March 1, 1905

CON

George Taylor (Chief Opposition Whip; Whip of the Conservative Party (1867-1942))

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. TAYLOR.

I would inquire from the minister if there is a suit pending, or some commission inquiring into a bargain that was made between the Intercolonial and the Grand Trunk when the Intercolonial was extended into Montreal, as to the Grand Trunk handling the traffic not specially routed to be handled over the Intercolonial. I ask, because I can inform the minister that I know of a case where freight was specially routed to be handed over to the Intercolonial at Montreal, and instead of going that way it was sent through to Boston. The bill of lading was to Montreal and thence by the Intercolonial to Halifax. 1 saw the bill of lading myself.

Topic:   SUPPLY-INTERCOLONIAL RAILWAY, ANNUAL STATEMENT.
Subtopic:   JL 1 CUIAIUBH.
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LIB

Henry Robert Emmerson (Minister of Railways and Canals)

Liberal

Mr. EMMERSOX.

I would be glad to have the information from my hon. friend. I may tell him that there is pending an arbitration between the Grand Trunk and the Intercolonial as regards the traffic exchanged at Montreal and Ste. Rosalie. That arbitration is being held under a clause in the original contract and Act of parliament, which provides that where a dispute arises arbitrators shall be chosen, and the method of choosing the arbitrators is stated, and that has been done. There have been disputes which have reached a culminating point, the case is being heard, and evidence is being placed before the arbitrators. I cannot say as to the state of the proceeding

but I know it has been pending for some time.

Topic:   SUPPLY-INTERCOLONIAL RAILWAY, ANNUAL STATEMENT.
Subtopic:   JL 1 CUIAIUBH.
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CON

Albert Edward Kemp

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. KEMP.

What ground do the government take in regard to this-that the Grand Trunk are violating their agreement by sending freight to Montreal ?

Topic:   SUPPLY-INTERCOLONIAL RAILWAY, ANNUAL STATEMENT.
Subtopic:   JL 1 CUIAIUBH.
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LIB

Henry Robert Emmerson (Minister of Railways and Canals)

Liberal

Mr. EMMERSOX.

That the Grand Trunk Railway Company who were bound to hand over all unrouted traffic from the west to the Intercolonial Railway have handed it over in some instances to the Canadian Pacific Railway and in other instances they have allowed it to go by other routes and in that way the Intercolonial Railway has been damaged.

Topic:   SUPPLY-INTERCOLONIAL RAILWAY, ANNUAL STATEMENT.
Subtopic:   JL 1 CUIAIUBH.
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LIB

Honoré Hippolyte Achille Gervais

Liberal

Mr. GBRVAIS.

Mr. Chairman, before this item is passed I would like to say a few words about the fish trade in Montreal in relation to the management of the Intercolonial Railway. Every one knows that the Intercolonial Railway has not been doing a very paying business for the last few years, or'in fact, since its inception, but on the other hand, not many people know that in Montreal the fish dealers are paying a large amount per week to the Grand Trunk Railway Company for the transportation of fresh fish from Boston, or Portland to Montreal. Not many people know that in Montreal the fish dealers are paying about $25,000 per week as the price of such American fish. I was taught when I was at school, because I was not born in the maritime provinces, that there are quite a lot of fish in the Gulf of St. Lawrence and the Baie des Chaleurs. It is a matter of regret to the fish dealers of Montreal that there are no proper express facilities to bring up to the nsh market in that city the fresh fish which can be caught in the gulf and around the shores of Xew Brunswick and Nova Scotia. I have been calling the attention of Mr. Tiffin, the traffic manager of the Intercolonial Railway, to these facts, but no satisfactory answer lias been conveyed to me." I now call the attention of the committee as well ns that of the hon. Minister of Railways and Canals to this condition of affairs. I think something should be done to secure for the Intercolonial Railway several thousand dollars per month and many thousand dollars to the good fishermen in the provinces of Nova Scotia and New Brunswick.

Topic:   SUPPLY-INTERCOLONIAL RAILWAY, ANNUAL STATEMENT.
Subtopic:   JL 1 CUIAIUBH.
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LIB

Henry Robert Emmerson (Minister of Railways and Canals)

Liberal

Mr. EMMERSOX.

