February 5, 1937

CCF

Abraham Albert Heaps

Co-operative Commonwealth Federation (C.C.F.)

Mr. HEAPS:

That is the average amount which is being granted. What I am asking is the amount of money that has been applied for and the amount that has been granted.

Topic:   HOME IMPROVEMENT LOANS
Subtopic:   PROVISION TO ENCOURAGE REPAIR OF RURAL AND URBAN DWELLINGS
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LIB

Charles Avery Dunning (Minister of Finance and Receiver General)

Liberal

Mr. DUNNING:

I cannot give the amount that has been applied for. The only return to the department is with respect to applications for guarantee, and any applications which have been refused of course do not appear in connection with applications for guarantee.

Topic:   HOME IMPROVEMENT LOANS
Subtopic:   PROVISION TO ENCOURAGE REPAIR OF RURAL AND URBAN DWELLINGS
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CCF

Abraham Albert Heaps

Co-operative Commonwealth Federation (C.C.F.)

Mr. HEAPS:

Could the minister inform the committee what this rate of interest, three and one-quarter per cent discount on a loan repaid in monthly instalments, really amounts to?

Topic:   HOME IMPROVEMENT LOANS
Subtopic:   PROVISION TO ENCOURAGE REPAIR OF RURAL AND URBAN DWELLINGS
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CON

Richard Bedford Bennett (Leader of the Official Opposition)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. BENNETT:

It is 6-32 per cent.

Topic:   HOME IMPROVEMENT LOANS
Subtopic:   PROVISION TO ENCOURAGE REPAIR OF RURAL AND URBAN DWELLINGS
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LIB

Charles Avery Dunning (Minister of Finance and Receiver General)

Liberal

Mr. DUNNING:

The other day I arranged to supply every hon. member with copies of the literature on the subject, in which we have been careful to publish complete tables for the guidance of borrowers. The actual ; Elective simple interest rate equivalent to

JVlr. Heaps.]

3{ per cent discount for a loan for a year would be 6-32-or 6-23. one or the other. In actual practice, of course, the borrower of $100 receives, instead of $100, the sum of $96.75. He pays back the flat sum of $100, distributed over the period of his loan. That is, he pays $3.25 for the use of $96.75 for a year, but he pays it in advance.

Topic:   HOME IMPROVEMENT LOANS
Subtopic:   PROVISION TO ENCOURAGE REPAIR OF RURAL AND URBAN DWELLINGS
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CON

Charles Hazlitt Cahan

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. CAHAN:

Could the minister anticipate the time when he will move amendments and allow us to see a draft of the proposed amendments? None have been published as yet in the votes and proceedings.

Topic:   HOME IMPROVEMENT LOANS
Subtopic:   PROVISION TO ENCOURAGE REPAIR OF RURAL AND URBAN DWELLINGS
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LIB

Charles Avery Dunning (Minister of Finance and Receiver General)

Liberal

Mr. DUNNING:

I shall be glad to do that.

Topic:   HOME IMPROVEMENT LOANS
Subtopic:   PROVISION TO ENCOURAGE REPAIR OF RURAL AND URBAN DWELLINGS
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CON

Charles Hazlitt Cahan

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. CAHAN:

In matters of this kind one would like to have a certain time to consider these amendments.

Topic:   HOME IMPROVEMENT LOANS
Subtopic:   PROVISION TO ENCOURAGE REPAIR OF RURAL AND URBAN DWELLINGS
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CON

Howard Charles Green

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. GREEN:

Will the minister say what is meant by "long term lease"? I think in the different provinces a long term lease would be defined in different ways, and there does not seem to be anything in the bill to indicate just what is meant by that expression.

Topic:   HOME IMPROVEMENT LOANS
Subtopic:   PROVISION TO ENCOURAGE REPAIR OF RURAL AND URBAN DWELLINGS
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LIB

Charles Avery Dunning (Minister of Finance and Receiver General)

Liberal

Mr. DUNNING:

That question raises one of the difficulties of trying to qualify the term "owner" in connection with legislation of this kind which does not involve any security being taken on the property by the lender. My hon. friend will understand that if we limited "owner" to the literal meaning of the term "ownership" it would debar a great many people in various sections of the country where the long term lease method of holding property is in force. From the point of view of the present measure it is practically effectual ownership that is meant. At any rate such a long term lease certainly should not disqualify a person occupying a dwelling from what we intend to accomplish. That is why the words "long term lease" have been used. As a matter of fact we are thinking of widening it a little more; we are proposing to add the term "life tenants," because from the point of view of this legislation a life tenant ought to have just as much right to go to the bank and get a loan with which to improve the property of which he is the tenant. Then, in order to be sure that we are not debarring any class of person who ought to qualify, we are proposing to add at the end of (i) the words "and any persons having rights approximating ownership." This question arose in a case involving what in the west we used to call squatter's rights. The person concerned had occupied his dwelling for a long time. There was no title other than that which might obtain under

Home Improvement Loans

squatter's rights, but it was a reasonably substantial home for a working class family. Why should not such a man get a loan if he is able to convince the bank that he can repay it? Why should he be denied the opportunity because he was not the actual owner, or had not a lease?

