May 29, 1939

LIB

Ernest Lapointe (Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada)

Liberal

Mr. LAPOINTE (Quebec East):

He would have made only one speech, then.

Topic:   SALT FISH BOARD
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR INVESTIGATION OF MARKETING AND ASSISTANCE TO PRODUCERS FOR EXPORT
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LIB

Thomas Alexander Crerar (Minister of Mines and Resources)

Liberal

Mr. CRERAR:

Assistance was given on that road, not for the purpose of developing a highway but for the cheapening of transportation into an important mining area.

Topic:   SALT FISH BOARD
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR INVESTIGATION OF MARKETING AND ASSISTANCE TO PRODUCERS FOR EXPORT
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SC

René-Antoine Pelletier

Social Credit

Mr. PELLETIER:

That is what I wanted to know from the minister. The minister stated some time ago that he made sure this money was expended only when there were important mining areas concerned. Would the minister indicate what important mining areas there are along this proposed route?

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Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR INVESTIGATION OF MARKETING AND ASSISTANCE TO PRODUCERS FOR EXPORT
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LIB

Malcolm McLean

Liberal

Mr. McLEAN (Melfort):

Not alongbeyond.

Topic:   SALT FISH BOARD
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR INVESTIGATION OF MARKETING AND ASSISTANCE TO PRODUCERS FOR EXPORT
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LIB

Thomas Alexander Crerar (Minister of Mines and Resources)

Liberal

Mr. CRERAR:

I am informed that a considerable amount of placer mining is carried on at Germansen Landing. I know it is there because I have talked to the people who are operating it, and who have expressed their appreciation of the assistance the government has given and the useful result it has had in cheapening the cost of transporting their equipment and supplies into this area.

Topic:   SALT FISH BOARD
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR INVESTIGATION OF MARKETING AND ASSISTANCE TO PRODUCERS FOR EXPORT
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SC

René-Antoine Pelletier

Social Credit

Mr. PELLETIER:

Once the proposed trail is developed to such a degree that it is possible to use it in order to help out mining development there, who undertakes the maintenance of the highway?

Topic:   SALT FISH BOARD
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR INVESTIGATION OF MARKETING AND ASSISTANCE TO PRODUCERS FOR EXPORT
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LIB

Thomas Alexander Crerar (Minister of Mines and Resources)

Liberal

Mr. CRERAR:

The provincial government

Topic:   SALT FISH BOARD
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR INVESTIGATION OF MARKETING AND ASSISTANCE TO PRODUCERS FOR EXPORT
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SC

René-Antoine Pelletier

Social Credit

Mr. PELLETIER:

I suppose, then, that in this instance the provincial government has agreed to maintain the highway once it has been built by the federal government?

Topic:   SALT FISH BOARD
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR INVESTIGATION OF MARKETING AND ASSISTANCE TO PRODUCERS FOR EXPORT
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LIB

Thomas Alexander Crerar (Minister of Mines and Resources)

Liberal

Mr. CRERAR:

That is a part of the agreement that we make with every province with respect to the expenditure of this vote.

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Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR INVESTIGATION OF MARKETING AND ASSISTANCE TO PRODUCERS FOR EXPORT
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CON

Henry Herbert Stevens

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. STEVENS:

I have been very much amused at the obvious embarrassment of the minister in discussing this vote.

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Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR INVESTIGATION OF MARKETING AND ASSISTANCE TO PRODUCERS FOR EXPORT
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LIB

Thomas Alexander Crerar (Minister of Mines and Resources)

Liberal

Mr. CRERAR:

Really my hon. friend is assuming a great deal. I may say to him now that I am not in the slightest degree embarrassed by anything the hon. member for Peace River has said, and I do not expect to be embarrassed by anything that is said by the hon. member for Kootenay East.

Topic:   SALT FISH BOARD
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR INVESTIGATION OF MARKETING AND ASSISTANCE TO PRODUCERS FOR EXPORT
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CON

Henry Herbert Stevens

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. STEVENS:

At least I have stirred up the minister-a thing which is not very often done. The long and short of it is, as the minister knows, that while he thinks we should not discuss under this item the Monkman pass route, the road which is being built under this item is looked upon as the alternative route, or is the route which has been started, forced along and assisted by the government, not for mining purposes, but generally'-

Topic:   SALT FISH BOARD
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR INVESTIGATION OF MARKETING AND ASSISTANCE TO PRODUCERS FOR EXPORT
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LIB

Thomas Alexander Crerar (Minister of Mines and Resources)

Liberal

Mr. CRERAR:

My hon. friend is quite mistaken in saying that.

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CON

Henry Herbert Stevens

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. STEVENS:

Just a second.

