March 15, 1939

LIB

Malcolm McLean

Liberal

Mr. McLEAN (Melfort):

I said that the hon. member did not want to answer questions. He has asked plenty himself, I might add.

Topic:   UNEMPLOYMENT RELIEF
Subtopic:   UNEMPLOYMENT AND AGRICULTURAL DISTRESS- UNDERTAKINGS IN GENERAL INTEREST AND FINANCIAL ASSISTANCE TO PROVINCES
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CON

Denton Massey

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. MASSEY:

Did I interrupt the minister in his speech?

Topic:   UNEMPLOYMENT RELIEF
Subtopic:   UNEMPLOYMENT AND AGRICULTURAL DISTRESS- UNDERTAKINGS IN GENERAL INTEREST AND FINANCIAL ASSISTANCE TO PROVINCES
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LIB

George Ernest Wood

Liberal

Mr. WOOD:

May I ask a question?

Topic:   UNEMPLOYMENT RELIEF
Subtopic:   UNEMPLOYMENT AND AGRICULTURAL DISTRESS- UNDERTAKINGS IN GENERAL INTEREST AND FINANCIAL ASSISTANCE TO PROVINCES
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CON

Denton Massey

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. MASSEY:

Ask your question, certainly.

Topic:   UNEMPLOYMENT RELIEF
Subtopic:   UNEMPLOYMENT AND AGRICULTURAL DISTRESS- UNDERTAKINGS IN GENERAL INTEREST AND FINANCIAL ASSISTANCE TO PROVINCES
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LIB

George Ernest Wood

Liberal

Mr. WOOD:

If the son goes back to the farm will he not earn his own board on the farm?

Topic:   UNEMPLOYMENT RELIEF
Subtopic:   UNEMPLOYMENT AND AGRICULTURAL DISTRESS- UNDERTAKINGS IN GENERAL INTEREST AND FINANCIAL ASSISTANCE TO PROVINCES
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CON

Denton Massey

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. MASSEY:

I do not mind a question, but I do not want a speech. The hon. member knows what I mean. He knows the point I have in mind. He knows that in his own constituency of Brant there are plenty of sons who went to Paris, Brantford and Toronto

and are now back on the farms, waiting for an opportunity to return to the city. It may be for the moment they are earning their own keep, but they are those who could and would be gainfully employed and at the moment they are unemployed. That is the point. It impressed me that the whole matter is one which the minister was endeavouring to deal with by figures-figures-figures. After all, what is the size of this question in Canada; what is the extent, in figures? Anyone in this house knows that the size of the problem, the breadth of the problem, is the breadth of Canada, and the depth of the problem is the heart of every man, woman and child in this dominion. That is the size of the problem. Why are we worrying about figures? After all, we know that the situation is ghastly. But the government is not dealing with it accordingly.

The minister went on to discuss the question of cooperation with the provinces, the necessity for a change in the legislative approach in regard to the provinces themselves. He referred to the fact that one should seek any amendment to the constitution that we desire by "the open door"- I believe that was his phrase. Why not cooperation? In 1867-and I do not wish to splash about in history-this dominion was bom, under an act known as the British North America Act. For years it progressed, progressed successfully under the spirit of that act. Then, somehow, we began to change our point of view in connection with it. To a new and widespread and ominous extent autonomous powers were assumed by the provinces, which insisted on one of two things, either an amendment to the act or reversion to our original interpretation of it, which meant in turn cooperation. But the minister referred to conflict and friction; conflict and friction, where cooperation might exist. Just as it was possible to gain cooperation, so there might be conflict and friction. Well, may I use a rather ancient platitude, which however seems to apply so well: It takes

two to make a quarrel. If there is no cooperation due to conflict, both the federal government and the provinces are to blame. Then the minister referred further to efficiency and economy, and to responsibility without control, and he gave the house the benefit of his academic background in a most interesting pedantic discussion of the question of dual responsibility, of the right of the dominion, or the possibility of the dominion entering upon a realm now presided over by a province, and usurping authority. As far as the provinces are concerned, in so many

Unemployment and Agricultural Distress

cases it is a question not only of ability to cooperate but of ability to provide. In the meantime, while these various difficult and moot points are being considered and discussed and debated in this house and outside of it, innocent victims to an unknown number are suffering.

