May 30, 1921

UNI L

John Flaws Reid

Unionist (Liberal)

Hon. Mr. REID:

Let me say first that I think the attack which the hon. member has made on Sir Joseph Flavelle is

unfair and unjust. I do not think there is a man in Canada with a higher reputation and standing than Sir Joseph Flavelle. This board has been appointed temporarily to carry on the operation of the Grand Trunk Railway system until we can bring all the railways together under the Canadian National Railways charter.

Topic:   SUPPLY-BERRY AND CURRANT BOXES
Subtopic:   REVISED EDITION. COMMONS
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L LIB

Thomas Vien

Laurier Liberal

Mr. VIEN:

Why do you not do that now?

Topic:   SUPPLY-BERRY AND CURRANT BOXES
Subtopic:   REVISED EDITION. COMMONS
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UNI L

John Flaws Reid

Unionist (Liberal)

Hon. Mr. REID:

We will do it in a very short time. We have only had possession of the Grand Trunk a few days, since the appointment of the new board. I feel that I voice the opinion of the majority of the people of this country when I say that if the Government can succeed in getting Sir Joseph Flavelle to accept the chairmanship of the board, and assist in carrying on the operations of that road, it will be one of the best selections that could possibly be made in this Dominion.

Topic:   SUPPLY-BERRY AND CURRANT BOXES
Subtopic:   REVISED EDITION. COMMONS
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L LIB

Lucien Cannon

Laurier Liberal

Mr. CANNON:

He will take the chairmanship and everything else.

Topic:   SUPPLY-BERRY AND CURRANT BOXES
Subtopic:   REVISED EDITION. COMMONS
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UNI L

John Flaws Reid

Unionist (Liberal)

Hon. Mr. REID:

The hon. member for Dorchester (Mr. Cannon) asked for details as to how the $25,000,000 was -expended. I have the details here:

Appropriation under Vote 478 applied in discharge of

Vouchers &, 555,173.97

Special coal vouchers 1,153,571.74

Short term notes 2,356,2120.88

Special short term notes liOOi.OOO. 00

Topic:   SUPPLY-BERRY AND CURRANT BOXES
Subtopic:   REVISED EDITION. COMMONS
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L LIB

Lucien Cannon

Laurier Liberal

Mr. CANNON:

What is the difference between short term notes, and special short term notes?

Topic:   SUPPLY-BERRY AND CURRANT BOXES
Subtopic:   REVISED EDITION. COMMONS
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UNI L

John Flaws Reid

Unionist (Liberal)

Hon. Mr. REID:

The short term notes for coal extended for a little longer time.

Topic:   SUPPLY-BERRY AND CURRANT BOXES
Subtopic:   REVISED EDITION. COMMONS
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L LIB

Lucien Cannon

Laurier Liberal

Mr. CANNON:

There is a short term note, and a special short term note. Is there an extra special short term note?

Topic:   SUPPLY-BERRY AND CURRANT BOXES
Subtopic:   REVISED EDITION. COMMONS
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L LIB

Thomas Vien

Laurier Liberal

Mr. VIEN:

The minister has not completed his statement of how the $25,000,000 is made up.

Topic:   SUPPLY-BERRY AND CURRANT BOXES
Subtopic:   REVISED EDITION. COMMONS
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UNI L

John Flaws Reid

Unionist (Liberal)

Hon. Mr. REID:

I will tell the hon. member why. The hon. member for Dorchester had asked me for this statement, and when I was proceeding to give it I thought it was not fair that he should interrupt and not allow me to read it. As apparently he does not want the information, I shall not give it to him.

Topic:   SUPPLY-BERRY AND CURRANT BOXES
Subtopic:   REVISED EDITION. COMMONS
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L LIB

Lucien Cannon

Laurier Liberal

Mr. CANNON:

I beg the minister's pardon. I have been asking for the information for an hour and a half. The minister ought to be delighted to be for once in a position to give information.

Topic:   SUPPLY-BERRY AND CURRANT BOXES
Subtopic:   REVISED EDITION. COMMONS
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UNI L

John Flaws Reid

Unionist (Liberal)

Hon. Mr. REID:

I am prepared to give it if the hon. member is prepared to listen, but if he wishes to interrupt I shall not give it to him. In addition to the items I have read there are the following:

Fixed charges:

London

New York. . .. Montreal .. ..

Total

Capital expenditures [DOT]

Equipment-Canadian Rolling

Stock Ltd

Back Pay-Grand Trunk Western

Railway

Back Pay-Grand Trunk Railway [DOT] - [DOT] [DOT]

Workmen's Compensation Board Traffic Balances due Erie R.R. Pay rolls:

Grand Trunk Western Railway

Canadian Car Foundry, car

repairs.. [DOT]

Deficiency in advances repaid with proceeds, $25,000,000 7 per cent bonds

Cash on hand, February 15, 1921

Remitted to London

Montreal .. ..

