May 28, 1935

CON

Richard Burpee Hanson (Minister of Trade and Commerce)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. HANSON (York-Sunbury):

Yes, that is important, as it involves a penalty for short weights.

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LIB

James Layton Ralston

Liberal

Mr. RALSTON:

As I understand it the

minister is delegating to the governor in council the power to impose penalties for the breach of any regulation, without any limit as to the maximum or minimum of those penalties.

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CON

Richard Burpee Hanson (Minister of Trade and Commerce)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. HANSON (York-Sunbury):

That is

a suggestion.

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LIB

James Layton Ralston

Liberal

Mr. RALSTON:

What does the minister

think about the decision of the United States Supreme Court in connection with the matter of delegation? ?

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CON

Richard Burpee Hanson (Minister of Trade and Commerce)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. HANSON (York-Sunbury):

I would

rather not discuss it. That is a very live question at the moment, and I should not like to give an opinion. I have not seen the decision.

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LIB

James Layton Ralston

Liberal

Mr. RALSTON:

I submit seriously that

this parliament ought at least in some way to limit the penalties which may be imposed, or, to put it the other way, provide a maximum and minimum.

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CON

Richard Burpee Hanson (Minister of Trade and Commerce)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. HANSON (York-Sunbury):

I have

an open mind on the matter. I would say to the hon. member that had it not been for the suggestion of the Department of Justice I would have done it in another way. I had in mind the passing of a special section

Patents of Invention

dealing with the contravention of any provision of the act for which no penalty is otherwise provided. If it is the view of the committee that that should be adopted, I would be agreeable.

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LIB
CON

Richard Burpee Hanson (Minister of Trade and Commerce)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. HANSON (York-Sunbury):

Yes, act

or regulation. If it is thought that the matter should not be left to the governor in council I should be glad to take that into consideration. Personally I am not desirous of having it done, but as I said a moment ago the suggestion -was made by the Department of Justice. I am quite agreeable to having a clause in the act providing that for the contravention of any provision of the act or regulation thereunder for which no special penalty is provided there should be a fine not exceeding $25 for the first offence and not less than $25 or more than $100 for any subsequent offence. I am in the hands of the committee.

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LIB

James Layton Ralston

Liberal

Mr. RALSTON:

As a member of the committee and with all due respect to the Department of Justice I would certainly concur in the minister's suggestion. While in some cases it may be the practice to give carte blanche to the governor in council to impose penalties, I believe the much better way is for parliament itself to provide penalties for the infraction of any regulation or statute.

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CON

Richard Burpee Hanson (Minister of Trade and Commerce)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. HANSON (York-Sunbury):

I shall

be glad to accept the suggestion. I will ask leave, with the unanimous consent of the committee, to withdraw the amendment now proposed) and' to submit the following as section 81 (a) which I shall move, when we come to the end of the bill.

Any person who acts in contravention of any provision of this act or regulation thereunder for which no special penalty is provided shall be liable to a fine not exceeding $25 for the first offence and a fine of not less than $25 and not more than $100 for any subsequent offence.

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LIB
CON

Richard Burpee Hanson (Minister of Trade and Commerce)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. HANSON (York-Sunbury):

Yes.

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LIB

James Layton Ralston

Liberal

Mr. RALSTON:

I would use the word

"express" instead of the word "special," or have it read, "for which no penalty is expressly provided."

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CON

Richard Burpee Hanson (Minister of Trade and Commerce)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. HANSON (York-Sunbury):

The expression I have read is the one which the departmental officers suggested to the Depart-

roent of Justice. I give notice now that at the conclusion of the bill I will move that as an amendment. In the meantime I would ask that the other be withdrawn.

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LIB

James Lorimer Ilsley

Liberal

Mr. ILSLEY:

May I point out that section 82 contemplates the imposition of penalties by regulation, and with the new amendment proposed an amendment will be required to section 82.

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CON

Richard Burpee Hanson (Minister of Trade and Commerce)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. HANSON (York-Sunbury):

Section

82 deals with procedure entirely. We are making an express provision with respect to contravention of the act or of any regulations not provided for.

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LIB

James Lorimer Ilsley

Liberal

Mr. ILSLEY:

But section 82 contemplates the imposition of penalties by regulation, which we are now abandoning.

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LIB

Olof Hanson

Liberal

Mr. HANSON (York-lSunbury):

I am not

so sure about that. I do not think it does. That is my immediate reaction, but I would have to study it.

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LIB

James Lorimer Ilsley

Liberal

Mr. ILSLEY:

It says: "All penalties

imposed by this act or by any regulation."

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May 28, 1935