June 4, 1908

MILITIA TRAINING CAMPS.

CON

Robert Laird Borden (Leader of the Official Opposition)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. R. L. BORDEN.

Before the motion carries I would like to ask the Minister of Militia whether he is prepared to give a statement with respect to the camps?

Topic:   SUPPLY-CALGARY TOWN SITE.
Subtopic:   MILITIA TRAINING CAMPS.
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?

Sir FREDERICK@

Topic:   SUPPLY-CALGARY TOWN SITE.
Subtopic:   MILITIA TRAINING CAMPS.
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CON

John Waterhouse Daniel

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. DANIEL.

When will the Sussex camp be held ?

Topic:   SUPPLY-CALGARY TOWN SITE.
Subtopic:   MILITIA TRAINING CAMPS.
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LIB

Frederick William Borden (Minister of Militia and Defence)

Liberal

Sir FREDERICK BORDEN.

I have no dates here, but there is no change in the date, whatever it is. The date has been published and the dates also, of the Nova Scotia camps. There has been no change. They are generally held later in the season. The Nova Scotia camp at Aldershot is always held in September.

Topic:   SUPPLY-CALGARY TOWN SITE.
Subtopic:   MILITIA TRAINING CAMPS.
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CON

Robert Laird Borden (Leader of the Official Opposition)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. R. L. BORDEN.

Except in so far as the minister has mentioned, the dates will he the same as already announced ?

Topic:   SUPPLY-CALGARY TOWN SITE.
Subtopic:   MILITIA TRAINING CAMPS.
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LIB

Frederick William Borden (Minister of Militia and Defence)

Liberal

Sir FREDERICK BORDEN.

Yes. In addition there was a militia order passed on the 29th ult, which I presume has caused the inquiry to be made and may have caused some of the remarks to which the hon. leader of the opposition referred,

I think, last evening in the House as having been made in the newspapers. At any rate,

I have seen some references in the newspapers to this order. No. 8, of the 27th of May, which is as follows :

It is notified, for the information of all concerned, that, in the event of provision not being made by parliament for the several camps of instruction referred to in militia orders Nos. 66' (1) and 108 (1), 1908, prior to the dates fixed for their commencement, it will be necessary to postpone the same until the requisite funds are available.

That is the order. Of course, it would be impossible to go into camp until the funds were voted, but there are some days yet before the camps would begin. Therefore, there is ample time. This was thought to be a proper precautionary notice to give. In addition, Mr. Speaker, I wish to say that in so far as the camps of western Canada are concerned, that is Manitoba, the Northwest and British Columbia, they are proceeding as the department has funds. The one-eighth vote which was granted some time ago under the Supply Bill approved by His Excellency, is in hand for these camps and they are being carried on.

Topic:   SUPPLY-CALGARY TOWN SITE.
Subtopic:   MILITIA TRAINING CAMPS.
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CON

Robert Laird Borden (Leader of the Official Opposition)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. R. L. BORDEN.

Although there is a vote in the estimates, I am not aware of parliament, up to the present time, having been requested to vote the necessary funds for the camps, and I can only say that if the request had been made it would have been favourably entertained.

Topic:   SUPPLY-CALGARY TOWN SITE.
Subtopic:   MILITIA TRAINING CAMPS.
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LIB

Frederick William Borden (Minister of Militia and Defence)

Liberal

Sir FREDERICK BORDEN.

There is plenty of time yet.

Topic:   SUPPLY-CALGARY TOWN SITE.
Subtopic:   MILITIA TRAINING CAMPS.
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CON

Robert Laird Borden (Leader of the Official Opposition)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. R. L. BORDEN.

There is plenty of time yet, as the minister says. Therefore, while the notice was sent out, properly, no doubt, by way of precaution, it has given rise to certain rumours which have come to me and for that reason, I desired to have the matter cleared up, and at the same time to make it perfectly apparent that we did not obstruct the granting of supplies for the camps simply for the reason that we have not been asked to vote the money.

Topic:   SUPPLY-CALGARY TOWN SITE.
Subtopic:   MILITIA TRAINING CAMPS.
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LIB

Frederick William Borden (Minister of Militia and Defence)

Liberal

Sir FREDERICK BORDEN.

