June 13, 1934

LIB

William Duff

Liberal

Mr. DUFF:

Before we proceed any further with this bill I again appeal to the government not to place myself and some other members in this position. We are dealing with one of the most important bills introduced this session, one which I know very little about and for which I do not intend to take any responsibility in .the way of accepting either the definitions, the clauses or anything else. I feel that I am not qualified as a member of this house to deal properly with this bill. I do not feel that I can move any amendments to the definitions or the clauses or the schedules without consulting people who know a great deal more about these matters than I do. Consequently if the Minister of Marine (Mr. Duranleau) and the government intend to proceed with this bill, as far as I am concerned I make this protest here and now. If they want to go ahead and carry the definitions or the sections or the schedules let them go ahead on their own responsibility.

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LIB

Subsection agreed to. Subsections 7 to 12 inclusive agreed to. On subsection 13-Coast of Canada.


LIB

Thomas Reid

Liberal

Mr. REID:

I would probably adopt the

same attitude as some hon. members on this side of the house were it not for the fact that I know how difficult it is once a bill is passed to have it reopened and amended. Therefore under the circumstances I cannot allow the bill to pass without endeavouring

to have some changes made that I think should be made. I have an amendment to move to subsection 13.

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CON

Alfred Duranleau (Minister of Fisheries; Minister of Marine)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. DURANLEAU:

Will my hon. friend

permit me to interrupt?

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LIB
CON

Alfred Duranleau (Minister of Fisheries; Minister of Marine)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. DURANLEAU:

I stated yesterday

and I repeat that in my estimation there are not many sections which will prove controversial. I think my hon. friends will agree with me on that when they have read the whole bill. I told my hon. friend that any section that he wished should stand in order to have time to study it and make suggestions I am perfectly willing to let stand. With reference to those that concern the fishermen for instance. I told my hon. friend yesterday that I did not think anything in the bill was hurtful to the fishermen or to men engaged in the fishing industry. My hon. friend said I was wrong. I may be wrong but I say this, that by this bill we do not intend to injure in any way the fishermen or the people engaged in the fishing industry. I am willing to let all the sections which may affect them stand for the moment.

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IND
CON

Alfred Duranleau (Minister of Fisheries; Minister of Marine)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. DURANLEAU:

Oh well, until Monday or Tuesday of next week.

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IND
CON

Alfred Duranleau (Minister of Fisheries; Minister of Marine)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. DURANLEAU:

That will be ample time to study this question.

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IND
CON

Alfred Duranleau (Minister of Fisheries; Minister of Marine)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. DURANLEAU:

I do not think my hon. friend needs word from the Pacific coast, he knows these subjects perfectly well. We do not want to injure the fishermen in any shape or form. We are prepared to accept any reasonable amendment suggested by mj hon. friends.

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CON

Richard Bedford Bennett (Prime Minister; President of the Privy Council; Secretary of State for External Affairs)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. BENNETT:

What is the suggestion about subsection 13?

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LIB

William Duff

Liberal

Mr. DUFF:

The minister is very good to say that he is willing to do anything to help to amend this bill in any way which may be beneficial. He also said there were very few controversial clauses. I am sorry I cannot agree with that; there are a great many controversial clauses. Not only are there controversial clauses which I can see and Which the minister can see and which other hon. members of this committee can see, but what I am afraid of is that I have not sufficient knowledge of my own to deal here with any clauses in this bill. I feel

Canada Shipping Act

that before this bill is considered in this committee we should have the views of people who are vitally interested, both on t'he Pacific coast and the Atlantic coast and the great lakes. There is my difficulty. I say to the minister that I am not going to take any responsibility for allowing any clauses to pass, because as I said I have not sufficient knowledge to say whether they are right and proper or not.

While I am on my feet let me say that since last night I have endeavoured to Btudy a few more pages of this bill, turning from the definitions to the clauses and then to the schedules. In twenty-four hours I have read twenty-five more pages. I am now at page 99. The minister says he is willing to give us a couple of days more. I say that is not long enough. As far as I have gone in these definitions I find twenty-two objections in the definitions alone. Though I have found twenty-two objections in the 113 definitions I am afraid that I may not have found all of them. There are other people in this country who are vitally interested and who, if they had a chance to study this bill, instead of the twenty changes I have in mind might find forty. Take subsection 38 of this section. Does the minister know that a man cannot go to Hudson bay because of that subsection?

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LIB
LIB

William Duff

Liberal

Mr. DUFF:

The subsection reads:

"Home-trade voyage" means a voyage not being an inland or minor waters voyage between places nothin the area following, to wit:-Canada, the United States of America, the territory of Alaska not west of Cape Spencer, Newfoundland, Labrador, St. Pierre and Miquelon, in the course of' which a ship does not go north of the 60th parallel of north latitude or south of the 36th parallel of north latitude.

Let me ask the Minister of Marine if he knows where the 60th north parallel is. As the minister knows, a parallel is like a half moon; at one end you can go to Greenland, but you cannot get past Cape Chidley into Hudson bay.

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CON

John Franklin White

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. AVHITE (London):

I should like to

ask the hon. member a question. Is he now in favour of the Hudson bay route?

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LIB

William Duff

Liberal

Mr. DUFF:

I was never in favour of the Hudson bay route, so far as building the railway was concerned. Every day I live I am more opposed to it, and I think more people are coming to believe that it never should have been built in the first place, and that we should not have spent $50,000,000 of

the money of the people of Canada on it. But so far as the Hudson bay route is concerned my hon. friend and I are in the same position; he voted and I voted money for that purpose. Each of us was foolish, if I may be allowed to include him in the same category with myself.

I have these ninety-nine pages littered with my memoranda. My hon. friend from New Westminster (Mr. Reid) is worried about this matter; no doubt he would like to move some amendments, as it is his duty to do. I am afraid that if the minister should adopt some suggestions of mine they may interfere with some of the other clauses in this bill or some of the definitions. Let me go a little further with regard to the sections I have read in the ninety-nine pages I have covered; let me count up and see how many I think are not right and should be amended.

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?

An hon. MEMBER:

Dispense.

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June 13, 1934