March 14, 1910

CON

Uriah Wilson

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. URIAH WILSON.

This government brought them in.

Topic:   SUPPLY-INTERIM SUPPLY BILL.
Subtopic:   IMMIGRATION ACT AMENDMENT.
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LIB

John Gillanders Turriff

Liberal

Mr. TURRIFF.

There are people among other classes who go crazy and have to be put in asylums. I believe that you can easily find other classes who have entailed more expense from the Justice Department than has been spent in looking after the small proportion of Doukhobors who needed looking after, and who, in my judgment, are insane. It sometimes costs the government a great deal to punish a criminal. It may take $25,000 to capture, convict and punish a murderer. I have in mind one such case in which it cost the government $100,000 to execute justice. Will you say that the people who came from the same country as that murderer are an undesirable class because of this man's crime? Are the Doukhobors all to be classed as bad settlers because some of them have practically gone insane and acted in a reprehensible manner? There is much criticism of the government for bringing these people into the country, but when they were brought in hon. members opposite did not offer a word of criticism.

Topic:   SUPPLY-INTERIM SUPPLY BILL.
Subtopic:   IMMIGRATION ACT AMENDMENT.
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CON

Uriah Wilson

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. URIAH WILSON.

If the hon. member will allow me, I recollect very distinctly when the present Minister of the Interior (Mr. Oliver) and myself criticised that action very freely.

Topic:   SUPPLY-INTERIM SUPPLY BILL.
Subtopic:   IMMIGRATION ACT AMENDMENT.
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LIB

John Gillanders Turriff

Liberal

Mr. TURRIFF.

I was going to remark -if my hon. friend had waited-that the chief criticism of that action came from my hon. friend the Minister of the Interior, who was then a private member of the House, and not from hon. members opposite.

Topic:   SUPPLY-INTERIM SUPPLY BILL.
Subtopic:   IMMIGRATION ACT AMENDMENT.
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CON

William Henry Sharpe

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. W. H. SHARPE.

We were not here.

Topic:   SUPPLY-INTERIM SUPPLY BILL.
Subtopic:   IMMIGRATION ACT AMENDMENT.
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LIB

John Gillanders Turriff

Liberal

Mr. TURRIFF.

Further, the predecessors of this government were those who began bringing in the people who are now said to be so undesirable.

Topic:   SUPPLY-INTERIM SUPPLY BILL.
Subtopic:   IMMIGRATION ACT AMENDMENT.
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LIB
LIB

John Gillanders Turriff

Liberal

Mr. TURRIFF.

If the hon. member for Frontenac (Mr. Edwards) will remain quiet, he will get further ahead.

Topic:   SUPPLY-INTERIM SUPPLY BILL.
Subtopic:   IMMIGRATION ACT AMENDMENT.
Permalink
LIB

William Cameron Edwards

Liberal

Mr. EDWARDS.

Does the hon. member object to a question?

Topic:   SUPPLY-INTERIM SUPPLY BILL.
Subtopic:   IMMIGRATION ACT AMENDMENT.
Permalink
LIB

John Gillanders Turriff

Liberal

Mr. TURRIFF.

Yes, until I get through.

Topic:   SUPPLY-INTERIM SUPPLY BILL.
Subtopic:   IMMIGRATION ACT AMENDMENT.
Permalink
LIB

William Cameron Edwards

Liberal

Mr. EDWARDS.

I have no wish to interrupt.

Topic:   SUPPLY-INTERIM SUPPLY BILL.
Subtopic:   IMMIGRATION ACT AMENDMENT.
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LIB

John Gillanders Turriff

Liberal

Mr. TURRIFF.

It is easy to criticise, because some of the people who come to Canada have not turned out well. But if you are going to condemn all the people from a given country because some of them turn out badly, where will you get your immigration?

Topic:   SUPPLY-INTERIM SUPPLY BILL.
Subtopic:   IMMIGRATION ACT AMENDMENT.
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CON

William Henry Sharpe

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. W. H. SHARPE.

I do not wish to be misunderstood. The hon. gentleman has interpreted my words as condemning the whole crowd of Doukhobors. A moment ago when the minister said that he put them into two classes, a good class and a class that was no good, I said distinctly that a part of them were all right.

Topic:   SUPPLY-INTERIM SUPPLY BILL.
Subtopic:   IMMIGRATION ACT AMENDMENT.
Permalink
LIB

John Gillanders Turriff

Liberal

Mr. TURRIFF.

