March 28, 1938

CCF

Thomas Clement (Tommy) Douglas

Co-operative Commonwealth Federation (C.C.F.)

Mr. DOUGLAS (Weyburn):

I do not know what is the minimum.

Topic:   SEED GRAIN
Subtopic:   GUARANTEE OF LOANS FOR PURCHASE OF SEED AND OTHER ASSISTANCE IN SEEDING OPERATIONS IN WESTERN PROVINCES
Permalink
LIB

John Gordon Ross

Liberal

Mr. ROSS (Moose Jaw):

That information has been given half a dozen times.

Topic:   SEED GRAIN
Subtopic:   GUARANTEE OF LOANS FOR PURCHASE OF SEED AND OTHER ASSISTANCE IN SEEDING OPERATIONS IN WESTERN PROVINCES
Permalink
CCF

Thomas Clement (Tommy) Douglas

Co-operative Commonwealth Federation (C.C.F.)

Mr. DOUGLAS (Weyburn):

What is the minimum amount of distillate a man will get?

Topic:   SEED GRAIN
Subtopic:   GUARANTEE OF LOANS FOR PURCHASE OF SEED AND OTHER ASSISTANCE IN SEEDING OPERATIONS IN WESTERN PROVINCES
Permalink
LIB

John Gordon Ross

Liberal

Mr. ROSS (Moose Jaw):

One tractor will use fifty per cent more distillate than another. How is one going to know how much is necessary?

Topic:   SEED GRAIN
Subtopic:   GUARANTEE OF LOANS FOR PURCHASE OF SEED AND OTHER ASSISTANCE IN SEEDING OPERATIONS IN WESTERN PROVINCES
Permalink
CCF

Thomas Clement (Tommy) Douglas

Co-operative Commonwealth Federation (C.C.F.)

Mr. DOUGLAS (Weyburn):

Is the government going to have its inspectors test out all the tractors by driving them?

Topic:   SEED GRAIN
Subtopic:   GUARANTEE OF LOANS FOR PURCHASE OF SEED AND OTHER ASSISTANCE IN SEEDING OPERATIONS IN WESTERN PROVINCES
Permalink
LIB

James Garfield Gardiner (Minister of Agriculture)

Liberal

Mr. GARDINER:

Perhaps I could explain the way in which this is arrived at. It has been known in previous years, and particularly last year, about what the average cost would

be for the whole acreage to be seeded in a municipality, or even in a whole province for that matter. The percentage of the land worked with horses and the percentage worked with tractors are fairly well known to the government authorities in both provinces. They estimate that a certain percentage of the crop will be seeded with tractors which will require a certain amount of fuel. A particular farmer will need so many gallons of gasoline and so much oil because he is farming so many acres with a tractor. But to put that into either a regulation or a law would be placing the provincial governments and the municipalities in a much more difficult position than they would be in otherwise. We know this from experience. I think it is much better to make estimates of what the average cost per acre will be; what is the average requirement for repairs; what will be the average amount of oil and gasoline required to operate a tractor; what will be the average amount of feed and fodder required; I think it is much better to arrive at one's conclusions and to set the limits in that way.

Then we can allow those who are closer for purposes of administration to arrive at decisions as to what ought to be done. I am sure that the hon. member for Weyburn will agree that if it is impossible for a municipal council to make the decision, and make it properly, or impossible for an inspector on the ground, no matter how he may be appointed, to make it, it is impossible for us to do it here. You may criticize the methods of appointment of the inspectors and all that; but if the inspector is capable of checking a quarter section of land, and he walks over it and sees its condition and the equipment that is on it, he is in a much better position to state what the amount ought to be than any hon. member, no matter how familiar he may be with agriculture. The best we can do in connection with these matters is to set the maximum amount which can be used for different purposes; to try to get that maximum as near as we can to the actual requirements, based on experience; then to set up the best checking organization we can get and see that the best inspection system is set up, not by ourselves but by others, for we only check that work; and then try to see that none of the money provided is wasted. When we have done that, I think we have done practically all we can do, and I would hesitate to put my opinion either in the form of a regulation or in legislation of this parliament as to how much gasoline should be used to farm a quarter section of land.

Seed Grain

Topic:   SEED GRAIN
Subtopic:   GUARANTEE OF LOANS FOR PURCHASE OF SEED AND OTHER ASSISTANCE IN SEEDING OPERATIONS IN WESTERN PROVINCES
Permalink
CCF

Thomas Clement (Tommy) Douglas

Co-operative Commonwealth Federation (C.C.F.)

Mr. DOUGLAS (Weyburn):

Did the minister find it unsatisfactory last year when they suggested one gallon and a half of distillate an acre?

Topic:   SEED GRAIN
Subtopic:   GUARANTEE OF LOANS FOR PURCHASE OF SEED AND OTHER ASSISTANCE IN SEEDING OPERATIONS IN WESTERN PROVINCES
Permalink
LIB

James Garfield Gardiner (Minister of Agriculture)

Liberal

Mr. GARDINER:

We have nothing to do with the administration; but passing through Saskatchewan as I did from time to time last summer, I think it was found very difficult in practice, largely because certain individuals take those figures and go out and say, "You did not give this fellow what the law or somebody in the house says he ought to get." That only makes trouble in the administration of the distribution. I would much prefer to check any complaints made afterwards and see that the proper thing is done, if anything improper is done, than for us to do anything now which would make administration more difficult.

Topic:   SEED GRAIN
Subtopic:   GUARANTEE OF LOANS FOR PURCHASE OF SEED AND OTHER ASSISTANCE IN SEEDING OPERATIONS IN WESTERN PROVINCES
Permalink
CCF

Thomas Clement (Tommy) Douglas

Co-operative Commonwealth Federation (C.C.F.)

