of her youth and the righteousness of the cause, Canada faces what fate may bring with resolute confidence and unyielding determination.

Before I take my seat may I mention to the house that yesterday my hon. friend

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the leader of the opposition (Mr. Hanson) was kind enough to come with his colleague the hon. member for Yale (Mr. Stirling) who shares his seat, to my office to discuss the very critical situation which had developed over the weekend. My hon. friend came in a spirit of helpfulness to disjuss measures which he thought ought to be brought into force immediately. He spoke particularly of the desirability of stating that an emergent condition exists at the present time which, to deal with effectively, required further action on the part of the government. He spoke to me about the desirability of complete mobilization of man-power and resources, and also made mention of the desirability of adding to the ministry some gentlemen whose names and ability and capacity, along with those who are in the administration at the present time, would help further to inspire general confidence throughout this country.

I mentioned to my hon. friends that I was not prepared to make a statement yesterday, because I had not the information with respect to the situation in Europe on which I would wish to base what I had to say; that I thought, as I mentioned to the house yesterday, it would be well to wait until the Prime Minister of Great Britain made his statement on the European situation before I should make a statement myself. I told my hon. friends, however, that all the measures to which they had made reference were matters that the government had had under consideration for some time. I said to them, what I have frequently said in the house, that there are times and seasons for all things; some matters can be dealt with in a manner which will be most helpful to the maintenance of national unity and security at one time which, were an effort made to precipitate them unduly, might defeat the vei-y ends that we all have in common. I stated, however, that I would to-day without fail make a statement to the house of the measures which the government proposes to take to meet the emergent situation which has developed. What I have said this afternoon has been by way of carrying out that promise and the intention which I had at the beginning of the week.

I should like to express to my hon. friend, in the presence of hon. members of the house, my appreciation of the helpful and cooperative manner in which he and his desk-mate met me yesterday in the discussion of these matters of great common concern.

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NAT

Richard Burpee Hanson (Leader of the Official Opposition)

National Government

Hon. R. B. HANSON (Leader of the Opposition) :

Mr. Speaker, we have just listened to a notable statement by the Prime Minister (Mr. Mackenzie King). So far as I was able to follow him I take it he is determined that

Canada, in common with the mother country, shall fight on. With that purpose I tell him that we, his majesty's loyal opposition, are in the most hearty accord.

As to our gallant ally, France, I could not find words as eloquent as those he used in which to express my sentiments with respect to the position in which France finds herself at this moment. Our hearts are all bleeding for her, and we hope the day will come, as he has prophesied, when she will rise again to take her place as a great nation among the civilized nations of the world.

With respect to the other subjects to -which the Prime Minister has alluded, perhaps I may be permitted to refer to them at a later stage in the remarks which I now propose to make.

On Sunday night last there came through the air and over the wires news of the disastrous situation in Europe. On Monday morning we were informed by the press that the French had ceased fighting, and that the new French government was seeking terms of capitulation and surrender. I was impressed with the desirability, yea the necessity, of Canada doing something. Two courses I judged were open to me; either that I should on the opening of the house yesterday move the adjournment of the house to debate the matter as being one of urgent public importance; or that I should seek an interview with the Prime Minister, lay certain suggestions before him and ask him to adopt them. I want this house and -the country to believe and appreciate that whether I had adopted the one course or the other, I was deeply moved by the tragic -trend of events, that it had not been suggested to me by anyone, bu-t that I was actuated solely by a deep-rooted patriotic desire that Canada should rise to this supreme occasion. I had little time for conference with anyone. I did have the counsel of my friend and colleague who sits beside me, and I did consult with one or two others in the house, and with a friend who is a national figure in Canada bu-t who is not affiliated with any political party. It was the consensus of all that I should not await the opening of the house and then move the adjournment to debate the matter. I myself thought that such a course would savour of party politics and partisanship, which is -the last consideration in the world that would move me at this time.

