March 1, 1938

CON

Norman James Macdonald Lockhart

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. LOCKHART:

I appreciate what the minister has said; nevertheless in some municipalities there are outstanding technical schools some of which are in difficult circumstances; the taxpayers are finding it hard to meet the demands made upon them. The minister will agree that those who engage in this work must be recruited from the young men who are now attending schools. The provincial departments have decreased the grants made to technical schools thereby making technical education a greater burden. I have been advised that the federal department has offered to assist by way of equipment. The point is, however, that the cost per pupil in this type of education is higher, and unless the provincial governments can be persuaded to assist in a greater degree in this type of technical education, I do not see how aviation can be promoted by the technical schools. If young men are to be had for the higher education to be given by the federal government, they must be encouraged in the technical schools, so that they may be drawn therefrom.

Topic:   TRANS-CANADA AIR LINES AUTHORITY FOR EXTENSION BEYOND THE CONFINES OF CANADA
Permalink
CON

Richard Bedford Bennett (Leader of the Official Opposition)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. BENNETT:

What is the paid-up capital?

Topic:   TRANS-CANADA AIR LINES AUTHORITY FOR EXTENSION BEYOND THE CONFINES OF CANADA
Permalink
LIB

Clarence Decatur Howe (Minister of Transport)

Liberal

Mr. HOWE:

The present paid-up capital is, I believe, a million and a quarter.

Topic:   TRANS-CANADA AIR LINES AUTHORITY FOR EXTENSION BEYOND THE CONFINES OF CANADA
Permalink
CON

Denton Massey

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. MASSEY:

Is it the plan to use Canadian pilots on the transatlantic hop, or will that be left entirely to Imperial Airways?

Topic:   TRANS-CANADA AIR LINES AUTHORITY FOR EXTENSION BEYOND THE CONFINES OF CANADA
Permalink
LIB

Clarence Decatur Howe (Minister of Transport)

Liberal

Mr. HOWE:

Under the agreement, Imperial Airways are to do the pioneering work in establishing the route. They are doing it now with Imperial Airways machines and pilots. Later on a company will be formed to take over the work, of which Imperial Airways will control fifty-one per cent. I feel sure that when the time comes they will be prepared to give Canadian pilots an opportunity. Imperial Airways now employ a number of Canadian pilots. While in Bermuda a year ago I learned that two of the pilots sent to that point to operate the Bermuda-New York run were Canadian pilots. I feel sure that Canada will be represented.

Topic:   TRANS-CANADA AIR LINES AUTHORITY FOR EXTENSION BEYOND THE CONFINES OF CANADA
Permalink
CON

Denton Massey

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. MASSEY:

Are we training our pilots for Trans-Canada Air Lines only in land ships or for the piloting of boats as well?

Topic:   TRANS-CANADA AIR LINES AUTHORITY FOR EXTENSION BEYOND THE CONFINES OF CANADA
Permalink
LIB

Clarence Decatur Howe (Minister of Transport)

Liberal

Mr. HOWE:

The present training is entirely with land ships.

Topic:   TRANS-CANADA AIR LINES AUTHORITY FOR EXTENSION BEYOND THE CONFINES OF CANADA
Permalink
CON

Denton Massey

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. MASSEY:

At what stage of the development of a pilot is he eligible to enter the school at Winnipeg? What previous training must he have had or how many hours in the air?

Topic:   TRANS-CANADA AIR LINES AUTHORITY FOR EXTENSION BEYOND THE CONFINES OF CANADA
Permalink
LIB

Clarence Decatur Howe (Minister of Transport)

Liberal

Mr. HOWE:

He must have a university education, at least a thousand hours of actual transport flying to his credit and a record in transport flying that is more or less outstanding.

Topic:   TRANS-CANADA AIR LINES AUTHORITY FOR EXTENSION BEYOND THE CONFINES OF CANADA
Permalink
CON

Denton Massey

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. MASSEY:

In other words the course being given in Winnipeg is essentially a post graduate course.

Topic:   TRANS-CANADA AIR LINES AUTHORITY FOR EXTENSION BEYOND THE CONFINES OF CANADA
Permalink
LIB

Clarence Decatur Howe (Minister of Transport)

Liberal

Mr. HOWE:

Yes.

Topic:   TRANS-CANADA AIR LINES AUTHORITY FOR EXTENSION BEYOND THE CONFINES OF CANADA
Permalink
CON

Denton Massey

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. MASSEY:

Is it in the mind of the minister that, as suggested by the hon. member for Lincoln, we should attempt to develop a type of pilot who would be able to engage not only in the type of flying we have in Canada to-day, but also in transport flying such as is planned for the Trans-Canada Air Lines, so that we may give the incentive to young men to secure the necessary technical training and ground-work, and also provide facilities for them to learn to fly from the very beginning? I think it is recognized that the flying clubs throughout the dominion have been doing a very good work. It will be noticed in the estimates that some of them have been receiving small grants from the government, but many of them have been carrying on under conditions which are far from favourable, and in some cases the clubs have been forced to discontinue their activities. The work of these flying clubs has been to develop men as pilots, ultimately to become air lines pilots. I believe more substantial aid should be given to these flying clubs by the government. Perhaps an instructor could be loaned for certain periods to give the flying club members instruction, not only in flying ships from airport to airport without the aid of a beam, but in all the various phases of flying which are so important.