Topic:   SALT FISH BOARD
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LIB

Thomas Alexander Crerar (Minister of Mines and Resources)

Liberal

Mr. CRERAR:

I insist upon that-

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CON

Henry Herbert Stevens

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. STEVENS:

For a minister of mines who is so extremely' placid in his temperament, the minister shows a little bit of warmth about this matter, and I am afraid that I am putting my finger more or less on the spot.

I am not objecting to the building of this road, but certainly it is not being built primarily for the development of mining, as set forth in this vote, and as very candidly set forth by the minister in the early part of the evening. The idea of giving grants to provincial governments to get trails or roads to mines is a principle we all endorse, provided it stimulates mining output and assists the pioneer developer of mines in getting his property developed. But the mining area at Finlay Forks is a long way from Vanderhoof. If the minister would second the assistance and knowledge of the hon. member for the district, and if he in turn would be thoroughly candid about the matter and tell the committee of the controversy as between the Monkman pass route and this route, we should get pretty near the truth.

I think the vote for this route which is being paid for out of this appropriation ought to be paid for, as assistance to roads in different parts of the country is paid for, as a direct grant for the relief of unemployment. To bring it under this vote is stretching the thing to the limit. I do not know of any vote in the estimates whereunder the Monk-man route can be properly discussed. I do not believe that there is a vote here where we would be any more in order in discussing it than under this vote. The Monkman route from the Peace River section of Alberta into British Columbia is undoubtedly the right one for the opening up of transportation facilities from the Peace river down to the coast; the people of that district have gone ahead and made a road for a considerable distance, over which they have managed to travel; in fact a car came through, with great difficulty, last fall; but the enterprise and

Supply-Mines-Geology

the sacrifice of the people on that route in spending their own money and labour and time upon it deserve recognition. It is a much better and a much shorter route than this one; and personally I regard it as a mistake and as unfair to the committee to designate the appropriation to the Finlay Forks district as an appropriation in the interests of the development of mining, because it is nothing of the kind. True, there is some mining, and some very important mining, in there, particularly at Finlay Forks, which is a long way up; and in the Ingenika some very old silver lead properties, as well as the placer properties the minister has mentioned, have been operated for years.

I am all in favour of rendering assistance in opening up roads over long distances into new territories, but I do not think the committee should be, I will not say misled, but led into the impression that this is strictly devoted to the purpose set forth in the appropriation in the sense in which the minister explained the appropriation in the early part of the evening. We also ought to recognize that these routes are a matter of controversy, and very bitter controversy, in that whole district, and there is a.great deal of resentment and ill feeling in that the government, while able to spend a large sum last year-I should like the minister to tell me the amount, but I will venture the figure of $100,000-upon the road from Vanderhoof to Finlay Forks, has refused any recognition of the magnificent efforts of the settlers on the route from the Peace River country to Fort George. To question this is, to say the least, stretching the credulity of members of this committee to about the breaking point.

Topic:   SALT FISH BOARD
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR INVESTIGATION OF MARKETING AND ASSISTANCE TO PRODUCERS FOR EXPORT
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LIB

James Gray Turgeon

Liberal

Mr. TURGEON:

I would not have said a word on this, in spite of the fact that everything which hon. members are speaking about lies within the confines of my riding, but for the fact that the hon. member for Kootenay East has said some things to the Minister of Mines and Resources which are absolutely untrue.

Topic:   SALT FISH BOARD
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR INVESTIGATION OF MARKETING AND ASSISTANCE TO PRODUCERS FOR EXPORT
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CON

Henry Herbert Stevens

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. STEVENS:

Order.

Topic:   SALT FISH BOARD
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LIB

James Gray Turgeon

Liberal

Mr. TURGEON:

Well, they are untrue

in fact; I do not mean that he meant them to be untrue. In that regard I am not at all surprised that the hon. member for Peace River has a profound lack of knowledge of the situation in northern British Columbia, but I am disappointed that the hon. member for Kootenay East, who sat for a long period as a minister from British Columbia, shows just as deep a lack of knowledge of conditions as does the hon. member for Peace River, who has been here only since the last election.

To begin with, this road which they are now discussing does not commence at Vanderhoof; it commences at Fort St. James. There was a road from Vanderhoof to Fort St. James many years ago.

Topic:   SALT FISH BOARD
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR INVESTIGATION OF MARKETING AND ASSISTANCE TO PRODUCERS FOR EXPORT
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CON

Henry Herbert Stevens

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. STEVENS:

A trail.

Topic:   SALT FISH BOARD
Subtopic:   PROVISION FOR INVESTIGATION OF MARKETING AND ASSISTANCE TO PRODUCERS FOR EXPORT
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May 29, 1939