Having regard to that decision I decided to seek and did seek an interview with the Prime Minister, in company with my colleague. We were unable to reach him -until 12.30 yesterday. In approaching him I made it abundantly clear, first, that my action in seeking an interview with him was dictated not in any

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Specifically I recommended three things: first, that the government should declare that a state of national emergency exists in Canada -I shall allude to that again later; second, that this government propose now to take authority to mobilize all the man-power and all the material resources of this nation for the aid of the mother country and for the defence of Canada; third, that steps should be taken at once to strengthen the government by the immediate inclusion of some of the best brains, intelligence and ability in this country, not on the basis of a union government but on the basis of a truly national government.

I told the Prime Minister in conclusion that if these things were not done, if they were rejected, I reserved the right to appeal to the house and to the nation so that the reaction of public opinion, about which I had no manner of doubt in the world, might be brought to bear on the government to adopt these principles and do the things I had indicated, having regard to the extremely critical situation which had arisen.

At the moment the Prime Minister did not accept my proposal. We debated the matter at some length. He advised me that he had no official news or confirmation of the position in Prance, as he has to-day indicated; that Mr. Churchill, the Prime Minister of Great Britain, would speak in the British House of Commons this morning; that it was hoped that in twenty-four hours the exact position with respect to France would be clarified and that Mr. Churchill's statement to-day would clarify the position of Great Britain. The Prime Minister then and there requested me to delay the whole matter for twenty-four hours, and that he would make a statement in the house to-day. We left him at 1.05 p.m., promising to consult our colleagues. We did so before the house met at three o'clock, and the consensus of my colleagues in this group was that we had done the right thing in seeking the interview with the Prime Minister, and further that we should wait the twenty-four hours asked for.

The result is known. The house met yesterday and I contented myself with merely asking the Prime Minister if he had any statement to

make to the house and the country at that time. You heard his reply. I hope that what I did will meet with the approval of the house and the country; I think I could do no less.

Now, what did I propose? First I proposed a declaration of the existence of a state of national emergency. In our War Measures Act we have no corresponding phrase. They have it in England, and it is coupled with supreme power vested by statute in the government to do anything and everything necessary for the safety of the state. We may have given the government that power now by the War Measures Act, but I doubt it; and if there is any doubt it can be removed by this parliament, on the initiative of this government, in two hours' time. I hold in my hand an abstract from the British Emergency Powers Act, passed May 22, 1940.

I propose to read only one paragraph:

1.- (1) The powei's conferred on His Majesty by the Emergency Power's (Defence) Act, 1939 (hereinafter referred to as the "principal act") shall, notwithstanding anything in that act, include power by order in council to make such defence regulations making provision for requiring persons to place themselves, their services, and their property at the disposal of His Majesty, as appear to him to be necessary or expedient for securing the public safety, the defence of the realm, the maintenance of public order, or the efficient prosecution of any war in which His Majesty may be engaged, or for maintaining supplies or services essential to the life of the community.

A declaration of a state of national emergency means much more than just a question of the powers of the government. It has a psychological significance as well, in my opinion, and a meaning that I would impress upon the government, the house and the country. Among other things it means that this government would realize to the full the responsibilities resting upon it to do its utmost for the safety and preservation of the state and for the aid of the mother country, but it means far more than that. It means that the country, the people of Canada-more particularly those of our citizens who have not a full appreciation of the serious situation confronting us

shall be shaken out of their inertness and complacency and shall be made to feel that this country, this empire and especially our beloved mother country are facing the supreme test for our and her existence and all that it stands for, I venture to think that there is still a large element in our population who are not yet impressed with this serious position, and I would bring it home to them by such a declaration on the part of the government. Their number, I am sure, is rapidly diminishing, yet I feel certain that such a declaration would serve a useful and a patriotic purpose. I suggest that

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the government should do this: warn the country, warn the complacent elements in this country, that there must and shall be concentrated national service.