I accept the hon. gentleman's view of the matter, and I quite agree that a considerable part of them are all right, and a part of them are not right. But we have them in the country, and we must deal with them as we find them. Not many more Doukhobors will come in, and I think I have heard it stated that about all that class of people in Russia have now come into Canada. But if any more of them do come in, under our present law, and more especially under the law it is now proposed to amend, we would not only be able to stop them from coming in, but if they are found to be undesirable we can deport them at any time during three years after their arrival. I have seen a statement made by one of the ministers of the Ontario government that the jails and asylums of the province were being filled with undesirables from foreign countries, and that although it was within the power of any municipality in which one of those undesirables was found, _to deport him, in a great many cases it had not been done. The municipality had only to notify the Department of the Interior and the individual would be deported, but in a great many cases no such step had been taken by the municipality. I am satisfied that the government do not wish to bring in any class of people who live in communities. We want the people who come into this country to adopt Canadian ways of living. Even' English speaking people

coining into Canada, if they live in communities, would not toe the class that we desire. I think this Bill will go a long way towards making it possible to handle the immigration question better than we have handled it in the past, and it will better enable us to keep -out undesirables.

Topic:   SUPPLY-INTERIM SUPPLY BILL.
Subtopic:   IMMIGRATION ACT AMENDMENT.
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CON

Glenlyon Campbell

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. CAMPBELL.

The Minister of Interior referred to these people as being not inferior in mentality or physique to other races who form the people of Canada, and he said that some 25 per cent of them had proved to be good settlers. But I hold that when he is bringing in a Bill with regard to immigration it is up to him to provide that no immigrant, no matter how good his physique or his mentality, shall be allowed to come into this country as a settler unless he is prepared to subscribe to the oath of allegiance and become a Canadian first as we all do who form the great Canadian people. The minister has had to admit that up to date only a small percentage of Doukhobors have subscribed to the oath of allegiance. For that reason alone. I say they are bad settlers, regardless of their physique or menahty. I think we should pass a law that no man should be allowed to reside in this country unless he is prepared to become a Canadian citizen in the fullest meaning of the word, and unless he is prepared to take up arms in defence of the flag that waves over him. I would suggest that a clause be put in the Bill to that effect.

Topic:   SUPPLY-INTERIM SUPPLY BILL.
Subtopic:   IMMIGRATION ACT AMENDMENT.
Permalink
CON

William Henry Sharpe

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. W. H. SHARPE.

The minister has divided the Doukhobors into two classes. Will it be possible, under the new Bill, to keep an undesirable Doukhobor out of the country? _

Topic:   SUPPLY-INTERIM SUPPLY BILL.
Subtopic:   IMMIGRATION ACT AMENDMENT.
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LIB

Frank Oliver (Minister of the Interior; Superintendent-General of Indian Affairs)

Liberal

Mr. OLIVER.

If they were recognized as being of the class that my hon. friend mentions, of course they would be shut out under the Bill. But having come in without being recognized as undesirable, if they were found to be undesirable within three years afterwards, they could be deported to the country from whence they came. It might be difficult to distinguish between one who was mentally weak and one who was sound. But if their fanaticism broke out within three years after their coming into the country, under this Bill they could be deported. In regard to what the hon. member for Dauphin (Mr. Campbell) said, I quite agree with him that men who decline to take the oath of allegiance are undesirable. I am satisfied that had the government been aware, when they entered into negotiations for bringing these people out to Canada that such was their religion, certainly no such arrangement would have been entered into.

Topic:   SUPPLY-INTERIM SUPPLY BILL.
Subtopic:   IMMIGRATION ACT AMENDMENT.
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CON

Frederick Laurence Schaffner

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. SCHAFFNER.

Could the minister . tell us about what proportion of the Doukhobors have taken the oath?

Topic:   SUPPLY-INTERIM SUPPLY BILL.
Subtopic:   IMMIGRATION ACT AMENDMENT.
Permalink
LIB
LIB

Frank Oliver (Minister of the Interior; Superintendent-General of Indian Affairs)

Liberal

Mr. OLIVER.

I think about 25 per cent of the adult males.

Topic:   SUPPLY-INTERIM SUPPLY BILL.
Subtopic:   IMMIGRATION ACT AMENDMENT.
Permalink

March 14, 1910