June 24, 1922

LIB

Ernest Lapointe (Minister of Marine and Fisheries)

Liberal

Mr. LAPOINTE:

The hon. gentleman's statement is a strong argument in favour of the bill. The only way to recoup the town for the money spent on that harbour is by collecting dues from the ships. As far as the fear of these gentlemen coming back and asking for more money is concerned, I would refer them to the hon. Minister of Finance.

Bill reported, read the third time and passed.

Topic:   TRENTON HARBOUR
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SECOND READING


Bill No. 196, from the Senate, respecting a patent of the Dominion Chain Company, Limited.- (Mr. Jacobs).



The House again in Committee of Supply.


CHANGES OF MANAGEMENT.


For the -purchase of five machines for affixing a distinguishing device and serial mimher on each Dominion Note, after the notes have been delivered by the printer and engraver to the Minister of Finance, and while the notes are in the custody and control of the officers of the Department of Finance, as provided for by Sub-section 2, of Section 3, of the Dominion Notes Act, 1914, $12,500.


LIB

William Stevens Fielding (Minister of Finance and Receiver General)

Liberal

Mr. FIELDING:

The object of this item is to make a change with regard to the method of issuing Dominion notes. The notes are printed under proper supervision and they bear the signature of the deputy minister. Then, when they came to the Finance Department, there is a counter signature put on them by one of the young ladies employed for that purpose. It is a matter occupying a good deal of time, and it is proposed to substitute for that a stamp which will be kept in the Finance Department, dispensing with the services of these young ladies. Considerable economy will be effected in that way.

Topic:   CHANGES OF MANAGEMENT.
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Item agreed to. JUSTICE DEPARTMENT. Department of Justice Salaries- James White, Technical Adviser to the Minister of Justice, transferred from the Conservation Commission $6,000 Assistant Private Secretary 1,600 Two Clerk-Stenographers at $960.00 each 1,920 Assistant Structural Engineer, Penitentiary Branch 2,700 Mr. MEIGHE'N: It would look from this as if the minister has been imposed on, and the whole balance of the staff of the Conservation Commission wished on his department. Really, I do not know how Mr. James White can be a technical adviser to the Justice Department. He Supply-Justice



may be one of those men, quite a number of whom I have met, who believe themselves natural lawyers.


LIB

George Perry Graham (Minister of Militia and Defence; Minister of the Naval Service)

Liberal

Mr. GRAHAM:

They have their uses.

Topic:   CHANGES OF MANAGEMENT.
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CON

Arthur Meighen (Leader of the Official Opposition)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. MEIGHEN:

I know something about this matter, and I suggest to the minister that in self defence he ask that this item be deferred.

Topic:   CHANGES OF MANAGEMENT.
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LIB

Lomer Gouin (Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada)

Liberal

Sir LOMER GOUIN:

I may say that Mr. White was previously on the Commission of Conservation, and he has been transferred and put in charge of research work in connection with the Department of Justice.

He has been engaged recently upon the Labrador-Newfoundland boundary. We have some work to perform in connection with that, ,and Mr. White has been employed upon it. He is very useful, I am told, to the staff and the deputy minister, and, I understand, he is to be there for one year.

Topic:   CHANGES OF MANAGEMENT.
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CON

Arthur Meighen (Leader of the Official Opposition)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. MEIGHEN:

Is there not some danger there? I do not know what special qualifications he has for investigating the boundary of Labrador. I have no fault to find with his qualifications for the position he held as secretary of the Conservation Commission. I am not discussing that at all, but that position was done away with for the sake of economy. Now there is no economy at all, if the members of that commission are going to be drafted back into the departments, into more or less artificial and ornamental positions. Mr. White was retired, and he was entitled to his pension. I do not know just what it was, some $4,000 odd for life, and I do not think he has any complaint. If he comes back now, I presume it would mean that the higher salary, if he is getting a higher salary now, for this short term, will be utilized to add to this $4,000 pension that he is entitled to for the remainder of his life.

Topic:   CHANGES OF MANAGEMENT.
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LIB

Lomer Gouin (Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada)

Liberal

Sir LOMER GOUIN:

His present salary is $6,000. If he had been pensioned last year, it would have meant a difference of about $1,500 or $2,000 at the most. If he was retired the Government might save $2,000 per year. I may say that the expenses of the Conservation Commission were over $300,000 per year. The only officer retained is Mr. White, and one shorthand writer, who draws a salary of between $900 and $1,000.

Topic:   CHANGES OF MANAGEMENT.
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CON

Arthur Meighen (Leader of the Official Opposition)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. MEIGHEN:

This is only the commencement of it.

Topic:   CHANGES OF MANAGEMENT.
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Item agreed to. [Mr. Meighen.j Administration of Justice To provide differential salary for certain judges of the Court of King's Bench and Superior 'Court of Quebec, from July 1 to July 25, 1920, notwithstanding anything in the Judges' Act, 32 at $1'34.30, 15 at $268.81, $8,332.95.


CON

Hugh Guthrie

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. GUTHRIE:

Will the minister give us some explanation of this item?

Topic:   CHANGES OF MANAGEMENT.
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LIB

Lomer Gouin (Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada)

Liberal

Sir LOMER GOUIN:

The salaries of all the judges were substantially raised by 1011 George V, chapter 56, dating in the case of every province except Quebec from; 1st July, 1920, on which day the act came into effect. By section 5 of the act, however, it was provided that the section raising the salaries of the Quebec judges would come into operation upon and after a day to be named by proclamation of the Governor in Council. This proclamation was made on July 26, 1920, only, the result being that the judges of Quebec were twenty-five days behind the other judges of Canada ini receiving their increases. This item, I understand, was approved by my predecessor, but we could not have it voted before.

Mr. LEWItS: Has any provision been madte in the Supplementary Estimates for a judgeship at Gravellbourg in Saskatchewan, and have any other similar appointments been made in Saskatchewan?

Topic:   CHANGES OF MANAGEMENT.
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LIB

Lomer Gouin (Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada)

Liberal

Sir LOMER GOUIN:

Representations have been made to us with regard to the appointment of a judge at Gravelbourg, and I hope we shall be in a position, after the session, to 'give satisfaction to the people of that district.

Topic:   CHANGES OF MANAGEMENT.
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CON

Arthur Meighen (Leader of the Official Opposition)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. MEIGHEN:

May I make this suggestion to the minister? The province of Quebec has, of course, a different system from that of the rest of Canada. In Quebec, there is no county or district lourt, as it is known in other provinces. In the other provinces these district court judges do not rank with the superior court judges, either as to salary or as to jurisdiction. They have jurisdiction up to small amounts running from $300 to $1,000, and they receive a salary of $5,000. The province of Quebec has no such court, and as a consequence all the judges are superior court judges, and draw the $9,000 salary of the superior court judges, although most of the time they are trying only $600 or $900 cases. Of course, nothing could be done that would disturb the status of any judge now appointed. Nobody would ask that; but not only would it be in the interest of economy, but it "would

Supply-Justice

be more in accord with common sense, if it could be effected, necessarily by provincial legislation, that a county court would be established in Quebec, thereby bringing the courts of that province into harmony with the courts of the other provinces of Canada. There would, of course, have to be new appointments to the county court, and the others would lapse only as the

4 p.m. members of the court were to retire or to die. That would seem to me a great reform, and the Minister of Justice (Sir Lomer Gouin) having very considerable influence in the government of Quebec as well as in this Government, he would seem to me to be particularly designed by Providence to exert some really great influence to produce this reform.

Topic:   CHANGES OF MANAGEMENT.
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June 24, 1922