May 3, 1926

CON

Isaac Duncan MacDougall

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. MAODOUGALL:

May I ask the hon. gentleman this question: If a commission investigating, for example, the coal industry in Nova Scotia should report back that the thing needed is increased protection, would the hon. gentleman be prepared to support that recommendation?

Mr. MGTGjEPEN: Hear, hear.

Topic:   THE BUDGET
Subtopic:   CONTINUATION OF DEBATE ON THE ANNUAL
Sub-subtopic:   FINANCIAL STATEMENT OF THE MINISTER OF FINANCE
Permalink
LIB

Charles Edward Bothwell

Liberal

Mr. BOTHWELL:

I would not want to

answer that question just in the bald way m which it was put, but I would say this: So far as we in the west are concerned the protection on coal that is asked for by the Besco Bulletin will not affect us. There is no reason that I can see why I would not support protection of that kind if it was going to benefit the Maritimes.

Topic:   THE BUDGET
Subtopic:   CONTINUATION OF DEBATE ON THE ANNUAL
Sub-subtopic:   FINANCIAL STATEMENT OF THE MINISTER OF FINANCE
Permalink
CON

Arthur Meighen (Leader of the Official Opposition)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. MEIGHEN:

Hear, hear. Will the hon. gentleman permit another question? He said he would support the finding of the commission as respects Maritime railway rates. He also said that the matter was before two commissions. If the two commissions report differently, which one will he support?

Topic:   THE BUDGET
Subtopic:   CONTINUATION OF DEBATE ON THE ANNUAL
Sub-subtopic:   FINANCIAL STATEMENT OF THE MINISTER OF FINANCE
Permalink
LIB

Charles Edward Bothwell

Liberal

Mr. BOTHWELL:

If my information is correct, the Board of Railway Commissioners are studying the question of freight rates. That will be a matter, as I understand it, of finding out whether the rates should be lowered or increased. That is the purpose so far as the railways are concerned. The other commission appointed to inquire into Maritime rights will be supposed to bring in some recommendation that will provide a solution of the difficulties in the Maritimes.

Topic:   THE BUDGET
Subtopic:   CONTINUATION OF DEBATE ON THE ANNUAL
Sub-subtopic:   FINANCIAL STATEMENT OF THE MINISTER OF FINANCE
Permalink
CON

Arthur Meighen (Leader of the Official Opposition)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. MEIGHEN:

Including railway rates. Now, I ask the hon. gentleman this question: If they differ in their reports, which one will he support?

Topic:   THE BUDGET
Subtopic:   CONTINUATION OF DEBATE ON THE ANNUAL
Sub-subtopic:   FINANCIAL STATEMENT OF THE MINISTER OF FINANCE
Permalink
LIB

Charles Edward Bothwell

Liberal

Mr. BOTHWELL:

I think my right hon. friend is a lawyer. He must know that I am not able to say, before reading the report, which one I should be prepared to follow. You cannot come to a conclusion until you have before you the facts to base a conclusion upon.

Topic:   THE BUDGET
Subtopic:   CONTINUATION OF DEBATE ON THE ANNUAL
Sub-subtopic:   FINANCIAL STATEMENT OF THE MINISTER OF FINANCE
Permalink
CON

Arthur Meighen (Leader of the Official Opposition)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. MEIGHEN:

The hon. member told us he would follow the commission. I just wanted to know which one he referred to.

Topic:   THE BUDGET
Subtopic:   CONTINUATION OF DEBATE ON THE ANNUAL
Sub-subtopic:   FINANCIAL STATEMENT OF THE MINISTER OF FINANCE
Permalink
LIB

Charles Edward Bothwell

Liberal

Mr. BOTHWELL:

I think the right hon. gentleman is mistaken when he states I said I would follow the commission.

Topic:   THE BUDGET
Subtopic:   CONTINUATION OF DEBATE ON THE ANNUAL
Sub-subtopic:   FINANCIAL STATEMENT OF THE MINISTER OF FINANCE
Permalink
CON

Arthur Meighen (Leader of the Official Opposition)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. MEIGHEN:

On railway rates, yes.