Topic:   TRANS-CANADA AIR LINES AUTHORITY FOR EXTENSION BEYOND THE CONFINES OF CANADA
Permalink
LIB

Clarence Decatur Howe (Minister of Transport)

Liberal

Mr. HOWE:

I must take issue with the statement of my hon. friend that a good many of these clubs have ceased to operate.

Topic:   TRANS-CANADA AIR LINES AUTHORITY FOR EXTENSION BEYOND THE CONFINES OF CANADA
Permalink
CON

Denton Massey

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. MASSEY:

I said some, not a good many.

Topic:   TRANS-CANADA AIR LINES AUTHORITY FOR EXTENSION BEYOND THE CONFINES OF CANADA
Permalink
LIB

Clarence Decatur Howe (Minister of Transport)

Liberal

Mr. HOWE:

The total number of clubs in operation to-day is twenty-six. Two clubs died in the initial stages, having been established in communities which were too small to supply the necessary talent. I believe the clubs are now on a firm financial basis. It was never the intention that these clubs

Trans-Canada Air Lines

should be money-makers although some of them in the larger centres are doing quite well financially. The government gives some aid, perhaps sufficient for the work that they are doing. These clubs and my department are discussing the extension of work along the lines I indicated previously, that is, giving a more advanced training. If something feasible or practicable can be worked out it is possible that the clubs may qualify for more aid from the government.

Topic:   TRANS-CANADA AIR LINES AUTHORITY FOR EXTENSION BEYOND THE CONFINES OF CANADA
Permalink
LIB

Ralph Maybank

Liberal

Mr. MAYBANK:

Reference has been made to the personnel of these air lines, and I should like to have some assurance from the minister as to the nationality of those to be employed. Perhaps because of the necessity of the work, certain men have been brought in from the United States. There has been some criticism of this, perhaps unjustly. We have a very good flying school in Winnipeg, and the question has been raised whether steps will be taken to have a Canadian personnel. I am sure the minister will agree that we should give employment to our own people to the exclusion of all others. Has a definite policy been laid down for the employment of Canadians?

Topic:   TRANS-CANADA AIR LINES AUTHORITY FOR EXTENSION BEYOND THE CONFINES OF CANADA
Permalink
LIB

Clarence Decatur Howe (Minister of Transport)

Liberal

Mr. HOWE:

The present .personnel is approximately ninety-one trained men. There are two Americans employed in Seattle in connection with the American end of the operations between Vancouver and Seattle.

I believe these are only booking clerks. Of the remaining personnel in Canada, all are Canadians with the exception of five. One of the five is the vice-president in charge of operations. He was brought here because we were advised that he was the man most capable of establishing this enterprise on a firm foundation. He has had perhaps a finer and longer record in air transportation than any other man on this continent. He was brought here on the understanding that he would devote two years to the work. When it was decided to train our pilots in Canada, four other men were brought in from the United States to give technical assistance. Each one of the four is outstanding in the particular line for which he is responsible. The four are here on a six month's basis, and will be kept as long as their services are needed as training personnel. Their duties are temporary and will be terminated when we think we can get on without them.

Topic:   TRANS-CANADA AIR LINES AUTHORITY FOR EXTENSION BEYOND THE CONFINES OF CANADA
Permalink
LIB

Ralph Maybank

Liberal

Mr. MAYBANK:

Are the two men employed in Seattle because the service is an international one? When our railroads run through United States territory a certain

number of employees must be citizens of that country. Is this employment due to the United States immigration laws?

Topic:   TRANS-CANADA AIR LINES AUTHORITY FOR EXTENSION BEYOND THE CONFINES OF CANADA
Permalink
LIB

Clarence Decatur Howe (Minister of Transport)

Liberal

Mr. HOWE:

The men employed in Seattle are not pilots. They are only minor employees, clerks who sell tickets, and they receive around $100 a month.

Topic:   TRANS-CANADA AIR LINES AUTHORITY FOR EXTENSION BEYOND THE CONFINES OF CANADA
Permalink
LIB

Samuel Factor

Liberal

Mr. FACTOR:

The minister will recall that he had a conference with the board of control of the city of Toronto at which representations were made for the establishment of a training school in that city. There are in the vicinity of Toronto two of the finest airports on the continent, and I should like to know whether the minister has taken into consideration this matter of a flying school.

Topic:   TRANS-CANADA AIR LINES AUTHORITY FOR EXTENSION BEYOND THE CONFINES OF CANADA
Permalink

March 1, 1938