New York .. ..

$6,044,3*36. 74

9*18,627. 09

2,438,209. 76

$9,401,173 . 50

$ 612,3*22. 46

3,409,678. 72

831,140. 00

2,925,461. .45

251,480. ,00

199,199. .83

$ 250,000 09

690,957 09

255,694 59

$24,992,074 23

7,925 77

$25,000,000 00

6,300,031 33

17,781,341 67

918,627 00

$25,000,000 00

Certificates 1 to 12 inclusive were given out by the Department.

Topic:   SUPPLY-BERRY AND CURRANT BOXES
Subtopic:   REVISED EDITION. COMMONS
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L LIB

Lucien Cannon

Laurier Liberal

Mr. CANNON:

In the statement the minister has given, certain amounts are mentioned once of twice as being under pay rolls. Were those moneys expended in ordinary wages of employees on the line?

Topic:   SUPPLY-BERRY AND CURRANT BOXES
Subtopic:   REVISED EDITION. COMMONS
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UNI L

John Flaws Reid

Unionist (Liberal)

Hon. Mr. REID:

That was for pay

between May 1 and September 1, when they got the increase under the McAdoo Award. It was back pay; we had to pay the employees those amounts in addition to the pay they received between May 1 and September 1.

Topic:   SUPPLY-BERRY AND CURRANT BOXES
Subtopic:   REVISED EDITION. COMMONS
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L LIB

Lucien Cannon

Laurier Liberal

Mr. CANNON:

I may be mistaken, but the minister, I think, stated concerning this $89,000,000, that the money was given to the railway as being capital expenditure. I suppose the $25,000,000 was also loaned to the company last year as capital expenditure. If so, how could you pay wages out of that $25,000,000?

Topic:   SUPPLY-BERRY AND CURRANT BOXES
Subtopic:   REVISED EDITION. COMMONS
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UNI L

John Flaws Reid

Unionist (Liberal)

Hon. Mr. REID:

The $25,000,000 last year was expended under an item in the Estimates similar to this item. It was used to pay liabilities, and I have stated how it was expended.

Topic:   SUPPLY-BERRY AND CURRANT BOXES
Subtopic:   REVISED EDITION. COMMONS
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L LIB

Lucien Cannon

Laurier Liberal

Mr. CANNON:

It was understood that these moneys were to be expended by the railways on capital expenditure. The company is in such a bad way-the Grand Trunk, the Grand Trunk Pacific, and the Canadian Northern-that the Government have to pay the wages of the employees out of loans.

Topic:   SUPPLY-BERRY AND CURRANT BOXES
Subtopic:   REVISED EDITION. COMMONS
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UNI L

John Flaws Reid

Unionist (Liberal)

Hon. Mr. REID:

I have already dealt with the $25,000,000. I have the details of the $89,000,000. The first item is $14,589,433.09 for current and overdue working liabilities. The amount of overdue vouchers dated prior to December 1, 1920, and unpaid as at December 31, 1920, is $10,179,170.90.

Topic:   SUPPLY-BERRY AND CURRANT BOXES
Subtopic:   REVISED EDITION. COMMONS
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L LIB

Lucien Cannon

Laurier Liberal

Mr. CANNON:

That was prior to when? Hon. Mr. REID: Prior to December 1, 1920. The statement is as follows:

Unpaid, as at December 31, 1920. $10,179,170 90 Amount of voucher audited for account of month December,

1920, which were unpaid as

at December 31, 1920

4,644,664 08Total vouchers $14,823,834 98Amount of overdue traffic -

balances dated prior to December 1, 1920, and unpaid as

at December 31, 1920 2,690.248 73

Amount of traffic balances, audited for account of month December, 1920, which were unpaid as at December 31,

1920

575,349 38Total traffic balances

.. 3,265,598 11

Total vouchers of traffic balances

amount to $18,089,433 09From which we deduct working balance of amount of vouchers and traffic balances remaining unpaid

3,500,000 00Leaving net requirements of.. $14,589,433 09

That explains the first item.

Topic:   SUPPLY-BERRY AND CURRANT BOXES
Subtopic:   REVISED EDITION. COMMONS
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L LIB

Lucien Cannon

Laurier Liberal

Mr. CANNON:

Would the minister prefer to read the whole statement first, before the committee asks him questions in regard to these figures?

Topic:   SUPPLY-BERRY AND CURRANT BOXES
Subtopic:   REVISED EDITION. COMMONS
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May 30, 1921