Topic:   THE BUDGET
Subtopic:   CONTINUATION OF DEBATE ON THE ANNUAL
Sub-subtopic:   FINANCIAL STATEMENT OF THE MINISTER OF FINANCE
Permalink
LIB

Charles Edward Bothwell

Liberal

Mr. BOTHWELL:

I stated-at least I intended so to state-and if I made a misstatement I will correct it now-that when that commission brings in a report-

Topic:   THE BUDGET
Subtopic:   CONTINUATION OF DEBATE ON THE ANNUAL
Sub-subtopic:   FINANCIAL STATEMENT OF THE MINISTER OF FINANCE
Permalink
CON

Arthur Meighen (Leader of the Official Opposition)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. MEIGHEN:

Which one?

Topic:   THE BUDGET
Subtopic:   CONTINUATION OF DEBATE ON THE ANNUAL
Sub-subtopic:   FINANCIAL STATEMENT OF THE MINISTER OF FINANCE
Permalink
LIB

Charles Edward Bothwell

Liberal

Mr. BOTHWELL:

Either one-any commission which will give us a statement as to what should be done in older to remedy the conditions in the Maritimes-I believe the members from western Canada will be prepared to support legislation that will be in the interests of the Maritimes as shown by the report.

M;r. MEIGHEN: That is not the question.

Topic:   THE BUDGET
Subtopic:   CONTINUATION OF DEBATE ON THE ANNUAL
Sub-subtopic:   FINANCIAL STATEMENT OF THE MINISTER OF FINANCE
Permalink
LIB

Charles Edward Bothwell

Liberal

Mr. BOTHWELL:

In addition to the eoial industry there is the iron and steel industry in the Maritime provinces, and in this connection I have been much interested in reading the publication known as the Besco Bulletin. I have endeavoured by a study of that publication to find out, to some extent, what the trouble is in the Maritimes. I find from the issue of April 24th that they have four serious disappointments in the budget. They are as follows:

No. 1. Failure to adjust the specific duties on the basic forms of iron and steed so as to bring their ad valorem effect up to the general level of duties on other matenials.

No. 2. Failure to correct the mistake made last year when the duty on bituminous coal was Lowered three cents instead of being raised, and failure to make anthracite screenings dutiable at the same rate as soft coal with which it competes.

No. 3. Failure 'to take up the matter of dealing effectively with the importation of materials produced in countries whose currency is greatly depreciated, which was dropped in a moment of weakness last session, and which is now of greater urgency than it was a year ago.

No. 4. Persistent adherence to the pernicious policy of encouraging the [DOT]importation of finished goods by lowering the duties, and of partly finished materials by refunding the duties specified in the customs tariff.

"Disappointment No. 2," dealing with the duty on bituminous coal, has to do with the very question which was raised by my hon. friend optposite a short time ago. That is one of the "disappointments", apparently, in so far as Besco is concerned, that we hope to have remedied through the commission on Maritime rights.

Topic:   THE BUDGET
Subtopic:   CONTINUATION OF DEBATE ON THE ANNUAL
Sub-subtopic:   FINANCIAL STATEMENT OF THE MINISTER OF FINANCE
Permalink
CON

Arthur Meighen (Leader of the Official Opposition)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. MEIGHEN:

The hon. member is

omitting No. 1.

Topic:   THE BUDGET
Subtopic:   CONTINUATION OF DEBATE ON THE ANNUAL
Sub-subtopic:   FINANCIAL STATEMENT OF THE MINISTER OF FINANCE
Permalink
LIB

Charles Edward Bothwell

Liberal

Mr. BOTHWELL:

No, I have not omitted it.

The Budget-Mr. Bothwell

Topic:   THE BUDGET
Subtopic:   CONTINUATION OF DEBATE ON THE ANNUAL
Sub-subtopic:   FINANCIAL STATEMENT OF THE MINISTER OF FINANCE
Permalink
CON

Arthur Meighen (Leader of the Official Opposition)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. MEIGHEN:

If the commission recommends a higher duty on basic iron and steel, will the hon. member support it?

Topic:   THE BUDGET
Subtopic:   CONTINUATION OF DEBATE ON THE ANNUAL
Sub-subtopic:   FINANCIAL STATEMENT OF THE MINISTER OF FINANCE
Permalink
LIB

Charles Edward Bothwell

Liberal

Mr. BOTHWELL:

It may be necessary to have lower duties instead of higher.

