June 9, 1925

CON

Henry Herbert Stevens

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. STEVENS:

We simply wanted to

make certain of that point. I beg to withdraw the amendment.

Amendment withdrawn.

Topic:   HOME BANK
Subtopic:   PROPOSED PAYMENT OF DEPOSITORS TO THE AMOUNT OF $5,450,000
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Section agreed to. On section 6-Payment to representatives of deceased persons.


CON

John Babington Macaulay Baxter

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. BAXTER:

I would suggest to the

minister that there be added to this clause- it is not a very good place, but it is as good as any that can be found-language something like this:

No assignment or transfer past or future of moneys to be paid under this act or of the claims under section 3 shall be recognized by the liquidator.

I understand that last night when I was not here there was some discussion in the House in regard to this point, and the intention of the country, I believe, is that such moneys as are given shall be given to the sufferers and that nobody shall make anything by speculating in the claims. The legislation may be all right as it is, but it ought to be emphasized that the liquidator is to deal with the claimants that he finds under section 3 and not with any assignment or transfer from them.

Topic:   HOME BANK
Subtopic:   PROPOSED PAYMENT OF DEPOSITORS TO THE AMOUNT OF $5,450,000
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CON

Leon Johnson Ladner

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. LADNER:

Some objection may be

raised to an arbitrary restriction of that kind. It is possible that some people have made assignments for proper considerations, and some discretionary power should rest with the liquidator so that he may be able to accept an assignment of that kind if it is bona fide. To enact a restriction which is entirely prohibitory is liable to embarrass people who are justly entitled to the money.

Topic:   HOME BANK
Subtopic:   PROPOSED PAYMENT OF DEPOSITORS TO THE AMOUNT OF $5,450,000
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CON

John Babington Macaulay Baxter

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. BAXTER:

I do not think it would

have that effect. If some person has unwisely made a transfer it is possible that the court might give relief because of some oppression. But if a man has bona fide bought for a fair consideration, the proposed amendment will not deprive him of anything; when the claimant gets the money from the liquidator he will owe that money to the person to whom he sold.

Topic:   HOME BANK
Subtopic:   PROPOSED PAYMENT OF DEPOSITORS TO THE AMOUNT OF $5,450,000
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CON

Leon Johnson Ladner

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. LADNER:

But suppose he has gone

to a foreign country and his whereabouts are unknown? [DOT]

Topic:   HOME BANK
Subtopic:   PROPOSED PAYMENT OF DEPOSITORS TO THE AMOUNT OF $5,450,000
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CON

John Babington Macaulay Baxter

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. BAXTER:

I would not have the

liquidator deal with anyone except those who are on the books of the bank. If the depositor has left for foreign lands and no one can find him the liquidator will not easily get the money to him. If some one has

bought a claim from a dishonest man he may have to face that man's dishonesty; but where an honest man gets the money there is nothing to prevent him from handing it over. I do not want to see the liquidator made the instrument of the transfer.

Topic:   HOME BANK
Subtopic:   PROPOSED PAYMENT OF DEPOSITORS TO THE AMOUNT OF $5,450,000
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LIB

James Alexander Robb (Minister of Immigration and Colonization)

Liberal

Mr. ROBB:

I was impressed with the argument that every precaution should be taken to make sure that the money would not go to speculators, and I have discussed this question with the officer of the department who has been looking carefully into it, and he shares the view of my hon. friend (Mr. Ladner). He tells me that there have been some perfectly legitimate transfers and he advises that we do nothing to tie them up. But he knows of no case in which there was speculation of any kind. I think my hon. friend from St. John (Mr. Baxter) might very well trust the liquidator to look after this; I am satisfied he will watch it closely.

Topic:   HOME BANK
Subtopic:   PROPOSED PAYMENT OF DEPOSITORS TO THE AMOUNT OF $5,450,000
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CON

John Babington Macaulay Baxter

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. BAXTER:

I do not care whether the

clause is adopted or not; but if the liquidator undertakes to investigate transfers he is adding immensely to his own work.

Topic:   HOME BANK
Subtopic:   PROPOSED PAYMENT OF DEPOSITORS TO THE AMOUNT OF $5,450,000
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LIB

James Alexander Robb (Minister of Immigration and Colonization)

Liberal

Mr. ROBB:

There are very few of them.

Topic:   HOME BANK
Subtopic:   PROPOSED PAYMENT OF DEPOSITORS TO THE AMOUNT OF $5,450,000
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CON

John Babington Macaulay Baxter

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. BAXTER:

If there are very few of

them they can look after themselves. If on the other hand the liquidator is directed to deal simply with the people who are on the books of the concern, that can in no way invalidate any claim that is against any of those people. It may be that legislation of this character is not necessary at all; I do not know the circumstances, and I do not care whether the clause is adopted or not, but I do not think that the people of Canada would like to have public money disbursed as a reward to speculators. One of the most unpleasant things we have witnessed in many years occurred after the South African war when parliament gave certain land scrip to men who had served in that war. At that time the speculators bought up this scrip for a tithe of its value and the country really made a present to them rather than to the soldiers whom it was intended to help. Possibly there is no danger of that kind in this connection. If the minister is of this opinion he may put through the legislation, so far as I am concerned.