My second proposal followed naturally from the first, advocating that the government ask parliament at once for authority, enabling legislation to mobilize the man-power and all the material resources of the nation for the safety of the state, for the defence of Canada and for the utmost aid to our mother country. We can do no less. We all love Canada. Irrespective of race, class, religion or political proclivities there is not one of us who would not lay down his life, give his last dollar or perform any service for the state at this time of national peril. This country may be invaded by a ruthless enemy within a short time. What position are we in to defend ourselves? None whatever. Without the British navy we are helpless. The responsibility is the government's and the government's alone. It has not the power to-day effectively to defend Canada. I hope it will have that power when this bill is introduced and passes this house. Has the government the will to defend Canada? I believe that now it has. Then let the government arm itself with all the authority necessary, which to-day at least it does not possess. It is true that we have the Militia Act, section 8 of which provides for liability to military service, while section 64 provides that the government may place the militia on active service in Canada and elsewhere. In my view as a legal man that is not quite sufficient. Apparently the government have arrived at the same conclusion, hence the bill which is to be introduced. It is true that the Militia Act goes a long way, and I have heard it argued that the powers contained therein are quite sufficient for every purpose because they provide for the sending of the militia outside of Canada. But nowhere does the law provide for the mobilization of the material resources of the country, the wealth, the industry and the resources of Canada. The government's duty is to ensure the defence of this country. In doing that in some degree at least it will be aiding the mother country.

What is Canada's war effort after more than nine months as a belligerent? For eight months it was pitiful. Since the house met the force of tragic events overseas, the voice of public opinion, the efforts of this party within this house, all have combined to urge the government to greater action. Some progress has been made. In terms of dollars and cents it is made to look impressive, but it is all in the future. I make no recriminations, beyond that, over the lack of action during

[Mr. R. B. Hanson.I

the first eight months of the war. That is past. It is the immediate future that demands our attention. The government must give leadership, and to give leadership it must be armed with authority which in my view it does not at present possess. To-day it is taking authority in large measure in regard to the particular matters to which I referred, and we shall help the government. We all rejoice that they have gone as far as they have. The responsibility is theirs alone. We offer our wholehearted cooperation, but the lead must come from the government.

On the third point I desire to make it clear that in my opinion the ministry must be strengthened. There are vacancies now existing which must be filled. I cannot accept the view that because of the recent election we have a national government. We have a party government, moved by party considerations, motivated by the party spirit. The result has been that while one-half of the nation is to be called upon to pay, to fight, and, it may be, to die, that half has nothing to say about how our defence shall be carried on. That is not national unity. It is quite the reverse, and in a time of national peril should not continue.

I am not advocating a union government as we had it in the last war; I am advocating a truly national government, to be formed by this administration, with representation from among the best in this house and in the country, and for concerted national effort, so that this nation may present a united front to the common enemy. It was necessary in Britain. It was necessary in two other great sister dominions. It is necessary here. If it does not come, if this government does not move to accomplish this end, this country will not function as it should if we are to present a common front, if we are successfully to defend ourselves. What an electrifying effect such an action would have on the Canadian public, on our neighbours to the south, who are so sympathetic-indeed anxious; and what an effect it would have on Britain!

I beg the Prime Minister, I beg the members of the government, to unite this country under a truly national government. He and they alone can do it. Theirs is the responsibility. Theirs is the power. We can but indicate our readiness to cooperate, as I have done many times. But if they will not give heed, then I appeal to the great voice of public opinion in this house and in the country.

The hour has struck, the time is here. Let us be, in fact and in deed, a united country, banded together for a common purpose,-the

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defence of our homes, our loved ones, our nation, and our mother country. Anything else will not do.

Before taking my seat I should like to say a word with respect to the Prime Minister's proposals. He was good enough to send me a summary of the announcements he has made to-day. Of some of them we were already aware, and to-day I believe we aire to have a further detailed report from the Minister of National Defence for Air (Mr. Power) respecting the raising and training of recruits for the three armed services.

