May 7, 1909

YUKON ORDINANCES.


Mr. OLIVER moved that the House go into committee to consider the following proposed resolution: Resolved, that the ordinances of the 9th day of March, 1908, intituled: ' An ordinance respecting the hearing and decision of disputes in relation to mining lands in the Yukon Territory/ and the ordinance of the 17th day of September, last, intituled: 'An ordinance respecting the imposition of a tax upon ale, porter, beer and lager beer, imported into the Yukon Teritory,' which were passed upon their respective dates by the Governor in Council, under the authority of section 16 of the Yukon Act, being chapter 63, R.S.C., 1906, copies of which ordinances, as well as the necessary order in council in each case, have been laid before this House, are approvd by this House, in accordance with the provisions of section 17 of said chapter 63.


CON

Robert Laird Borden (Leader of the Official Opposition)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. R. L. BORDEN.

I think it would be well for the minister to read the ordinances so that we may see them in ' Hansard,' and then let this resolution stand in order that we may consider them, as I do not understand that they have been printed.

Topic:   YUKON ORDINANCES.
Permalink
LIB

Frank Oliver (Minister of the Interior; Superintendent-General of Indian Affairs)

Liberal

Mr. OLIVER.

They- hdve been laid on the table of the House in accordance with the requirements of section 17 of the Yukon Act, but I do not think they have been distributed. The order in council of the 9th of March, 1908, is as follows:

The Governor General, in virtue of the powers vested in him by section 16 of the Yukon Act, chapter 63, Revised Statutes of Canada, 1906, and by and with the advice of the King's Privy Council for Canada, is pleased to enact as follows:-

The provisions contained in the order of the Governor General in Council of the 19th of February, 1907, whereby the Orders of the Governor General in Council of the 18th of March, 1901, and the 4th of June, 1902, being orders governing the hearing and decision of disputes in relation to mining lands in the Yukon Territory, were rescinded and certain other regulations substituted in lieu thereof, and in the order of the Governor General in Council of the 13th of July, 1907, whereby it was ordered that all unfinished cases pending in the Gold Commissioner's Court be transferred for adjudication to the territorial court, are hereby approved, ratified and confirmed.

The order in council of the 17th of September, 1908, is as follows:

Whereas by an ordinance of His Excellency the Governor General in Council, dated the

22ncl day of June, 1904, being an ordinance respecting tbe importation into the Yukon territory, of malt and spirituous or intoxicating liquors or other intoxicants and the traffic therein, provision was made that ale, porter, beer and lager beer shall after the coming into force of that ordinance, be admitted free into the territory; and Whereas on the 30th of July, 1908, the Com-misioner in Council of the Yukon Territory expressed by resolution the opinion that it would be a wise and just policy to impose a fee of fifty cents per gallon on all porter, beer and ales, which may in the future be imported into the territory, but that such tax should only apply to foreign products and not to Canadian or British products;

Therefore His Excellency the Governor in Council, in virtue of the provisions of section 16, chapter 63, Revised Statutes of Canada, 1906, enacts as follows:-

That the ordinance of the 22nd June, 1904, respecting the importation into the Yukon Territory of malt and spirituous or intoxicating liquors or other intoxicants and traffic therein, shall be and the same is hereby amended by providing that on and after the 1st day of November, 1908, a tax of fifty cents a gallon be imposed upon all ale, porter, beer or lager beer imported into the Yukon Territory from any foreign country.

Topic:   YUKON ORDINANCES.
Permalink
CON

Thomas Simpson Sproule

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. SPROULE.

As that imposes a tax on imported liquors, should not that be done by a custom law rather than by the ordinance passed by the Yukon Council?

Topic:   YUKON ORDINANCES.
Permalink
LIB

Frank Oliver (Minister of the Interior; Superintendent-General of Indian Affairs)

Liberal

Mr. OLIVER.

It is a special tax foi the benefit of the local revenue of the Yukon

Territory over and above the customs tax.

Topic:   YUKON ORDINANCES.
Permalink
CON

Thomas Simpson Sproule

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. SPROULE.

Would the province of Ontario have a right to impose a tax on imported foreign liquors in addition to the custom tax now levied, and have that ratified here?

Topic:   YUKON ORDINANCES.
Permalink
LIB

Frank Oliver (Minister of the Interior; Superintendent-General of Indian Affairs)

Liberal

Mr. OLIVER.

That is a matter for consideration. The government passed this ordinance in the belief that it was a proper ordinance, and that, being in accordance with the wishes of the Council of the Yukon Territory it was sound public policy to do it. It may be a matter for argument whether it is a correct principle or not, either in law or in policy.

Topic:   YUKON ORDINANCES.
Permalink
LIB

Frederick Tennyson Congdon

Liberal

Mr. CONGDON.

