That is a matter in connection with which there is a very great difference of opinion.
I have given a good deal of personal attention to the question and my own conclusion, reached about a year ago after con-
suiting with men of experience, is : That
the money we spend for boarding schools is the most effective, and that we are-getting better results from it than the money we spend for industrial schools. It is the general conclusion of all familiar with Indian education that the ordinary day school is very ineffective, and that wherever a boarding school can be substituted for a day school it is desirable to do so. It is a little more expensive but the work is far more effective. The reason is that when the Indian child comes from the wigwam to school the influences centered upon the child at school are generally effaced by the home associations of the child. The boarding school is 1 think the best. It is not any more effective in regard to each pupil than is the industrial school, but the latter is much more expensive and in my judgment we get better value for our money than in the case of the former. When I took charge I found that the principals of the industrial schools kept the pupils for a length of time which seemed to me to be unreasonable, and I had to issue an order which resulted in a considerable number of pupils being discharged; they having been kept there as long as the state could be expected to keep them. The principals of the schools feared what would happen to the pupils if they left the schools, and of course that was some reflection upon the operation of the system. If a pupil spent five or six years in an industrial school at a cost to the state of $2,000 or $3,000, it was a poor commentary on the system if the pupil had to be kept in school after that for protection. One of the difficulties we have to face is to determine what shall be done with the pupils after they leave the industrial schools. They have then become so far removed from the ordinary Indian that they ought to be in a position to get along as well as an ordinary white man. But experience shows that in very few cases is the Indian boy or girl capable of taking care of himself or herself in contact with the white race. My own view is that the same amount of money spent on a boy or girl in a boarding school would result in training a very much larger number, and would have a better general effect in elevating the whole Indian race. I dealt with this matter at some length in the House a few years ago, and there was considerable discussion on the subject. I said then that while I was inclined to form that opinion I was not sufficiently clear on the subject to condemn an institution which had been founded before I took office, and I had not arrived at the conclusion that they were not doing sufficiently satisfactory work to warrant a radical change in the whole organization. With one exception there has been no industrial institution founded within the last four years. That exception is in British Columbia, where a church society offered to put up the building and incur all the preliminary expenses.
Mr. SPItOULE. That corroborates the information I have had, namely, that the industrial schools are comparatively a failure, and that the money spent in that direction is almost thrown away, because unless the Indians are kept under control after they leave the school they relapse into a condition little better than before they went to school. If these schools are not giving moderately good results the question arises as to what we should do. We have had them long enough on trial to enable us to determine whether they are a success or a failure, and it is important that the Indian Department should consider as to whether it would not be better to change the system.
Mr. CLANCY. Have the supplies forthe Indian Department been bought by
The MINISTEli OF THE INTERIOR.