The Prime Minister has announced that a bill will be introduced to-day to empower the government to mobilize all the resources of the nation, human and material, for the defence of Canada. That is good; everybody will applaud it. Material aid to the mother country will come from it; that result cannot help following. The trend of events in Canada and in the struggle will indicate how much farther the government should go.

I am pleased to note that recruitment for overseas services will be continued. I hope the enforcement of national service in Canada will in no degree retard our contribution for overseas service. If the war is to cease on continental Europe I can quite understand that we shall not require to send as much manpower overseas. But there will still be great need for material things being sent over- there will be the need for food, clothing, and shelter for the aid and comfort of our people. There will be the- need for munitions, and then more munitions, and then more munitions, from Canada.

The registration for national service is all right, but I am afraid it is three months too late. This cannot be done in a minute; it cannot be organized in the twinkling of an eye. It should have been undertaken before the house met in May last.

I am pleased to note that the Prime Minister proposes to set up a new department of government to be known as the Department of National War Services. May I suggest to him that there should be set up an inner war cabinet from among the best of the members of his government, a cabinet which will not be charged with the responsibility of administering departments, a war cabinet whose functions it will be to examine all the facts and to initiate policies on the part of the government, a war cabinet that will not be trammelled by the burdensome and onerous duties of administering important departments of government. I have in mind the position in which the Minister of Munitions and Supply (Mr. Howe) is placed to-day. He is overburdened with the work of the

greatest department this country has ever known. How can he possibly give attention to any question of war policy, when he sits as a member of the general cabinet? I submit this recommendation to the Prime Minister, in addition to those I have already made. I hope he will take it into earnest consideration, and that as a result there shall be set up in Canada a war cabinet similar to that which has been instituted in the old country, the members of which would be free from the trammels of departmental administration.

I suggest also that the government appoint a minister for overseas who will coordinate our activities over there with the activities of the mother country. We had such a minister in the last war. The provision did not immediately become operative, but it was effective in the later stages of the war, and should have been adopted at an earlier stage.

I am thankful to the Prime Minister, on behalf of the people I represent, for the measures he has already taken. Time, and the trend of events, will compel further action.

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CCF

Major James William Coldwell

Co-operative Commonwealth Federation (C.C.F.)

Mr. M. J. COLDWELL (Rosetown-Biggar):

Mr. Speaker, we have felt for some time that the trend of events overseas-and particularly does this apply to the grave news which has reached us in recent hours-required more than general statements from the government regarding Canada's support and participation in the great struggle. We welcome, therefore, the pronouncements made this afternoon by the Prime Minister (Mr. Mackenzie King) and the suggestions which have been placed before the house. The most important announcement, it seems to me, was that measures would be introduced for the immediate mobilization of our resources and our man-power in order that we may conduct more efficiently the war effort. I shall reserve my opinion of the proposed measures until I see them, because I believe the Canadian people ought to expect a guarantee from the government not only that the power will be taken to mobilize property and wealth, but that the power so taken will be used.

Listening to the discussion which took place last night in the house respecting the munitions and supply bill, I must say I was not satisfied with the answers to many of the questions which were put. They seemed to indicate that the government was engaged in the mobilization of certain industries in a form which would place certain private interests in a preferred position. We do not want that to occur, and any support we may give to the mobilization of our man power for economic and military purposes must be predicated upon the determination of the government to demand equality of sacrifice from those controlling large blocks of property and

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wealth. We have in our midst vast surpluses of wealth owned by various corporations under new forms of corporate ownership and control. That wealth has already been asked to contribute, at a rate of interest. I submit that if we are going to ask young Canadians to lay down their lives in the defence of our country, we should predicate that request upon a demand that owners of large volumes of wealth and of property should first place that wealth and property on the altar of Canadian sacrifice. That, Mr. Speaker, is the principal point I wish to make in that connection.