I wonder if it would not occur to the minister that in his entire speech this afternoon he failed to bring to the attention of the house a single nation-wide constructive effort in the way of permanent employment.

Topic:   UNEMPLOYMENT RELIEF
Subtopic:   UNEMPLOYMENT AND AGRICULTURAL DISTRESS- UNDERTAKINGS IN GENERAL INTEREST AND FINANCIAL ASSISTANCE TO PROVINCES
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LIB

Paul Joseph James Martin

Liberal

Mr. MARTIN:

The hon. member did not get it.

Topic:   UNEMPLOYMENT RELIEF
Subtopic:   UNEMPLOYMENT AND AGRICULTURAL DISTRESS- UNDERTAKINGS IN GENERAL INTEREST AND FINANCIAL ASSISTANCE TO PROVINCES
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CON

Denton Massey

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. MASSEY:

Well, I should like the hon. member to name one when he replies.

Topic:   UNEMPLOYMENT RELIEF
Subtopic:   UNEMPLOYMENT AND AGRICULTURAL DISTRESS- UNDERTAKINGS IN GENERAL INTEREST AND FINANCIAL ASSISTANCE TO PROVINCES
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LIB

Paul Joseph James Martin

Liberal

Mr. MARTIN:

I certainly will.

Topic:   UNEMPLOYMENT RELIEF
Subtopic:   UNEMPLOYMENT AND AGRICULTURAL DISTRESS- UNDERTAKINGS IN GENERAL INTEREST AND FINANCIAL ASSISTANCE TO PROVINCES
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CON

Denton Massey

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. MASSEY:

It will be interesting. Not a single nation-wide project of a permanent character.

Topic:   UNEMPLOYMENT RELIEF
Subtopic:   UNEMPLOYMENT AND AGRICULTURAL DISTRESS- UNDERTAKINGS IN GENERAL INTEREST AND FINANCIAL ASSISTANCE TO PROVINCES
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LIB

Paul Joseph James Martin

Liberal

Mr. MARTIN:

Can the hon. member name one of a permanent character?

Topic:   UNEMPLOYMENT RELIEF
Subtopic:   UNEMPLOYMENT AND AGRICULTURAL DISTRESS- UNDERTAKINGS IN GENERAL INTEREST AND FINANCIAL ASSISTANCE TO PROVINCES
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CON

Denton Massey

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. MASSEY:

Before I sit down I shall give to the government eleven constructive suggestions.

Topic:   UNEMPLOYMENT RELIEF
Subtopic:   UNEMPLOYMENT AND AGRICULTURAL DISTRESS- UNDERTAKINGS IN GENERAL INTEREST AND FINANCIAL ASSISTANCE TO PROVINCES
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LIB

Paul Joseph James Martin

Liberal

Mr. MARTIN:

Of a permanent character?

Topic:   UNEMPLOYMENT RELIEF
Subtopic:   UNEMPLOYMENT AND AGRICULTURAL DISTRESS- UNDERTAKINGS IN GENERAL INTEREST AND FINANCIAL ASSISTANCE TO PROVINCES
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CON

Denton Massey

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. MASSEY:

Of a permanent character.

Topic:   UNEMPLOYMENT RELIEF
Subtopic:   UNEMPLOYMENT AND AGRICULTURAL DISTRESS- UNDERTAKINGS IN GENERAL INTEREST AND FINANCIAL ASSISTANCE TO PROVINCES
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LIB

Norman McLeod Rogers (Minister of Labour)

Liberal

Mr. ROGERS:

My hon. friend has asked a question, so perhaps he will allow me to answer it. What would he say, for instance, of assistance to mining roads and the mining industry, of national housing, of the home improvement plan, of the Municipal Improvements Assistance Act-and I could detail others?