I quite concur in the laudable object which my hon. friend has in view, but I would point out to him that this traffic is all done by the express companies. There are furnished on the Intercolonial Railway from Mulgrave and from Cape Breton right up through the provinces of Nova Scotia and XewT Brunswick facilities for the transportation of fresh fish with proper refrigerator cars and during the fishing season these facilities are available for those who wish to engage in that traffic. A very large business is done, comparatively speaking, between the Cape Breton fisher-

men and the people In Montreal, and at other points in the west. This can be done as well by those along the Baie des Ohaleurs if they are prepared to engage in this trade. I think the principal reason why lish from Baie des Chaleurs does not find a market in Montreal is that the fishermen in that section years ago sought out a market in the United States, and when you get traffic going in a certain channel or groove it is very apt to continue in that groove unless by some extraordinary means it is diverted from it. I am sure that this matter largely depends upon those engaged in the business. I can assure my hon. friend that we want the traffic. If it can be doubled or trebled it will be greatly to The satisfaction of the management of the Intercolonial Railway, and we are at all times ready to facilitate that traffic as much as possible.

Topic:   SUPPLY-INTERCOLONIAL RAILWAY, ANNUAL STATEMENT.
Subtopic:   JL 1 CUIAIUBH.
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LIB

Honoré Hippolyte Achille Gervais

Liberal

Mr. GERVAIS.

I have been discussing this matter somewhat thoroughly with hon. members from down by the sea, and I am informed that many fishermen in the maritime provinces prefer to ship their fish to Boston and Portland and that the good people of Montreal are reimporting that fish from Boston and Portland. The reason of this is that the Intercolonial Railway is not thoroughly equipped with modern transportation facilities according to the German system by which live fish can be transported from the sea to the market. I beg to dissent from the statement of the hon. minister that proper transportation facilities are provided for fish dealers in Montreal. That is not so. I was a passenger on a train coming from Nova Scotia to Montreal last summer. There were three or four parties in the three or four cars attached to the engine. When the express reached Metapedia three or four fishermen were on hand prepared to ship their fish, but the good employees of the Intercolonial Railway said : it will delay the train too much ; we have not time to load the fish, whereupon the train started for Montreal at full speed. If you wish to secure the fish trade, proper transportation facilities must be provided on the Intercolonial Railway trains and the Intercolonial Railway employees must be courteous and obliging to the shippers. This is the only way in which we can secure a profitable trade for our Railway. I am bringing these facts to the attention of the chief official of the Railway Department. .We want proper transportation facilities according to the modern type, according to the German type.

Topic:   SUPPLY-INTERCOLONIAL RAILWAY, ANNUAL STATEMENT.
Subtopic:   JL 1 CUIAIUBH.
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LIB

Alexander Johnston

Liberal

Mr. A. JOHNSTON.

Before the item is finally disposed of, I might say, in regard to some of the matters to which the attention of the committee has been directed by my hon. friend from St. James, Montreal (Mr. Gervais), that in so far as I am aware, and I think I have a knowledge of the facts, the fishermen of the maritime provinces are fairly well satisfied with the transportation

Topic:   SUPPLY-INTERCOLONIAL RAILWAY, ANNUAL STATEMENT.
Subtopic:   JL 1 CUIAIUBH.
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LIB

Henry Robert Emmerson (Minister of Railways and Canals)

Liberal

Mr. EMMERSON.

facilities afforded them in recent years on the Intercolonial Railway.

Topic:   SUPPLY-INTERCOLONIAL RAILWAY, ANNUAL STATEMENT.
Subtopic:   JL 1 CUIAIUBH.
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LIB

Honoré Hippolyte Achille Gervais

Liberal

Mr. GERVAIS.

We are not in Montreal.

Topic:   SUPPLY-INTERCOLONIAL RAILWAY, ANNUAL STATEMENT.
Subtopic:   JL 1 CUIAIUBH.
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LIB

Alexander Johnston

Liberal

Mr. A. JOHNSTON.