I wish also to say to the Prime Minister that in the minds of members on all sides of the house there are to-day many questions which we have refrained from asking on the floor of parliament because we did not wish to invite answers or to leave unanswered questions which might give aid and comfort to the enemy. But we are anxious, in view of the situation that has developed overseas, to know what in the event of certain eventualities this government and this parliament and this country would be prepared to do for the welfare of Canada. Those questions it seems to me ought to be answered. I have heard discussions in the city of Ottawa among newspaper men who seemed to know far more about the views of the government than we who are members of this house. Their views may be the result of rumours that are not well founded, but in any event the time has arrived when, in view of the situation overseas, this house should be taken wholly into the confidence of the government. I admit that certain information cannot be spread across the country through the public press, but at the risk of being misunderstood I repeat that the government should have a private sitting of the house in which many of the questions that are in our minds can be asked and answered so that we may know precisely where we stand.

The other matter that comes to my mind can be discussed better, I think, on the bill. Let me say this, however, before I take my seat. There is no group in this house which, our political and economic opinions being what they are, realizes better than we do the danger of a fascist victory. We know perfectly well that the first victims of fascist aggression in every country have been the men holding the views that we of this group hold, and we can assure the Prime Minister that just as we have in past days viewed with alarm the desertion of collective security and the gradual drift towards war, so to-day we will cooperate with hon. members in all parts of this house to preserve freedom of thought, freedom to worship God as we will, freedom

of association and freedom of expression- these freedoms upon which the civilization in which we live has been founded.

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SC

John Horne Blackmore

Social Credit

Mr. J. H. BLACKMORE (Lethbridge):

Mr. Speaker, in the special session held in September the group I represent was the only group in this country with courage and vision enough to come forward with the policy which is now advocated. We came forward with that policy definitely and unequivocally, although we suspected that the other parties would endeavour to use it to beat us to death- which they did. It will be realized therefore, sir, that we are prepared now to support this proposal of the Prime Minister (Mr. Mackenzie King). But there are one or two matters which need to be pointed out with definiteness and emphasis at this stage of the game.

When we advocated this policy last year we specifically declared that we stood for the conscription of finance, industry and manpower, and we took pains to point out that the first of these must be finance. It is a most interesting thing that thus far finance has not figured prominently in the speech of the Prime Minister. Last year I pointed this out, that finance, industry and man-power are a three-legged stool, and if you bring in any one of them without the other two, you are bound to meet with disaster. That statement is as true to-day as it was when I made it last fall. Let us be forewarned- I say this not in any spirit of criticism or pessimism or defeatism-that the all-important thing with which to fight this war is money. It will do no good for the government to mobilize mines, shoe factories, sugar factories, munitions factories or any other factories unless the government knows where it is going to find the money with which to run them. It will do very little good to enlist hundreds of thousands of men unless the government knows where it is going to get the money with which to train and support and maintain those men.

Topic:   EUROPEAN WAR
Subtopic:   REQUEST OP FRANCE FOR TERMS-EMERGENCY MEASURES FOR ASSISTANCE OF BRITAIN AND DEFENCE OF CANADA
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LIB

Georges Parent (Speaker of the Senate)

Liberal

Mr. SPEAKER:

I do not wish to interrupt the hon. member's speech, but he is dealing with what may come up later in the form of a resolution preceding a bill, and his remarks might more appropriately be made then.

Topic:   EUROPEAN WAR
Subtopic:   REQUEST OP FRANCE FOR TERMS-EMERGENCY MEASURES FOR ASSISTANCE OF BRITAIN AND DEFENCE OF CANADA
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SC

John Horne Blackmore

Social Credit

Mr. BLACKMORE:

I was going entirely, Mr. Speaker, by what the two previous speakers were permitted to say, but I shall comply with your request. I have said what I wish to say, with the exception of one statement which it is highly important should be made at this time. Unless this government discovers a source of money which is very large indeed, so that the money can run as freefy as the goods and services of this country

European War-Enlistments

may run, and so that the money will not create a debt upon this country or an interest burden which future generations cannot carry, then all the measures which are proposed by the government to-day will be futile and will cause us more embarrassment than they will do us good.

