April 24, 1918

L LIB

Daniel Duncan McKenzie

Laurier Liberal

Mr. McKENZIE:

The hon. gentleman

may not understand the situation, but in the province from which I come we have had experience in matters somewhat akin to this. We have seen the public road's being eaten away by the action of the tide along certain portions of Nova Scotia, but the people here, whichever government was in power, absolutely refused to give us any money to protect the roads along the harbours in Nova Scotia. They said, "That is a local matter; if it is affecting a town or city, it is a matter the town or city must look after; it is a municipal affair, and you will not get Dominion money for it." If it was outside of a town, the provincial government would have to look after it. as they held it was a provincial matter.

I am simply drawing the attention of the minister to this. If, by any false understanding of the position of the Department of Public Works, or by false kindness or by excessive zeal, the predecessor of the present minister in the kindness of his heart, and in return for favour lavished upon hitn fbom a political standpoint by the city of Toronto, has undertaken to point the walls of the different houses, put sewer pipes under the houses, and generally look after them all round-put them to bed

and cuddle the clothes around them-I think he has gone too far, and that the present minister, particularly in war time, has enough to look after to protect the harbour because it is public property and supposed to be, and is no doubt, for the general benefit of the Government at large. But when it comes to fixing sidewalks, putting foundations under houses, and seeing that they have a proper system of sewage, I draw the line and protest against the moneys of Canada being used in that way for Toronto or any other city.

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CON

George Green Foster

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. THOMAS FOSTER:

II think the hon. gentleman (Mr. McKenzie) quite misunderstands me, and I am sorry for it. I thought I made it quite clear. It may be the hon. gentleman does not understand the situation, he may think the city is asking for favours from this Government. The city is asking for no favours from the hon. Minister of Public Works or any other minister, it is only asking that the Government carry out their undertaking. And we are not asking them to build sewers or point foundations; I made no such statement. I am surprised the hon. gentleman makes such assertion, trying to mislead the House, suggesting that I was. not familiar with the necessities, and that I made a statement I did not make. I said that, on account of this wash which is caused through there being no protection, damage was done. As I understand it, the lake shore is owned by the Dominion, and not by the provincial government. The in-shores are owned by the provincial government, but the lake shores which stop at the Island, are owned by the Dominion.

' Mr. MeKENZIE: In so far as they are used for shipping purposes, but not beyond that.

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CON

George Green Foster

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. FOSTER:

The Government has already spent large amounts there to protect the shore. The eribwork is ready for the concrete construction to prevent the wash on the shore, to save the shore, and to save this property I speak of, and which the hon. member for Toronto South spoke of three weeks ago. Our city engineer tells us the responsibility is with this Government, and the Minister of Public Works- whether he is right or not, I do not know, but I think he knows what his responsibilities are,-knows we are asking for no favours. We are not asking for something unbecoming a great city. We are not suggesting the frivolous things spoken of by the hon. member for Cape Breton

North and Victoria (Mr. McKenzie). After the minister's inspection, I think he will understand my explanation and he will appreciate the fact that the west shore of the Island is affected by these heavy storms. He understands from the work they have already done the great necessity of further work to protect what our engineers tell us would be a very heavy damage for which the Government would be responsible. Surely it is false economy for the Government to make this small grant when there may be a further damage of a couple of million of dollars. I hope I have made myself clear to the minister.

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UNION

Charles Sheard

Unionist

Mr. SHEARD:

In order to remove the impression that appears to have taken possession of the hon. gentleman opposite, I wish to tell him that there are no sewers anywhere near, and I think I am correct in saying that these inroads have been largely made upon the Government property adjacent to and immediately west of the Government light-house and the Government light-house property. It is true that a gas main runs along that right of way which, I believe, is a Government road. The water has washed away the foundations of the gas main. As to the eastern portion to which I referred, I believe the Government have a breakwater already partially under way, and at that particular point it is intended to protect the lake shore. The storms have been exceedingly severe, and they have cut into the roadways to a very unusual extent. I mention these facts in order that hon. gentlemen opposite may be quite assured that we are not seeking particular favours for the city of Toronto, however much we might feel entitled to consideration-I may say that we have never received very much either from the Department of Public Works or from any other department of the Government in so far as I am aware.

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UNI L

Frank Broadstreet Carvell (Minister of Public Works)

Unionist (Liberal)

Mr. CARVELL:

I have no fault to find with the statements made by the hon. gentlemen who represent the city of Toronto, excepting that my hon. friend from East York (Mr. Foster) must have been misinformed when he said that I told the mayor anything, because I have never spoken to the mayor of Toronto in my life. 1 never saw Mayor Church.

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CON
UNI L

Frank Broadstreet Carvell (Minister of Public Works)

Unionist (Liberal)

Mr. CARVELL:

He was not there, and I did not advertise the fact that I was going to Toronto.

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CON
UNI L
UNION
UNI L

Frank Broadstreet Carvell (Minister of Public Works)

Unionist (Liberal)

Mr. CARVELL:

It is required for dredging under contract at Port Arthur, repairs to revetment wall, Grand Trunk Pacific basin, Port Arthur, harbour surveys, and so on. It is for the ordinary harbour works which we believe are absolutely necessary to take care of the grain business.

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UNION

Robert James Manion

Unionist

Mr. MANION:

Is this dredging to be done in the Canadian Northern basin at Fort William, or is it for the removal of lot 10P

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UNI L

Frank Broadstreet Carvell (Minister of Public Works)

Unionist (Liberal)

Mr. CARVELL:

There is an item for the removal of a portion of lot 10.

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UNION

Robert James Manion

Unionist

Mr. MANION:

What about the turning basin above the Canadian Northern dock?

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UNI L

Frank Broadstreet Carvell (Minister of Public Works)

Unionist (Liberal)

Mr. CARVELL:

It is intended to go on with that.

Vancouver Harbour-improvements, $150,00'0.

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UNI L

Frank Broadstreet Carvell (Minister of Public Works)

Unionist (Liberal)

Mr. CARVELL:

No new works are being undertaken in Vancouver or Victoria harbours. This amount is chiefly for a second shed on one of the big wharves at Vancouver, and to complete wharves now under construction. The amount for Victoria is for the purpose of building a wharf and closing uip the present scheme.

Progress reported.

On the motion of Hon. Mr. Carvell the House adjourned at 12.04 a.m. (Thursday).

Thursday, April 25, 1918.

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April 24, 1918