I desire to say a word merely in anticipation of what I think the Governor in Council will be asked to do a little later. The Governor in Council was asked by the Commissioner in Council of the Yukon Territory to pass the ordinance imposing a tax upon imported ale and beer; but it is one of the most unpopular* measures in the Yukon, for the reason that it is felt that if men are going to indulge in intoxicating liquors, it is better that they should be permitted to indulge in the lighter liquors, and not compelled to pay increased prices for them, and I have no doubt that the Governor in Council will soon be asked

by the Yukon Council to repeal the ordinance.

Topic:   YUKON ORDINANCES.
Permalink
CON

George Eulas Foster

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. FOSTER.

The point raised by the hon. member for East Grey (Mr. Sproule) seems to be a good point. The province of Ontario certainly has greater rights prima facie than a smaller division of the country like the Yukon Territory. It is an older and larger province and is more settled in its constitutional privileges and usages. Suppose the Ontario government were to introduce legislation or to' pass by order m council a resolution imposing on all imported liquors which came to the border of the province a tax over and above what the Dominion customs tariff imposed upon them, I think it would cause a good deaJ of surprise and a good deal of question. This seems to be entering upon a course which might lead to any kind of customs imposition by any province of the Dominion, which would be absolutely opposed to that uniformity which the trade of the Dominion requires.

Topic:   YUKON ORDINANCES.
Permalink
LIB

Wilfrid Laurier (Prime Minister; President of the Privy Council)

Liberal

Sir WILFRID LAURIER.

There is great force in the point raised by my hon. friend from East Grey, not, however, I think, for the reasons given by my hon. friend from North Toronto. The province of Ontario has no power to legislate at all in fiscal matters. The council of the Yukon territory is not a sovereign body, as the legislature of Ontario is within its own sphere; but that sphere does not include fiscal matters. The Yukon Council cannot legislate; it can only make suggestions. It has suggested that a tax should be imposed on certain beverages. The parliament of Canada alone can deal with that, and it may be that we cannot deal with it in the way suggested. I do not know that it can be dealt with in any other manner than by a tax Bill. I think the point is worthy of consideration.

Topic:   YUKON ORDINANCES.
Permalink
CON

Robert Laird Borden (Leader of the Official Opposition)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. R. L. BORDEN.

It depends altogether on the terms of the statute under which the ordinance is made. It is entirely different, I think, in the case of a province. This has been done not by the Yukon council, but by the Governor in Council under the provisions of a statute of Canada. The provisions of that statute are very wide, and I am not at all sure, speaking from memory, that they would not embrace this ordinance. That depends absolutely on the terms of the statute. The question of policy which has been spoken of by the member for the Yukon (Mr. Congdon) is of course an entirely distinct question. As we have not the terms of the statute before us, and as the subject will require some discussion, I would suggest that the Minister of the Interior allow the matter to stand for the present,

and later on we can take it up in com! mittee and discuss it.

Topic:   YUKON ORDINANCES.
Permalink
LIB

Frank Oliver (Minister of the Interior; Superintendent-General of Indian Affairs)

Liberal

Mr. OLIVER.

As to the point raised by my hon. friend from East Grey, there is a special tax levied to-day, and it has been in existence ever since the organization of the Yukon Territory, upon spirituous liquors, I think $2 per gallon, for the benefit of the local revenue.

Topic:   YUKON ORDINANCES.
Permalink
CON
LIB

Frank Oliver (Minister of the Interior; Superintendent-General of Indian Affairs)

Liberal

Mr. OLIVER.

No, on the importation. This proposal is simply to put beer on the same basis as spirituous liquors, except as to the amount of the tax levied. It is a tax levied for local revenue purposes, not by the local council, but by the parliament of Canada. Parliament being the paramount authority, we are asking it to take the action necessary to make the previous action of the Governor in Council effective. I move that the House go into committee on this resolution on Monday next.

Topic:   YUKON ORDINANCES.
Permalink

Motion agreed to.


THE CIVIL SERVICE ACT.

CON

George Eulas Foster

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. FOSTER.

Before the orders of the day are called, I would like to ask the Minister of Agriculture when he proposes to bring on his Civil Service resolution and the Bill to be founded thereon. I am a little anxious to have the minister say when, because the resolution has stood now for about two months, and it is being very sedulously circulated about the departments, whether by design or not I do not know, that the government do not care to bring it in because if they do Mr. Foster will block it; and I am receiving letters and requests from all sources asking me for heaven's sake not to block the Bill. Well, I never had any idea of blocking it. If any one has been blocking it, it has been the Minister of Agriculture, who for two months has had the way clear for it.

Topic:   THE CIVIL SERVICE ACT.
Permalink
LIB

Wilfrid Laurier (Prime Minister; President of the Privy Council)

Liberal

Sir WILFRID LAURIER.

My hon. friend seems to be very careful of his reputation.

Topic:   THE CIVIL SERVICE ACT.
Permalink
CON

George Eulas Foster

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. FOSTER.

My reputation is all right But there are some methods of political warfare that are not the finest in the world and this is one of them.

Topic:   THE CIVIL SERVICE ACT.
Permalink

May 7, 1909