I propose, Mr. Speaker, to support the government in the conduct of the war. Above all things wre must win this war, but to win the war takes more than talk.

Topic:   EUROPEAN WAR
Subtopic:   REQUEST OP FRANCE FOR TERMS-EMERGENCY MEASURES FOR ASSISTANCE OF BRITAIN AND DEFENCE OF CANADA
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LIB

Georges Parent (Speaker of the Senate)

Liberal

Mr. SPEAKER:

I must point out to hon. members that there can be no further discussion on this subject because at the moment there is nothing before the chair. I therefore ask that the discussion now cease, and the house will proceed to the order for motions.

Topic:   EUROPEAN WAR
Subtopic:   REQUEST OP FRANCE FOR TERMS-EMERGENCY MEASURES FOR ASSISTANCE OF BRITAIN AND DEFENCE OF CANADA
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STATEMENT OF POSITION WITH REGARD TO ENLISTMENTS AND RECRUITING IN CANADA

LIB

Charles Gavan Power (Minister of National Defence; Minister of National Defence for Air; Minister of National Defence for Air and Associate Minister of National Defence)

Liberal

Hon. C. G. POWER (Acting Minister of National Defence):

Mr. Speaker, I should like to make a statement to the house as to the position with regard to enlistments and recruiting in Canada.

Canada has now approximately 110,000 men actually under arms and in uniform. These are divided broadly as follows:

Outside of Canada, including Great

Britain, army 26,087

Canada, army 64,656

Navy 7,256

Air force 15,594

Total 113,593

The late Minister of National Defence has indicated in various announcements that further recruiting has been authorized on a large scale to provide for the raising of men for the third and fourth divisions and other units of the Canadian active service force, amounting in all to about 30,000 men.

Recruits are now being enlisted at the rate of approximately 800 per day. The whole situation with regard to recruiting these troops has been reviewed over the week-end and instructions issued to intensify activity. I am able to say on the authority of the department of supply that we can at the present moment provide clothing, personal equipment and rifles for 1,200 men per day. As a matter of fact yesterday 1,463 men were enlisted and looked after.

In addition to the 30,000 men the raising of whom was authorized by the late Mr. Rogers, a survey of the field in the light of the war situation, recently developed and still developing, clearly indicates the need of a call for further Canadian active service force recruiting to replace troops taken and to be taken for special duties in Canada and elsewhere, and for forestry and railway troops, as well as corps troops for reinforcements.

Whilst it is impossible to forecast what these requirements will be, authorization was given over the week-end to provide equipment for an additional 40,000 men in addition to the 30,000 men now coming in.

It will be remembered that the veterans home guard has been formed as a corps of the non-permanent active militia, and numbers of that guard can be readily increased as circumstances may justify. The veterans' home guard reserve is also, it will be remembered, part of the non-permanent active militia, and in fact the non-permanent active militia units are made responsible for its discipline and training.

Meanwhile, authority has been given for all the infantry non-permanent active militia units which have not been mobilized to carry on their training in the local headquarters and to recruit to their respective establishments, subject only to the limitation of training facilities.

Similar steps are being taken with respect to certain non-permanent active militia units other than infantry.

Training accommodation and instructional staff will obviously be limited in some cases, but the districts are being instructed to assist in improvising training accommodation and augmenting instruction staff as far as that may be found possible.

From the beginning of the war our militia units have been recognized and dealt with as being the backbone of Canada's defence organization and, as is known, the units of the first, second and third and fourth divisions are all being mobilized, based on existing non-permanent active militia units.

The government intends to follow that policy and has been gratified by the response and by the support which has been given by the officers and other ranks of these militia units'.