Mr. DOUGLAS (Weyburn):

I submit that you will have a great deal more trouble in this way if an inspector decides that of two farmers living across the road from each other one shall have a certain amount of fuel or a certain amount for repairs, and the other man something different. You will have far more trouble in that way than in what I am suggesting. I am quite aware that you will have a differentiation in types of soil and in conditions, and hardships might be worked on that account; but there will be a great deal more dissatisfaction and a great deal more quibbling done when you leave the whole matter to the individual judgment of some man who, if he is human, is bound to make mistakes and to have his interests, his influences and his likes interfere with his judgment.

One more question. The minister said this afternoon that feed and fuel would not be deducted from the amount of seed the man could get under the schedule. Does that apply also to repairs?

Topic:   SEED GRAIN
Subtopic:   GUARANTEE OF LOANS FOR PURCHASE OF SEED AND OTHER ASSISTANCE IN SEEDING OPERATIONS IN WESTERN PROVINCES
Permalink
LIB

James Garfield Gardiner (Minister of Agriculture)

Liberal

Mr. GARDINER:

Topic:   SEED GRAIN
Subtopic:   GUARANTEE OF LOANS FOR PURCHASE OF SEED AND OTHER ASSISTANCE IN SEEDING OPERATIONS IN WESTERN PROVINCES
Permalink
CCF

Thomas Clement (Tommy) Douglas

Co-operative Commonwealth Federation (C.C.F.)

Mr. DOUGLAS (Weyburn):

I raise the point only because it has been rife in Saskatchewan that a man would be allowed a maximum of seed for 250 acres, and that if he required repairs, the cost of the repairs would be deducted from the amount of seed he could get.

Topic:   SEED GRAIN
Subtopic:   GUARANTEE OF LOANS FOR PURCHASE OF SEED AND OTHER ASSISTANCE IN SEEDING OPERATIONS IN WESTERN PROVINCES
Permalink
LIB

James Garfield Gardiner (Minister of Agriculture)

Liberal

Mr. GARDINER:

No.

Topic:   SEED GRAIN
Subtopic:   GUARANTEE OF LOANS FOR PURCHASE OF SEED AND OTHER ASSISTANCE IN SEEDING OPERATIONS IN WESTERN PROVINCES
Permalink
CCF

Thomas Clement (Tommy) Douglas

Co-operative Commonwealth Federation (C.C.F.)

Mr. DOUGLAS (Weyburn):

I am glad to hear that.

Topic:   SEED GRAIN
Subtopic:   GUARANTEE OF LOANS FOR PURCHASE OF SEED AND OTHER ASSISTANCE IN SEEDING OPERATIONS IN WESTERN PROVINCES
Permalink
CCF

Major James William Coldwell

Co-operative Commonwealth Federation (C.C.F.)

Mr. COLDWELL:

The definition of repairs is sufficiently wide this year, I take it, to allow of ordinary repairs being made at the local blacksmith's shop.

Topic:   SEED GRAIN
Subtopic:   GUARANTEE OF LOANS FOR PURCHASE OF SEED AND OTHER ASSISTANCE IN SEEDING OPERATIONS IN WESTERN PROVINCES
Permalink
LIB

James Garfield Gardiner (Minister of Agriculture)

Liberal

Mr. GARDINER:

Oh, yes, in actual practice. I might say in reply to what the hon. member for Weyburn has just said, that there is a limit on repairs, but it is only a limit of five per cent of the total credit.

Topic:   SEED GRAIN
Subtopic:   GUARANTEE OF LOANS FOR PURCHASE OF SEED AND OTHER ASSISTANCE IN SEEDING OPERATIONS IN WESTERN PROVINCES
Permalink
CON

Richard Bedford Bennett (Leader of the Official Opposition)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. BENNETT:

The total credit is $200?

Topic:   SEED GRAIN
Subtopic:   GUARANTEE OF LOANS FOR PURCHASE OF SEED AND OTHER ASSISTANCE IN SEEDING OPERATIONS IN WESTERN PROVINCES
Permalink
LIB

James Garfield Gardiner (Minister of Agriculture)

Liberal

Mr. GARDINER:

No; $200 a quarter section.

Topic:   SEED GRAIN
Subtopic:   GUARANTEE OF LOANS FOR PURCHASE OF SEED AND OTHER ASSISTANCE IN SEEDING OPERATIONS IN WESTERN PROVINCES
Permalink
CON

Richard Bedford Bennett (Leader of the Official Opposition)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. BENNETT:

That is what I mean.

Topic:   SEED GRAIN
Subtopic:   GUARANTEE OF LOANS FOR PURCHASE OF SEED AND OTHER ASSISTANCE IN SEEDING OPERATIONS IN WESTERN PROVINCES
Permalink
LIB

James Garfield Gardiner (Minister of Agriculture)

Liberal

Mr. GARDINER:

If a man is farming 320

acres, it is twice that.

Topic:   SEED GRAIN
Subtopic:   GUARANTEE OF LOANS FOR PURCHASE OF SEED AND OTHER ASSISTANCE IN SEEDING OPERATIONS IN WESTERN PROVINCES
Permalink
CON

Richard Bedford Bennett (Leader of the Official Opposition)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. BENNETT:

Suppose he has 250 acres, scattered over six quarter sections; would he get $1,200? That is one of my difficulties.

Topic:   SEED GRAIN
Subtopic:   GUARANTEE OF LOANS FOR PURCHASE OF SEED AND OTHER ASSISTANCE IN SEEDING OPERATIONS IN WESTERN PROVINCES
Permalink

March 28, 1938