Of course, the militia vote is a part only of the Supply Bill and although the vote might be granted, although the full amount might be passed by this House of the money necessary for the annual camps, it would not follow that the money would be available

until it had passed through the Upper House and received the assent of His Excellency the Governor General. As a matter of fact, the whole Supply Bill has been before parliament for some months. I may say that the militia votes were called earlier in the session, but the hon. member for North Toronto (Mr. Foster)-and I am not complaining of this-took exception to going on' with the votes, because at that time either some of the reports connected with the department or the portion of the Auditor General's Report referring to the militia estimates of last year had not been laid on the table of the House. I take no exception to that. I think it was a perfectly fair objection to make. .

Topic:   SUPPLY-CALGARY TOWN SITE.
Subtopic:   MILITIA TRAINING CAMPS.
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CON

Robert Laird Borden (Leader of the Official Opposition)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. R. L. BORDEN.

As far as the Supply Bill is concerned, of course, it is quite practicable to do as has been done on many occasions-pass an emergency Supply Bill with respect to any service if the government think that course proper or advisable.

Topic:   SUPPLY-CALGARY TOWN SITE.
Subtopic:   MILITIA TRAINING CAMPS.
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LIB

William Stevens Fielding (Minister of Finance and Receiver General)

Liberal

Mr. FIELDING.

I am obliged to dissent from the statement of my hon. friend when he says that no obstacle has been placed in the way of the passing of the militia estimates. I wish to say that an approach was made to hon. gentlemen opposite to take a vote on account for the public service, and that we received intimation that it would not meet their concurrence. However, it is six o'clock and perhaps you, Mr. Speaker, do not wish to remain any longer.

Topic:   SUPPLY-CALGARY TOWN SITE.
Subtopic:   MILITIA TRAINING CAMPS.
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CON

Robert Laird Borden (Leader of the Official Opposition)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr R L. BORDEN.

The only militia estimates that were placed before the House went through on the 26th of May, after five minutes discussion. .

Topic:   SUPPLY-CALGARY TOWN SITE.
Subtopic:   MILITIA TRAINING CAMPS.
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LIB

William Stevens Fielding (Minister of Finance and Receiver General)

Liberal

Mr. FIELDING.

I am not specifying which estimates were passed or were not passed ; I am simply saying that an application was made to hon. gentlemen opposite to take a vote on account of the whole of the services of the country, including the militia estimates, and we were informed that we would not have_their cooperation to do that.

Topic:   SUPPLY-CALGARY TOWN SITE.
Subtopic:   MILITIA TRAINING CAMPS.
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CON

Robert Laird Borden (Leader of the Official Opposition)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr R L. BORDEN.

As a matter of fact the application was made by the government to pass militia estimates received instant attention. Subsequent to that difficulties arose with respect to a certain Bill and when hon. gentlemen opposite requested that the rules of the House should be superseded there was not that concurrence which had been manifested on a previous occasion.

Topic:   SUPPLY-CALGARY TOWN SITE.
Subtopic:   MILITIA TRAINING CAMPS.
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LIB

William Stevens Fielding (Minister of Finance and Receiver General)

Liberal

Mr. FIELDING.

Whatever may have been the cause of the hon. gentleman s objection, it is not for me to say. I do liot want to discuss it, but I wish to state that it is within my personal knowledge that application was made to hon. gentle-

men opposite to co-operate with us in making a further vote ou account to permit the public services to be carried on and that hon. gentlemen could not co-operate with us. I am not finding any fault, but I am putting on record a fact which is beyond controversy.

Topic:   SUPPLY-CALGARY TOWN SITE.
Subtopic:   MILITIA TRAINING CAMPS.
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CON

Robert Laird Borden (Leader of the Official Opposition)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. R. L. BORDEN.

The proposition which was made to us was that the rules of the House should be suspended and that we should depart from the ordinary course.

Topic:   SUPPLY-CALGARY TOWN SITE.
Subtopic:   MILITIA TRAINING CAMPS.
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LIB

William Stevens Fielding (Minister of Finance and Receiver General)

Liberal

Mr. FIELDING.

The proposition was the same as was made before to vote a sum on account, including the militia estimates, to assist us in carrying on the public service.

Topic:   SUPPLY-CALGARY TOWN SITE.
Subtopic:   MILITIA TRAINING CAMPS.
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CON

Robert Laird Borden (Leader of the Official Opposition)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. R. L. BORDEN.

It was to suspend the rules of the House.

Topic:   SUPPLY-CALGARY TOWN SITE.
Subtopic:   MILITIA TRAINING CAMPS.
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June 4, 1908