As has already been stated by the Prime Minister (Mr. Mackenzie King), the government is taking full authority to mobilize the man power of Canada for the defence of Canada. Every ablebodied man in Canada will be given an opportunity of training in the use of arms, so as to come to the defence of the homeland if necessary. The procedure will be that men will in due course be called up for a period of training so as to be prepared for the active defence of this dominion. The training, after due consideration for the requirements of the naval and air forces, will be entrusted to units of the non-permanent active militia which will be recruited voluntarily or filled under the powers of the new legislation according as the facilities for training and accommodation permit.

European War-Enlistments

The length of the period of training will be determined by regulation. Whether this will be for a continuous period of three months or for a lesser time depends: (a) on the advice of the technical officers of the department; (b) on the requirements of industrial and productive man-power as shown by a survey to be immediately undertaken.

The government has received many suggestions with regard to further training of civilians. It feels that enlistment in and cooperation with the non-permanent active militia units across this country will make for simplicity and effective administration and avoid the duplication and confusion of various units under various independent bodies with varying degrees of efficiency due to lack of uniformity in regulations and discipline.

It should be said that anyone who is physically fit and is below the age of forty-five years may and in fact will have not only the opportunity but the obligation to join the militia service of Canada.

The government welcomes suggestions and is at all times ready to consider them, but it believes that citizens will recognize that the responsibility for military direction rests with the federal authorities and their service advisers.

Speaking for the Department of National Defence we feel that all our energies should be first devoted to:

1. The task of recruiting men for service in the Canadian active service force;

2. The immediate training of certain nonpermanent active militia units and home guard reserve:

3. The training of men who will be called

up under the legislation to which the Prime Minister has referred. _

The Department of National Defence is concerned with military matters. Its responsibility is military. The police authorities of this country are concerned with police matters. Their responsibility is restricted to police matters. There is no martial law in Canada, and no need for martial law. Soldiers will continue to be soldiers, and policemen will continue to be policemen. Any attempt to confuse these two functions can have only one result. It will interrupt and impede the most necessary work of the Department of National Defence. .

I make a special appeal to ex-soldiers. Discipline and restraint and patience were amongst the qualities that brought us victory in the last war, and will win it for us in this war. No body of men possessed those qualities in higher degree, or learned the lessons which underlie them more abundantly, than the veterans of the war of 1914. The militia service of

Canada and the enlarged scope which new legislation will bring, will offer plenty of opportunities to those who are anxious to assist in the defence of Canada.

I may say that the opinions which I have expressed and the appeal which I have made are supported and shared by my hon. friend the minister-designate of national defence and all the technical officers of the department.

Now a word with respect to equipment. The plain facts must be stated to the house. The situation has altered within the past few weeks, even days. Our immediate requirements will be infinitely greater; our sources of supply are not the same. We must discard even well-founded and carefully-conceived plans based on the best technical advice that above all uniformity of design and interchangeability were essential. We must now procure what we can, when we can, where we can.

With regard to personal equipment and clothing our own factory production should suffice. It will be continuous. But even here, I must warn the house not to expect perfection. There will be delays on account of these extra demands. The clothing may not all be of such appearance and design as would gratify the heart of a sergeant-major of the household guards. It is intended to provide covering and a moderate degree of comfort for a citizen army being hastily mobilized.

With regard to rifles, the situation is in hand for the moment, but procurement and production must be provided for the future. Here again there will be sure to be complaint. But let me say this. As recently as ten days ago a very large shipment from Canada to overseas of the much criticized Ross rifle was gratefully acknowledged.

With regard to most types of mechanical transport, our automotive industry has responded nobly and we anticipate no difficulty either present or future.

With regard to other armament-guns, machine guns, tanks, instruments-there will be a scarcity for training, on account of the large number of men with whom we shall have to deal. These articles must be produced or procured. I will not say when, how or where, but I will say this. We are fully alive to the abrupt cessation of our anticipated major sources of supply and we are also fully alive to the greatly increased requirements which we have to meet, and we are taking all steps to remedy the situation. In a word, the present situation is a challenge to the initiative, the energy and the intelligence of the Canadian people. We will meet it and overcome it by the goodwill, by the sacrifice, by the discipline and by the united, concerted effort of the whole nation.