Topic:   HOME BANK
Subtopic:   PROPOSED PAYMENT OF DEPOSITORS TO THE AMOUNT OF $5,450,000
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CON

Leon Johnson Ladner

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. LADNER:

There is nothing in the

bill to prohibit the liquidator from paying to a person acting under power of attorney. An attorney under power of attorney has every right to receive the money and give proper discharge. In the case of any transaction already completed, where an assignment has been made in a bona fide manner and for a

Home Bank

proper consideration, it seems to me wrong in principle for parliament now to interpose a retroactive prohibitory clause suhh as is suggested here.

Topic:   HOME BANK
Subtopic:   PROPOSED PAYMENT OF DEPOSITORS TO THE AMOUNT OF $5,450,000
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LIB

James Alexander Robb (Minister of Immigration and Colonization)

Liberal

Mr. ROBB:

With the assurance that the

liquidator will watch this provision carefully, perhaps my hon. friend (Mr. Baxter) will withdraw his amendment.

Topic:   HOME BANK
Subtopic:   PROPOSED PAYMENT OF DEPOSITORS TO THE AMOUNT OF $5,450,000
Permalink
CON

John Babington Macaulay Baxter

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. BAXTER:

I have not yet formally moved an amendment, and if the minister does not want it I will not press it. I do not agree with my hon. friend (Mr. Ladner), for the reason that the money that parliament provides is not somelthing to which any of these people have a right. They had nothing to assign except a chance of getting some small percentage from the bank, and it is possible that assignments may have been made on the basis of what the assets of the Home Bank would render. To that the assignee is entitled and he should get it. I am not saying that anything should be invalidated, but I do say that a man who perhaps bought a possible five per cent dividend should' not be entitled to receive a one hundred per cent dividend on money which otherwise would be adequate for securing only five per cent. If the minister wants to leave that possibility open he can do so and take the responsibility; I have only been suggesting what would help to make the legislation perfect. Possibly the minister does not wanft the legislation to be complete and I will not force on him the suggestion I have offered.

Topic:   HOME BANK
Subtopic:   PROPOSED PAYMENT OF DEPOSITORS TO THE AMOUNT OF $5,450,000
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CON

Thomas Langton Church

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. CHURCH:

I think the minister should submit to parliament, before this bill becomes law, a complete list of the 60,000 odd depositors, together with other information of that character showing to whom, where and in what manner this money, amounting to nearly $6,000,000, will be distributed. Part of the stock, I understand, was sold by one Daly and distributed out west. The minister has the report of the liquidator, Mr. E. R. C. Clarkson, showing who the 60,000 depositors, are and the country is entitled to know how many deposits there are of over $10,000 and the names and how many under that sum and so on. _ The public should be satisfied that nobody is being discriminated against for the benefit of others. Further, what assignments and hypothecations have been made?

Topic:   HOME BANK
Subtopic:   PROPOSED PAYMENT OF DEPOSITORS TO THE AMOUNT OF $5,450,000
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LIB

James Alexander Robb (Minister of Immigration and Colonization)

Liberal

Mr. ROBB:

So far as I know there are

very few assignments. The intention is that the money shall be paid out to the depositors. The committee has discussed for half an hour measures to prevent speculators from getting the funds of the depositors; and while there

is no one whom I would rather please than my hon. friend (Mr. Church), it must be obvious that if I granted his request and gave the information for which he asks it would simply enable the speculators to find out who the depositors are, thus serving their purpose. It is not in the public interest to do this.

Topic:   HOME BANK
Subtopic:   PROPOSED PAYMENT OF DEPOSITORS TO THE AMOUNT OF $5,450,000
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CON

Thomas Langton Church

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. CHURCH:

Did not the liquidator

give the Acting Minister of Finance, before the bill was prepared, a list of the depositors, the amount of money deposited, the sums over and above $10,000, and the number of assignments that had been made?

Topic:   HOME BANK
Subtopic:   PROPOSED PAYMENT OF DEPOSITORS TO THE AMOUNT OF $5,450,000
Permalink
LIB

James Alexander Robb (Minister of Immigration and Colonization)

Liberal

Mr. ROBB:

There is no reference to any

assignment.

Topic:   HOME BANK
Subtopic:   PROPOSED PAYMENT OF DEPOSITORS TO THE AMOUNT OF $5,450,000
Permalink

Section agreed to. Section 7 agreed to. Bill reported.


TRADE AND COMMERCE

June 9, 1925