Topic:   HOME IMPROVEMENT LOANS
Subtopic:   PROVISION TO ENCOURAGE REPAIR OF RURAL AND URBAN DWELLINGS
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CON

Richard Bedford Bennett (Leader of the Official Opposition)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. BENNETT:

He was not the registered owner.

Topic:   HOME IMPROVEMENT LOANS
Subtopic:   PROVISION TO ENCOURAGE REPAIR OF RURAL AND URBAN DWELLINGS
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LIB

Charles Avery Dunning (Minister of Finance and Receiver General)

Liberal

Mr. DUNNING:

But he had something

at least approximating ownership, from the point of view of the administration of this act.

Topic:   HOME IMPROVEMENT LOANS
Subtopic:   PROVISION TO ENCOURAGE REPAIR OF RURAL AND URBAN DWELLINGS
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CON

Howard Charles Green

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. GREEN:

Would the minister say

that a loan could be obtained by a person who had a five year lease?

Topic:   HOME IMPROVEMENT LOANS
Subtopic:   PROVISION TO ENCOURAGE REPAIR OF RURAL AND URBAN DWELLINGS
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LIB

Charles Avery Dunning (Minister of Finance and Receiver General)

Liberal

Mr. DUNNING:

No.

Topic:   HOME IMPROVEMENT LOANS
Subtopic:   PROVISION TO ENCOURAGE REPAIR OF RURAL AND URBAN DWELLINGS
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CON

Howard Charles Green

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. GREEN:

That would be a period

two years in excess of the maximum time within which a loan has to be repaid.

Topic:   HOME IMPROVEMENT LOANS
Subtopic:   PROVISION TO ENCOURAGE REPAIR OF RURAL AND URBAN DWELLINGS
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LIB

Charles Avery Dunning (Minister of Finance and Receiver General)

Liberal

Mr. DUNNING:

The ruling we have

already given in the department is this: the owner of such dwelling, for the purposes of the home improvement plan, includes the lessee of such property provided that the lease does not expire until three years after the date on which the last instalment of the loan is required to be paid. That is the regulation at present.

Topic:   HOME IMPROVEMENT LOANS
Subtopic:   PROVISION TO ENCOURAGE REPAIR OF RURAL AND URBAN DWELLINGS
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CON

John Ritchie MacNicol

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. MacNICOL:

Before the section

carries I would appreciate it if the minister would give me a little information with regard to subsection (a). Do I understand that if a large house is to be turned into a four family dwelling the loan that will be allowed for that improvement will be $1,000 for each family unit plus an additional $1,000, or $5,000 in all?

Topic:   HOME IMPROVEMENT LOANS
Subtopic:   PROVISION TO ENCOURAGE REPAIR OF RURAL AND URBAN DWELLINGS
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LIB

Charles Avery Dunning (Minister of Finance and Receiver General)

Liberal

Mr. DUNNING:

Yes, that is the maximum in such a case.

Topic:   HOME IMPROVEMENT LOANS
Subtopic:   PROVISION TO ENCOURAGE REPAIR OF RURAL AND URBAN DWELLINGS
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LIB

Walter Adam Tucker

Liberal

Mr. TUCKER:

With regard to subsection (f), do I understand it to be the intention that there shall be no guarantee in any case where the bank takes security? If that is the intention of this legislation I submit that this subsection should be worded differently. It reads:

No security by way of endorsement or otherwise shall be required.

If the bank should take a more or less doubtful attitude with regard to a loan; the applicant might produce an endorser and offer his endorsement to the bank, the bank could then say they had not required the endorsement but it was offered to them, and the bank could claim the protection of the act. If it is the intention of the government

that the bank shall not be able to claim a guarantee under the act in such a case I suggest that the clause should read:

No security by way of endorsement or otherwise shall be taken.

Topic:   HOME IMPROVEMENT LOANS
Subtopic:   PROVISION TO ENCOURAGE REPAIR OF RURAL AND URBAN DWELLINGS
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LIB

Charles Avery Dunning (Minister of Finance and Receiver General)

Liberal

Mr. DUNNING:

Certainly if such a loan were taken with security it would not qualify for the guarantee. As to the use of words, I do not like to dispute with my legal friends as to whether "taken" or "required" is better. Pesonally I have no objection to my hon. friend's suggestion. A point has been raised, however, on which I should like to have the view of the committee. We have been considering the addition of the words "so long as the borrower is not in default."

Topic:   HOME IMPROVEMENT LOANS
Subtopic:   PROVISION TO ENCOURAGE REPAIR OF RURAL AND URBAN DWELLINGS
Permalink

February 5, 1937