Emergency Poicers

Topic:   STATEMENT OF POSITION WITH REGARD TO ENLISTMENTS AND RECRUITING IN CANADA
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S63 PARLIAMENTARY RESTAURANT

LIB

William Lyon Mackenzie King (Prime Minister; Secretary of State for External Affairs; President of the Privy Council)

Liberal

Right Hon. W. L. MACKENZIE KING (Prime Minister) moved:

That a message be sent to the senate to acquaint their honours that Messrs. Black (Yukon), Dupuis, Edwards, Farquhar, Furniss, Goulet, flowden, Jaques, Laflamme, Lafontaine, Maclnnis, McGregor, Mclvor, Mayhew, Pinard, Purdy, Rheaume, Thauvette, Tucker and Tustin, have been appointed to assist His Honour the Speaker in the direction of the restaurant, as far as the interests of the Commons are concerned, and to act as members of a joint committee of both houses on the restaurant.

Topic:   S63 PARLIAMENTARY RESTAURANT
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Motion agreed to.


EMERGENCY POWERS

PROVISION FOR MOBILIZATION OF HUMAN AND MATERIAL RESOURCES IN THE PRESENT WAR

LIB

William Lyon Mackenzie King (Prime Minister; Secretary of State for External Affairs; President of the Privy Council)

Liberal

Right Hon. W. L. MACKENZIE KING (Prime Minister):

I would ask the permission of the house to present a resolution which will enable me to introduce the bill with respect to conferring certain powers upon the governor in council for mobilization of national resources in the present war. If the house would allow me to do so, I should like to move, seconded by Mr. Lapointe (Quebec East):

That it is expedient to introduce a measure to confer special emergency powers upon the governor in council to admit of the mobilization of all the effective resources of the nation, both human and material, for the purpose of the defence and security of Canada during the continuation of the state of war now existing.

His Excellency the Governor General, having been made acquainted with the subject matter of this resolution, recommends it to the consideration of the house.

Most hon. members are aware that the bill which is to be based on this resolution is similar to one passed in the British parliament quite recently. Hon. members may recall that when that bill was passed by the British parliament it received its three readings in the House of Commons and three readings in the House of Lords in one day. This of course placed immediately in the hands of the government the powers desired. I hope that in view of the situation which hon. members are all aware of, a similar practice may perhaps be followed in our parliament to-day.

Topic:   EMERGENCY POWERS
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR MOBILIZATION OF HUMAN AND MATERIAL RESOURCES IN THE PRESENT WAR
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NAT

Richard Burpee Hanson (Leader of the Official Opposition)

National Government

Hon. R. B. HANSON (Leader of the Opposition):

I am quite in agreement about putting it through, but I should like to have a chance to read the bill.

Topic:   EMERGENCY POWERS
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR MOBILIZATION OF HUMAN AND MATERIAL RESOURCES IN THE PRESENT WAR
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LIB

Ernest Lapointe (Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada)

Liberal

Mr. LAPOINTE (Quebec East):

The bill will be printed and distributed at four thirty.

Motion agreed to and the house went into committee, Mr. Yien in the chair.

Topic:   EMERGENCY POWERS
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR MOBILIZATION OF HUMAN AND MATERIAL RESOURCES IN THE PRESENT WAR
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CCF

Thomas Clement (Tommy) Douglas

Co-operative Commonwealth Federation (C.C.F.)

Mr. DOUGLAS (Weyburn):

We could not hear the Prime Minister. Do I understand that he wishes to have just the resolution put through to-day or the resolution and the bill?

Topic:   EMERGENCY POWERS
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR MOBILIZATION OF HUMAN AND MATERIAL RESOURCES IN THE PRESENT WAR
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June 18, 1940