Topic:   UNEMPLOYMENT RELIEF
Subtopic:   UNEMPLOYMENT AND AGRICULTURAL DISTRESS- UNDERTAKINGS IN GENERAL INTEREST AND FINANCIAL ASSISTANCE TO PROVINCES
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CON

Denton Massey

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. MASSEY:

I expect to deal with them all in detail. But in regard to the statement I have just made, the minister did not suggest any one nation-wide project of a permanent character. By "permanent" I mean the creation of some new-shall I say-economy in regard to a certain part or portion of this dominion which affects all of this dominion.

Topic:   UNEMPLOYMENT RELIEF
Subtopic:   UNEMPLOYMENT AND AGRICULTURAL DISTRESS- UNDERTAKINGS IN GENERAL INTEREST AND FINANCIAL ASSISTANCE TO PROVINCES
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LIB

Leslie Alexander Mutch

Liberal

Mr. MUTCH:

How long is "permanent"?

Topic:   UNEMPLOYMENT RELIEF
Subtopic:   UNEMPLOYMENT AND AGRICULTURAL DISTRESS- UNDERTAKINGS IN GENERAL INTEREST AND FINANCIAL ASSISTANCE TO PROVINCES
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CON

Denton Massey

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. MASSEY:

Not "much" longer -for

some.

I would say that it is very obvious, appallingly obvious, that on what the minister has suggested to-day as the path followed by the present administration, every step taken was a palliative and not a cure; that the problem has been temporized with rather than dealt with at its core. Let me illustrate what I mean. The National Housing Act, the Municipal Improvements Assistance Act, the youth training projects and other such matters were

mentioned by the minister, along with the question of highways and such development as was carried forward in the mining areas, and so forth. I should like to deal briefly with one or two of these matters with which the minister himself has dealt. Let me take first the question of youth training. I fully realize that there is on the order paper a resolution in regard to youth training, on which such a discussion as this should properly be launched. On the other hand the minister himself brought the matter up this afternoon, accordingly I shall assume the right to answer the statement he made.

He objected strongly to a statement-his language was "It has been said by one who ought to know better in regard to twenty-five who were placed under the training plan." I have in my hand a pamphlet entitled, "Training Canada's Young Unemployed." I have read this pamphlet carefully. It is an official publication of the Department of Labour. Reading through the pamphlet, if one omits page 24, it reads like a real estate agent's description of a piece of property he has for sale. It is a most interesting booklet and well prepared, and lays out, may I say, many worthwhile and worthy projects. The plan was operated under a vote of the session before last of SI,000,000. The money was spent on various and sundry projects throughout the dominion. The statement that was made by the hon. gentleman "who ought to know better" was to the effect that of 13,542 young men who were given training in one province, twenty-five found jobs. The minister said 2,500, but in that case he had better re-edit his own pamphlet, because I am reading from it just as the hon. gentleman who made the statement.

Topic:   UNEMPLOYMENT RELIEF
Subtopic:   UNEMPLOYMENT AND AGRICULTURAL DISTRESS- UNDERTAKINGS IN GENERAL INTEREST AND FINANCIAL ASSISTANCE TO PROVINCES
Permalink
LIB

Norman McLeod Rogers (Minister of Labour)

Liberal

Mr. ROGERS:

Oh, no-

Topic:   UNEMPLOYMENT RELIEF
Subtopic:   UNEMPLOYMENT AND AGRICULTURAL DISTRESS- UNDERTAKINGS IN GENERAL INTEREST AND FINANCIAL ASSISTANCE TO PROVINCES
Permalink
CON

Denton Massey

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. MASSEY:

I know what the minister

is going to say. He made his statement allembracing of the result of all the efforts put forth, and I read that same statement and I do now re-read it. There were 13,542 men given training in one province, and according to this pamphlet twenty-five found employment.

Topic:   UNEMPLOYMENT RELIEF
Subtopic:   UNEMPLOYMENT AND AGRICULTURAL DISTRESS- UNDERTAKINGS IN GENERAL INTEREST AND FINANCIAL ASSISTANCE TO PROVINCES
Permalink

March 15, 1939