May 14, 1902


Motion agreed to, and House went into Committee of Ways and Means.


?

The MINISTER OF FINANCE.

In the budget speech I stated that we proposed to extend the time for the free admission of

machinery for the manufacture of beet root sugar, and I gave notice of the following motion:

Resolved, That It is expedient that the provisions of chapter 22 of the Acts of 1901, respecting the free admission of machinery and, structural iron and steel for use In the construction of factories for the manufacture of sugar from beet root, be extended until the 1st day of April, 1903.

I now beg to move that this resolution be agreed to.

Topic:   WAYS AND MEANS-AID TO RAILWAYS.
Permalink
CON

Thomas Simpson Sproule

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. SPROULE.

If the minister extended the time for more than one year it would be proper for him to do so. He will undoubtedly have to extend the time next year if he desires the advantage to apply to those [DOT]who are building or contemplating building beet sugar factories.

Topic:   WAYS AND MEANS-AID TO RAILWAYS.
Permalink
?

The MINISTER OF FINANCE.

I have had no representations made to me that a further extension would be necessary. If the matter comes up again it will be considered on its merits, but I do not think that it is wise at this moment to extend the time further in view of the resolution, notice of which has been given.

Topic:   WAYS AND MEANS-AID TO RAILWAYS.
Permalink
CON

Thomas Simpson Sproule

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. SPROULE.

I doubt if the companies will be able to get in their machinery within the time fixed in the resolution.

Topic:   WAYS AND MEANS-AID TO RAILWAYS.
Permalink
CON

John Graham Haggart

Conservative (1867-1942)

Hon. Mr. HAGGART.

Has the Minister of Finance power to remit that duty without a resolution ?

Topic:   WAYS AND MEANS-AID TO RAILWAYS.
Permalink
?

The MINISTER OF FINANCE.

That may be debatable, but the more of these things we do by resolution of the House and the fewer of them we do by executive act the better. It is always better to have these things fixed in the tariff and then the public at large understand them and not a particular individual. The next motion is this. The Minister of Militia has made a contract for the manufacture of the Ross rifle in Canada, and one of the conditions of the agreement was that the company should have the right to import the machinery and parts of their rifles free of duty. Instead of leaving that to be expressed in the contract only as applied to that particular company, it was thought better that, for the same reason I gave * moment ago, it should be set forth in the tariff, so that if it should happen that any other company should at any time make arrangements with us of a similar character, this item would stand in the tariff free to all. Practically it only applies at present to the Ross Rifle Company, because that is the only company with whom the government have this contract, but instead of leaving it to be expressed in the contract itself, we thought it better to put these items on the free list as applying to all persons with whom similar arrangements might be made.

Topic:   WAYS AND MEANS-AID TO RAILWAYS.
Permalink
CON

John Graham Haggart

Conservative (1867-1942)

Hon. Mr. HAGGART.

Does the hon. gentleman mean the parts of the rifle which are

to be taken over by the Dominion government, or the rifles manufactured ?

Topic:   WAYS AND MEANS-AID TO RAILWAYS.
Permalink
?

The MINISTER OF FINANCE.

The aim of the government was to have these rifles manufactured in Canada, but it was remembered that the machinery would have to be imported, and there is practically no harm in admitting that free. If we made them pay duty we would have to put up the price. As respects the other part of the resolution, certain parts of the rifles, it is claimed, cannot be conveniently made in Canada, and these parts may be imported. That is the substance of the resolution.

Topic:   WAYS AND MEANS-AID TO RAILWAYS.
Permalink
CON

John Graham Haggart

Conservative (1867-1942)

Hon. Mr. HAGGART.

But this rifle company manufactures rifles not only for the government but for sale. They have a contract for the manufacture of a certain portion of them for the government. What I want to know is whether the parts of the rifle which are imported into the country and not used by the.government, come in free to be sold ?

Topic:   WAYS AND MEANS-AID TO RAILWAYS.
Permalink
?

The MINISTER OF FINANCE.

Not under this regulation. It only applies to work they do for the government. The machinery, of course, which makes the rifle for the government of Canada may also make 'a rifle for somebody else. To that extent the machinery would apply to all. I think the clause (a) makes it clear that it is only for the manufacture of rifles for the government of Canada.

Topic:   WAYS AND MEANS-AID TO RAILWAYS.
Permalink
CON

Frederick Debartzch Monk

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. MONK.

How does the minister think it possible to prevent the manufacture of rifles generally for the public ?

Topic:   WAYS AND MEANS-AID TO RAILWAYS.
Permalink
?

The MINISTER OF FINANCE.

We do not want to do that.

Topic:   WAYS AND MEANS-AID TO RAILWAYS.
Permalink
CON

Frederick Debartzch Monk

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. MONK.

Will it be possible to limit it to the manufacture of rifles for the use of the government ?

Topic:   WAYS AND MEANS-AID TO RAILWAYS.
Permalink
?

The MINISTER OF FINANCE.

We do not propose to limit the factory to the manufacture of rifles for the use of the government. They may do it for anybody in the world ; but they cannot have these admissions free of duty except for the use of the government.

Topic:   WAYS AND MEANS-AID TO RAILWAYS.
Permalink
CON

Frederick Debartzch Monk

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. MONK.

How will you guard against such a thing happening ? If they choose to import the material in the rough for the rifles which they will sell) to the public at large, how can you prevent it ?

Topic:   WAYS AND MEANS-AID TO RAILWAYS.
Permalink
?

The MINISTER OF FINANCE.

That is to be left to the inspection and regulation of the Customs Department. The same question my hon. friend puts might arise in connection with some other items where the article is admitted at one rate of duty for the purpose of being manufactured, and at a different rate of duty when it enters into general consumption. It is a form of legislation that has been in our tariff for a long time, and practically it works out very well.

Topic:   WAYS AND MEANS-AID TO RAILWAYS.
Permalink
CON

Thomas Simpson Sproule

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. SPROULE.

I am inclined to think they should bring in their raw material free in any event. But where the government give a consideration that is not extended to any other factory, for the purpose of supplying the government's need, there would of necessity require to be some arrangement whereby the company would not take advantage of that clause and apply it to the general public. How would the government regulate It so that they could not use the same parts of a rifle for general manufacture ?

Topic:   WAYS AND MEANS-AID TO RAILWAYS.
Permalink
?

The MINISTER OP FINANCE.

I admit that it requires very careful observation by the Customs Department. We have the same question arising in other branches of business, but in practice I understand the department manages it very well. I' think it is regrettable that we have to have these distinctions in the tariff, but experience has shown that the Customs Department can watch them and guard against any abuse.

Topic:   WAYS AND MEANS-AID TO RAILWAYS.
Permalink
CON

John Graham Haggart

Conservative (1867-1942)

Hon. Mr. HAGGART.

I would much rather see the whole rifle manufactured in Canada. Under the resolution which the minister proposes they can simply assemble the different parts of the rifle when they come into the country. I think that a provision ought to be made so that the whole of these parts except, perhaps the forgings, or something of that kind, in the rough, might be obtained from other countries ; -but the whole material that enters into the rifle ought to be manufactured in the country.

Topic:   WAYS AND MEANS-AID TO RAILWAYS.
Permalink

May 14, 1902