That is the fault of the people of Montreal. The statement which my hon. friend makes that the people of the maritime provinces are shipping their fish to Boston and from thence to Montreal I do not think will be borne out by the facts. Their fish to-day is carried from the maritime provinces to the markets of Montreal and various other Canadian markets. I' think if my hon. friend would consult the returns of the Intercolonial Railway he "would find that the traffic in fresh fish in recent years from Port Mulgrave on the Intercolonial Railway is very large indeed. He will find that no fresh fish from that portion of the maritime provinces goes anywhere else than over the Intercolonial Railway to Montreal and various other Canadian cities. I say this because I have heard on several occasions during recent years, men engaged in this fish trade expressing themselves as reasonably satisfied with the transportation facilities afforded by the Intercolonial Railway. I do not assume that the Intercolonial Railway is finished in this respect. I believe it is improving every year, and I have no doubt whatever that the purpose of the Intercolonial Railway is to still further perfect the transportation facilities for carrying fresh fish from the maritime provinces to the markets in Montreal and to the American markets. That is the position so far as I understand it among the fishermen in the maritime provinces.

M. GERVAIS. I would like to ask the hon. member for Cape Breton (Mr. Alex. Johnston how he can explain the fact that the good people of Montreal are paying large sums per week for express charge to the Grand Trunk Railway Company for the transportation of fresh fish from Boston or Portland ? I would also ask him to explain why our fish dealers in Montreal are paying over $25,000 per week for American fish caught on the shores of Maine or Massachusetts. I would like the hon. member to explain these two facts, to explain why the good people of Montreal should have their fish supplied from the United States when they could obtain such a splendid supply from our sister provinces down by the sea.

Topic:   SUPPLY-INTERCOLONIAL RAILWAY, ANNUAL STATEMENT.
Subtopic:   JL 1 CUIAIUBH.
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LIB

Alexander Johnston

Liberal

Mr. A. JOHNSTON.

These two facts which my hon. friend (Mr. Gervais) has mentioned are susceptible of explanation. The people of the maritime provinces are selling all the fish they can catch at the present time and I assume they are selling where they are getting the best price. The Montreal dealers, I presume are importing fresh fish from Boston because they cannot get it anywhere else. My hon. friend will not suggest that the good people of Montreal should be deprived of the privilege of

having fresh fish. If they cannot get it in the maritime provinces I take it they are going to get it somewhere.

Double tracking parts of line, $100,000.

' Mr. KEMP. Where is this double tracking?

Topic:   SUPPLY-INTERCOLONIAL RAILWAY, ANNUAL STATEMENT.
Subtopic:   JL 1 CUIAIUBH.
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LIB

Henry Robert Emmerson (Minister of Railways and Canals)

Liberal

Mr. EMMERSON.

This double tracking is being done coming out of Halifax, out to Windsor Junction where the D.A.R. branches off and also between Stellarton and New Glasgow.

Topic:   SUPPLY-INTERCOLONIAL RAILWAY, ANNUAL STATEMENT.
Subtopic:   JL 1 CUIAIUBH.
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CON

Thomas Simpson Sproule

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. SPROULE.

There are some of these items that I know some members who are absent wish to discuss. We have made a pretty good run and I think we should stop here.

Some resolutions reported.

Hon. Mr. FIELDING moved the adjournment of the House.

Topic:   SUPPLY-INTERCOLONIAL RAILWAY, ANNUAL STATEMENT.
Subtopic:   JL 1 CUIAIUBH.
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CON

Thomas Simpson Sproule

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. SPROULE.

Would the bon. minister inform us what work will be taken up tomorrow ?

Topic:   SUPPLY-INTERCOLONIAL RAILWAY, ANNUAL STATEMENT.
Subtopic:   JL 1 CUIAIUBH.
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LIB

William Stevens Fielding (Minister of Finance and Receiver General)

Liberal

Mr. FIELDING.

There is a Bill stand ing in the name of the Minister of Marine and Fisheries which I think it was understood would come up to-morrow. If that does not come up or if it is not ready we will go into supply and the Minister of Railways Will continue with his estimates.

Topic:   SUPPLY-INTERCOLONIAL RAILWAY, ANNUAL STATEMENT.
Subtopic:   JL 1 CUIAIUBH.
Permalink

Motion agreed to, and House adjourned at 11.40 p.in.



Thuksday, March 2, 1905.


March 1, 1905