Topic:   THE BUDGET
Subtopic:   CONTINUATION OF DEBATE ON THE ANNUAL
Sub-subtopic:   FINANCIAL STATEMENT OF THE MINISTER OF FINANCE
Permalink
CON

Arthur Meighen (Leader of the Official Opposition)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. MEIGHEN:

Will the hon. gentleman be good enough to answer whether 'he will be prepared to support them if the report is in favour of higher duties?

Topic:   THE BUDGET
Subtopic:   CONTINUATION OF DEBATE ON THE ANNUAL
Sub-subtopic:   FINANCIAL STATEMENT OF THE MINISTER OF FINANCE
Permalink
LIB

Charles Edward Bothwell

Liberal

Mr. BOTHWELL:

I think I will answer

my right hon. friend when I have seen the report made by the commission. Now so far as ''disappointments" No. 1 and No. 4 are concerned, they can be dealt with in a general way together. They both refer, to some extent, to the same subject.

The other night the hon. member for East Algoma (Mr. Nicholson) spent some time in quoting figures in connection with the iron and steel industry and endeavoured to show that we are importing a tremendous amount of goods that we should produce at home. From the manner in which he quoted these statistics he left the impression on the House that in the year 1925 we had imported a good deal more of these particular commodities than in any previous year which he mentioned. Now, I read from the same document that the hon. member for East Algoma quoted from. This is the summary of the trade of Canada for the twelve months' periods ending December 1923, 1924 and 1925. I am taking the figures in the order in which he gave them. He gave the figures for the year 1925, and started with plate glass. Our imports of plate glass in 1925 were just as he stated. The figures are:

Year Importation Amount1923 Plate glass $4,274,5091924 Plate glass 3,318,7901925 Plate glass 3,990,613

The next item was hats and caps. We did increase our importations there a little between 1923 and 1925-from $2,899,627 to $2,951,753. Then in boots and shoes we increased our importations from $1,472,407 in 1923 to $1,670,054 in 1925. Then pigs, ingots, and so on-coming down to our iron-we imported $2,450,605 worth in 1923 and $1,551,783 in 1925. Rolling mill products, 1923, $50,866,319; 1925, $38,006,810. Then tubes, pipes and fittings, a reduction from $4,146,738 to $3,142,701. Then in wires there was a reduction from $4,061,777 in 1923 to $2,648,403 in 1925. I might go through all these items which the hon. member mentioned. The figures are given on page 4 of the publication from which my hon. friend read, I refer only to those I have cited in order to show that while the hon. member endeavoured to convince us

that our importations were increasing tremendously from year to year, the fact is that the importation of the particular commodities which he mentioned has been decreasing from year to year. Now that does not appear as if the reduction in the tariff has had the effect of ruining the iron and steel industry, or as if it were necessary for the government in its budget this year to bring in any legislation in order to meet what they call " disappointments " Nos. 1 and 4. We find the same result in the case of the importations and exportations of farm implements and other commodities, the figures in respect to which are all set out in that pamphlet prepared by the Bureau of Statistics.

Then "disappointment No. 3" was the alleged " failure to take up the matter of dealing effectively with the importation of materials produced in countries whose currency is greatly depreciated, which was dropped in a moment of weakness last session, and which is now of greater urgency than it was a year ago." In the same publication you can find what the importations were from these countries whose currency is depreciated; both imports and exports are given on page 2. The figures are as follows:

Belgium- Imports Exports1923

*5,449,962 *13,328,2481925

6,502,702 22,219,453

Germany-*

1923

4.962,180 13,773,2911925

9,028,936 31,087,709

Topic:   THE BUDGET
Subtopic:   CONTINUATION OF DEBATE ON THE ANNUAL
Sub-subtopic:   FINANCIAL STATEMENT OF THE MINISTER OF FINANCE
Permalink
CON

James Dew Chaplin

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. CHAPLIN (Lincoln):

We did not have a treaty with Germany.

Topic:   THE BUDGET
Subtopic:   CONTINUATION OF DEBATE ON THE ANNUAL
Sub-subtopic:   FINANCIAL STATEMENT OF THE MINISTER OF FINANCE
Permalink

May 3, 1926